Ukraine- the situation is VERY serious

Trump lied when he said Zelensky had "4% rating". Last figures from Kiev were 57%.

To get really accurate information either the Guardian or BBC time line gives a lot of detail.

Can anyone explain Trump

'“I hear that they’re upset about not having a seat. Well, they’ve had a seat for three years and a long time before that, this could have been settled very easily,” he said.

“Just a half-baked negotiator could have settled this years ago without the loss of much land, very little land, without the loss of any lives, and without the loss of cities that are just laying on their sides.”

Settled how? By Ukraine backing down straightaway when Kiev was invaded?

Well as a half-baked negotiator let's see how well Trump does.

Pnut today’s take on yesterday’s events:

“Leaders from Russia and the U.S. met yesterday during a closed-door meeting in Riyadh. After the doors re-opened, the two countries – rivals since the end of World War II – showed the world a rare display of unity… at the cost of Ukraine’s ability to decide its own fate. Following the much-anticipated summit yesterday, Moscow and Washington announced plans to collaborate on three goals, which will lower tensions between the two powers.

First, the Trump and Putin administrations will act to restore operations at their respective embassies in Washington and Moscow. Second, the pair will establish a top-level diplomatic team to negotiate an end to the war in Ukraine (without the input of Kyiv). Third, they promised to continue negotiations to establish closer diplomatic and economic ties with each other.

While the White House and the Kremlin seemed happy with the results of the meeting, other parties were less enthused. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said his country would not accept a peace deal negotiated “behind Ukraine’s back.” European leaders were also incensed after the U.S. relegated them to the kiddie table, and American liberals are similarly angry as they prepare to watch the Trump administration dump all their efforts on Ukraine down the drain.”

Trump has blamed Zelensky for starting the war.
What planet is he on?
It’s pretty obvious where his loyalties lie, so much for a neutral mediator.

I find this liaison between Trump and Putin worrying. Trump seems to believe the lies from Putin.
Trump wants 50% of Ukraine's rare minerals for continuing to give them aid. Zelensky has said he will not allow this.

So America and Russia, those once deadly enemies, have overnight become best buddies. I listened to the clip that Claremont posted and motor mouth Trump's reluctance to say what he is talking to Putin about is quite alarming because it is so out of character. Instead of boasting about his talks with Putin he seemed to be almost scared when the question was asked. Has he just cottoned on to the fact that Putin is not an honourable man?

There are 2 choices

Escalate the war which is going to cost £hundreds of billions and tens of thousands of lives and risk a nuclear strike.

OR

End it now and get the best deal we can.

Every war has a winner and a looser unlike many on GN I don’t relish a full scale war with Russia, Napoleon and Hitler tried that. Better to accept defeat and put the effort into helping rebuild.

Of course nobody relishes a full scale war - hyperbole!!

But Ukraine must have representation at the peace talks. It is clear that Trump and Putin are intent on carving it out to the best advantage to their own self and country.

Sod the Ukrainians.

That is disgusting.

David49

There is no doubt Zelensky will go, as a wartime leader he has been steadfast but he is not going to lead Ukraine after the war stops.
Elections are some way off get the peace deal agreed first, it seems the US and Russia has agreed a road map to peace, its going to involve a lot more interests than just Ukraine, a lot more negotiating to do yet.

It is a war that shouldn’t have happened

“Just a half-baked negotiator could have settled this years ago without the loss of much land, very little land, without the loss of any lives, and without the loss of cities that are just laying on their sides.”

So, are we to assume that you agreed with what Trump said last night? That Ukraine started the conflict?

Crikey.

Trump and Putin plan to install a puppet leader in Ukraine...

It is disgusting and it won't be an end to it.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

The US and Russia carving up Ukraine between them. If this doesn’t convince the Europeans they have to boost defence spending to 5% I don’t know what will. Welfare and woke obsessed European countries and Institutions like the EU really do look like the Emperor with no clothes.

Please stop using this frightening situation to air your petty grievances against 'welfare and woke', or to yet again bash the EU. Or is it because, as someone who wanted us out of the EU you are now realising the error? You are trivialising a very serious subject.

Whitewavemark2

Of course nobody relishes a full scale war - hyperbole!!

But Ukraine must have representation at the peace talks. It is clear that Trump and Putin are intent on carving it out to the best advantage to their own self and country.

Sod the Ukrainians.

That is disgusting.

Europe could refuse to accept the deal and back Ukraine to fight on without the US, my guess is they won’t, Starmer was very careful to restrict UK troops to a peacekeeping role no combat. Maybe other nations want to tangle with Russia we will see.

Putin is far smarter than Trump (low bar), and is manipulating the greedy fool with some kind of promise of a share of the bounty of the Ukraine minerals. Presumably there is also some kind of deal where frozen Russian funds are released too, I understand the Russian economy is in a bit of a mess with the cost of the conflict amongst other things.

Now, I can stomach a lot of things if it means an end to conflict and death, the Good Friday Agreement springs to mind, but to listen to that Liar standing there, rewriting history was chilling.

Frankly, anyone who isn't frightened, isn't listening.

Frankly, anyone who isn't frightened, isn't listening.

I totally agree. This Trump/Putin partnership will not have a good outcome for Ukraine or any of us.

Whitewavemark2

Of course nobody relishes a full scale war - hyperbole!!

But Ukraine must have representation at the peace talks. It is clear that Trump and Putin are intent on carving it out to the best advantage to their own self and country.

Sod the Ukrainians.

That is disgusting.

I agree.

HousePlantQueen

Putin is far smarter than Trump (low bar), and is manipulating the greedy fool with some kind of promise of a share of the bounty of the Ukraine minerals. Presumably there is also some kind of deal where frozen Russian funds are released too, I understand the Russian economy is in a bit of a mess with the cost of the conflict amongst other things.

Now, I can stomach a lot of things if it means an end to conflict and death, the Good Friday Agreement springs to mind, but to listen to that Liar standing there, rewriting history was chilling.

Frankly, anyone who isn't frightened, isn't listening.

I agree. Sad and scary times.

Parsley3

^Frankly, anyone who isn't frightened, isn't listening.^

I totally agree. This Trump/Putin partnership will not have a good outcome for Ukraine or any of us.

Yes

Honestly, those of you here who appear to agree with Trump and Putin need to give your heads a wobble! Likewise anyone using this group to yet again slate the EU and “the wokes” (yawn)

It’s all so disrespectful and frankly hypocritical.

Good job our forebears didn’t take this attitude during WW2!

David49

There are 2 choices

Escalate the war which is going to cost £hundreds of billions and tens of thousands of lives and risk a nuclear strike.

OR

End it now and get the best deal we can.

Every war has a winner and a looser unlike many on GN I don’t relish a full scale war with Russia, Napoleon and Hitler tried that. Better to accept defeat and put the effort into helping rebuild.

If Putin came for the UK or any other county how much land would you give him to try to appease him David?

Cossy

Honestly, those of you here who appear to agree with Trump and Putin need to give your heads a wobble! Likewise anyone using this group to yet again slate the EU and “the wokes” (yawn)

It’s all so disrespectful and frankly hypocritical.

Good job our forebears didn’t take this attitude during WW2!

Totally agree Cossy. We have a load of GBNews Quislings, so that was money well spent by the Russian disinformation machine. By now it's obvious that Trump is Putin's poodle, his culture wars was straight out of the KGB/GRU playbook to destabilise foreign powers.

Someone like Trump who cannot engage his brain before he speaks should be nowhere near negotiations of any sort.
Time and time again he proves that he does not have a grasp of the situation. For this reason he is a real danger to the world.

Well - I listened to radio 5’s clip of Trump’s statement. He is setting out the Russian position and his support for it.
His “fake news’ cries have led us to the position where the Potus can lie with impunity and talk absolute distorted nonsense

David49, no posters who aren’t fall in in and accepting Trump’s Russian Truth is nit looking to go to war with Russia. We went a peaceful solution. That won’t be achieved by Trump and his buddy getting a solution that only suits Russia.

Anyone who isn’t scared by Trump’s behaviour on this and other important stuff, isn’t looking at all the facts

We can compare with the situation in 1940 when Hitler threatened to invade, the RAF retained air superiority and the threat ended. The UK was producing most of its own weapons at that time, despite the losses at Dunkirk we won the Battle of Britain. As we know France and the Low Countries submitted quickly.
That is a big difference to fighting for 3 yrs the enemy is established and it has become a war of attrition, escalating the war to take the land back against a determined enemy will be very costly