This statistic is verging on the unbelievable....but it is not.

Barleyfields

My apologies.

I agree there are some people who need to to do more to manage their mental health conditions, however not everyone is made of the same stern stuff as you.

Doodledog

^If people are unable to work because of illness, mental or physical, then of course they should be supported; but that support can sometimes take the form of help to work, not help to stay at home.

Very important. That was the support one DD had, though she was desperate to be well enough to go back to work. It’s a doubly hard job to help those who don’t think they can work, or have got accustomed to life without work.

Obviously if someone has a long-term condition they shouldn't be subjected to repeated requests for information when they are not going to get better . . .

I have watched that happen.

. . . but those suffering from anxiety, for instance, could reasonably be expected to find ways to deal with it so that they can work. This should be backed up with proper help from professionals, who should be part of the package. I don't think that is unreasonable at all.

Cossy
I completely agree.

I completely agree too.

Much research shows paid work is good for some people who are managing their mental health conditions with support, therapy and/or medication.

Some people who attend a local group for people with MH or physical issues actually volunteer for roles within the centre, setting up, clearing away, running groups where they can use their skills or even applying for training to enable them to work in the centre’s kitchen. Those I spoke to said things like it gave them “something to get up for”.

I know someone with serious health issues that will not resolve, and she is expected to fill in the same forms repeatedly to get PIP. It's cruel and pointless.

The system does need a shake-up though, and it is far better to wait and see how it is shaken up before leaping to conclusions and complaints. There are various causes in play - Covid and telephone appointments, systemic problems that mean employers can pay people too little and the system pick up the slack, possible over-medicalising of MH issues, physical illness such as Long Covid and who knows what else. Maybe there is also more of a sense of entitlement to benefits and a non-contributory life than there used to be?

Pretending that it's ok to have large numbers of 'economically inactive' people and at the same time complaining about benefits such as the WFA being cut makes no sense, though.

Whitewavemark2

I wonder how many gNers are children of “foreigners”? I wonder if their family benefited from education, NHS, welfare services, library services, police services, etc etc. and without having paid a single penny in tax prior to their arrival?

Guilty as charged. In our defence my parents worked and paid taxes and national insurance for many years as did all three of their children.

Cossy

Barleyfields

My apologies.

I agree there are some people who need to to do more to manage their mental health conditions, however not everyone is made of the same stern stuff as you.

Thanks but no apology needed, you weren’t to know! 😊

I wonder how many people battled on with mental health conditions in the past. If they had been able to take some time off to recover and get help they would have made a full recovery or at least have had better health for the rest of their life.

My husband's grandfather took his own life when he had to work on through the mental illness caused by fighting in the first world war. Now, in kinder times I hope he could have relied on benefits for a while, medication perhaps and found some therapy which might have saved him (and the terrible impact on his family).

Working through it isn't always the answer.

karmalady

benefits are claimed by over one million foreigners, who have not put any money into the system. 13 billion pounds to people born overseas

Please give evidence for this claim based on a reputable source. otherwise I will be inclined to assume that there is no eveidence and it is only hearsay,

I suspect your husband’s grandfather suffered from what we now call PTSD Churchview. He would have had terrible experiences and seen unimaginable horrors which he couldn’t forget. Today he would have been offered treatment, but we know from the numbers of ex-servicemen who are homeless and dependent on alcohol and drugs that possibly nothing can blot out what they have seen. My husband’s grandfather suffered from shell shock in WW1 which affected him badly for the rest of his life.

We have plenty of white British born people not pulling their weight in this country!

That's true, so we don't need any more coming in and adding to the problem.

Please give evidence for this claim based on a reputable source. otherwise I will be inclined to assume that there is no eveidence and it is only hearsay,

BBC acceptable M0nica? This is from 2019 and so probably higher 6 years later.

"In 2019, data showed that over one million foreign nationals were claiming working-age benefits in the UK, with 610,000 non-EU nationals and 380,000 EU nationals making claims, an increase of 9% from the previous year.
Here's a more detailed breakdown:
Data Source: The analysis is based on Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) data from 2019.
Total Claimants: The figures show that 990,000 foreign nationals were claiming working-age benefits.
Breakdown by Nationality:
610,000 were non-EU nationals.
380,000 were EU nationals.
Increase: This represented a 9% increase from the previous year.
Spending on Universal Credit: Over £7.5 billion was spent on Universal Credit for foreign nationals.".

OhOhOh

^Please give evidence for this claim based on a reputable source. otherwise I will be inclined to assume that there is no eveidence and it is only hearsay,^

BBC acceptable M0nica? This is from 2019 and so probably higher 6 years later.

"In 2019, data showed that over one million foreign nationals were claiming working-age benefits in the UK, with 610,000 non-EU nationals and 380,000 EU nationals making claims, an increase of 9% from the previous year.
Here's a more detailed breakdown:
Data Source: The analysis is based on Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) data from 2019.
Total Claimants: The figures show that 990,000 foreign nationals were claiming working-age benefits.
Breakdown by Nationality:
610,000 were non-EU nationals.
380,000 were EU nationals.
Increase: This represented a 9% increase from the previous year.
Spending on Universal Credit: Over £7.5 billion was spent on Universal Credit for foreign nationals.".

That doesn't say they haven't put any money into the system. My husband was born overseas, came here as a baby and started work at 18 after A levels. Probably lots are the same.

That doesn't say they haven't put any money into the system.

Why would it? I simply provided the data, from a reputable source, regarding the stats for immigrants claiming benefits. I'm sure data is available for scenarios such as you describe; feel free to post it here.

I agree with what Doodledog has said. Those that are able should be encouraged to get back to work. Of course people with severe medical conditions are entitled to benefits.

OhOhOh

^That doesn't say they haven't put any money into the system.^

Why would it? I simply provided the data, from a reputable source, regarding the stats for immigrants claiming benefits. I'm sure data is available for scenarios such as you describe; feel free to post it here.

MOnica was asking for data about the claim that those people born overseas hadn't paid any money into the system. Your data doesn't answer her question.

OhOhOh
990,000 foreign nationals claiming in work benefits
That’s because they are on a low wage. Which means that we, the tax payer are subsidising the company owners.
Take a hospital porters wage £26,000 per year.
Average wage in the uk Feb 2025 £36,000.

Scroungers faking depression. Foreign people getting our money.

For God's Sake, ( as they used to say) change the record.

The government sit around a table to discuss how to get more money in. We know! We will say the more you work and earn, the more we will take off you. There, sorted! Absolute half wits!!!!

How would you get more money in, love0c? Continue to pay out to those who don’t work? That’s not going to help, is it? Those who do work are carrying those who don’t. That has always been the case, but we now have an aging society and not enough workers to keep that system going. Things have to change, and it’s either a case of taxing workers even more, or spreading the load so everyone capable pulls their weight.

Do you mean spread the load to people who don't claim benefits but don't work either Doodledog.

I know a lot of people who have just enough savings and/or lead frugal lives in order to not work. Many have already worked decades and paid tax. They've now stepped back to lead a quiet life having become disenchanted with being a cog in a wheel.

How do you get people who don't need money to work?

Doodledog By encouraging people to work! Not discouraging them to work!

This is precisely why socialism does not work!

We do have to sift out the hangers-on from the genuinely incapacitated. A face-to-face meeting with an experienced social worker or similar would work best.

Just because you are disabled doesn’t mean you cannot work. I had a colleague who was quadriplegic,(a diving accident at age 17) just a tiny moment in two fingers. He worked full time with support.

Mental health issues are made worse if you are stuck at home with little contact with the outside world, family, friends, neighbours, etc,.

There are plenty who simply don’t want to work and are playing the mental health ticket. But they are taking money from those with genuine disabilities, mental and physical.

I know I’ll probably get jumped on for saying so but not by those who have real incapacities and need the funding.

Barleyfields

We have a generation of snowflakes who believe their fragile mental health will be adversely affected by work. What would have happened to us if they were the people called up for the world wars?

Agree. I have suffered from depression for years and have found that work helped me deal with it. I do accept that some people just cannot cope but many just need to pull themselves together.

"Mental health issues are made worse if you are stuck at home with little contact with the outside world, family, friends, neighbours, etc,."

Posters keep saying this sort of thing with no qualification or explanation at all.

Not all mental health issues are the same or to the same degree.
People react in different ways to mental health issues.
People need different treatments and solutions.
Some mental health problems might be alleviated by removing from society for a bit.

Some level of isolation (peace and quiet) might be good for people with some mental health conditions.

Contact with the outside world does not necessarily mean work.

Some people with mental health conditions can step out of work and normal life for a short term and make a full recovery or at least get on an even keel whereby they can step back in and contribute in the work place.

Churchview

"Mental health issues are made worse if you are stuck at home with little contact with the outside world, family, friends, neighbours, etc,."

Posters keep saying this sort of thing with no qualification or explanation at all.

Not all mental health issues are the same or to the same degree.
People react in different ways to mental health issues.
People need different treatments and solutions.
Some mental health problems might be alleviated by removing from society for a bit.

Some level of isolation (peace and quiet) might be good for people with some mental health conditions.

Contact with the outside world does not necessarily mean work.

Some people with mental health conditions can step out of work and normal life for a short term and make a full recovery or at least get on an even keel whereby they can step back in and contribute in the work place.

Actually I do have qualifications to put forward that opinion and it is backed by research. And it’s all out there if you choose to look.

As for the rest of your post … it sounds like ‘mansplaining’ the obvious. We know that.