Israel/Gaza War - Hundreds of Israeli ex-officials appeal to Trump to help end Gaza war

Israel doesn’t have the monopoly on feeling victimised and aggrieved and I think is a deeply entrenched belief in many Israelis that they are victims even when they are victimising others.
I agree, the ?unique thing about Israelis is that they seem able to persuade onlookers to share this viewpoint even when they are victimising others.

Do we have to be so far apart. No we don't. Ordinary people are mostly happy to live alongside people who are different from them. It's governments who cause the problems in my view. Most people don't want wars.
My dad was in charge of some Italian prisoners in the war and they became friends and these young men wondered why they had to kill each other.

Anniebach

If understanding more Palestinians would join Hamas as retribution why such criticism of Israel for protecting their people , protection not retribution

But Israel are sowing the seeds of future retribution Annie. Nothing ever happens in a vacuum there is always context but you refuse to look at the context.

If understanding more Palestinians would join Hamas as retribution why such criticism of Israel for protecting their people , protection not retribution

Here is are Hebrews from Israel, and Christians from Eritrea, singing and dancing in worship

www.youtube.com/watch?v=7grxHu5wSg0&list=RD7grxHu5wSg0&start_radio=1

www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS8Bd0hoogo&list=RDwS8Bd0hoogo&start_radio=1

Or the Islamic dancing ? Not generally mixed)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xEW0xe7MCA

Do we have to be so far apart?

Eloethan

So you think bombing Gaza into the ground, killing at least 65,000 people (mostly civilians), maiming and starving thousands of men, women and children and herding them from one bomb site to another will ensure peace for Israel and other nations?

If your land and homes had been taken from you and you had thenceforth been living in a state of second class citizenship with unequal and inadequate access to food, water and other amenities, would you not be frustrated and angry?

Now that the children and young people have experienced the most terrible scenes of carnage and destruction, their families being torn apart, their homes and hospitals reduced to rubble and those that remain being terrorised and herded from one bomb site to another, do you think they will forgive and forget? Would you?

This is the problem. On the one side those in support of Netanyahu cite the fact they are doing what they are doing because of all the innocents lost on the Oct 7th attack and the taking of hostages. Feelings of a need for retribution run deep with many Israelis
But if they feel like that how do they imagine Palestinians feel after seeing their families blown to bits and every building blasted into dust. And btw they don’t see Hamas doing this they see the IDF doing it.
How deep do we suppose feelings of a need for retribution run with many Palestinians?
Just as Israelis want a safe and secure homeland for their people, Palestinians do too.
Israel doesn’t have the monopoly on feeling victimised and aggrieved and I think is a deeply entrenched belief in many Israelis that they are victims even when they are victimising others.

So you think bombing Gaza into the ground, killing at least 65,000 people (mostly civilians), maiming and starving thousands of men, women and children and herding them from one bomb site to another will ensure peace for Israel and other nations?

If your land and homes had been taken from you and you had thenceforth been living in a state of second class citizenship with unequal and inadequate access to food, water and other amenities, would you not be frustrated and angry?

Now that the children and young people have experienced the most terrible scenes of carnage and destruction, their families being torn apart, their homes and hospitals reduced to rubble and those that remain being terrorised and herded from one bomb site to another, do you think they will forgive and forget? Would you?

Telegraph headline,

'Britain bans Israelis from prestigious military academy because Israel's actions in Gaza are 'wrong' and its personnel will be excluded from Royal College of Defence Studies'

Netanyanu's choices making Israel less safe.

Israel isn’t the only nation that doesn’t feel safe Annie. There are many other parts of the world where populations feel constantly under threat. And many of these nations do not have the kind of fu ding or defences that Israel has.

And Netanyahu's genocide is making it even more unsafe.

AGAA4 Sun 14-Sept-25 15:02:11
Israel will carry on with it's aim of clearing Gaza. Palestinians are being herded into increasingly smaller spaces.
The bombing of Qatar shows how ruthless they are.
They think that they can eliminate groups like Hamas but they never will. Israel will never be safe now.

Israel is the sole Jewish State,Jews have never been allowed to be/feel
safe, 1948 Israel sole Jewish State, 1948, 5 Arab countries declare war on Israel 1948

I repeat what I posted above, Netanyahu is the stumbling block. Those hostages were taken by Hamas, yes, we all know that. Nobody is disputing that fact.
As leader of his country, it was Netanyahu's job to get them back. He has failed, and continues to do so. Wrong decision after wrong decision.

I really don’t think that Netanyahu’s plan is even to get rid of Hamas anymore, they know that most if not all military commanders are dead and those left are not as viable a threat. They are intent upon flattening Gaza and herding all Palestinians into overcrowded camps in the South ringed by the IDF.
This is no secret, it has been made clear what Netanyahu and his cronies intend to do.
Then presumably the main part of Gaza will be developed by Israel and the US for Israeli settlers or - in Trumps case - turned into a vegas style holiday resort.

Israel will carry on with it's aim of clearing Gaza. Palestinians are being herded into increasingly smaller spaces.
The bombing of Qatar shows how ruthless they are.
They think that they can eliminate groups like Hamas but they never will. Israel will never be safe now.

foxie48

Past history has shown that Israel usually negotiates the release of hostages. I don't know what was in the minds of Hamas leaders when they went into Israel on 7/10 but I doubt they expected their actions to result in the death and destruction that Gazans have been subjected to. I can't see an end to it unless Trump stops providing military aid to Israel. What I fear is that the legacy will be a continuation of hostilities and the work that Trump did in putting together the Abraham Accords (some credit has to be given to him !) will be completely shattered for ever, leaving the Middle East in an even worse mess than it was.

Most first world countries try to negotiate the release of hostages.
Bombing where the hostages are held has never seemed like a good idea before.

Past history has shown that Israel usually negotiates the release of hostages. I don't know what was in the minds of Hamas leaders when they went into Israel on 7/10 but I doubt they expected their actions to result in the death and destruction that Gazans have been subjected to. I can't see an end to it unless Trump stops providing military aid to Israel. What I fear is that the legacy will be a continuation of hostilities and the work that Trump did in putting together the Abraham Accords (some credit has to be given to him !) will be completely shattered for ever, leaving the Middle East in an even worse mess than it was.

Israel declared war on Hamas because Hamas invaded Israel, no ping pong, but fact

They were never going to sit back and just accept that hostages had been taken. Hamas knew that. They wanted war. Tragically the people harmed the most are innocent women and children . That’s the evil of war. Always was.

Depends on how you measure "fault" but Germany committed genocide and the UK didn't, Germany also invaded Poland and the UK didn't, Germany bombed Coventry and other cities in the UK, the UK retaliated and bombed German cities, Dresden was very badly damaged. I'm not entirely sure of the point you are trying to make Annie I'm very conflicted by the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, was it necessary? tbh I don't think it was but the US wanted to test the bomb and I've no doubt the UK government knew and approved. Did it bring the war to an earlier end? Probably by only a short time, Japan were already beaten but unwilling to surrender. We could continue playing this game of ping pong endlessly but the bottom line is that Israel won their war a very long time ago and IMO and that of the hostages families, could have got the hostages home by now but that would not suit Netanyahu and his far right extremist government's plans so the slaughter continues and the hostages stay as hostages.

Quote foxie48 Sun 14-Sept-25 13:53:11
Anniebach
Hamas is the sole cause of Any harm done to hostages

I agree, hostage taking is wrong, there is never any excuse for it and I completely condemn Hamas for their actions on 7/10 and for taking hostages. Netanyahu and his government are also wrong in committing genocide in Gaza. Two wrongs never make a right.

Who were at fault , Germany or UK WW2 ?

Anniebach

Hamas is the sole cause of Any harm done to hostages

I agree, hostage taking is wrong, there is never any excuse for it and I completely condemn Hamas for their actions on 7/10 and for taking hostages. Netanyahu and his government are also wrong in committing genocide in Gaza. Two wrongs never make a right.

Hamas is the sole cause of Any harm done to hostages

Maremia

BBC online headline this morning
'Netanyahu is only obstacle to bringing hostages home, families say'

Yes. Absolutely. His actions have jeopardised the safe return on hostages all along.

Last night post was withdrawn because I posted the screen shot not the clearer edited version. I chose the Times for obvious reasons - even middle right papers are now right behind action on Gaza.

Spot on headline there Maremia

BBC online headline this morning
'Netanyahu is only obstacle to bringing hostages home, families say'