Setting a precedent?

Can you explain why you highlighted 'hordes' please?

I highlighted it purely because growstuff was so dismissive of another poster using that word. It's being dismissive of people's worries, concerns, and the words that they use to describe those worries and concerns, that have led us to the situation we have today; demonstrations, protests, disenfranchised people who feel that they're being shut down and should just accept the huge changes that thousands of single males bring to their communities. Telling people that they're being "deliberately confrontational", racist, paranoid and "having a victim complex" has worked well so far to stop people raising their concerns; but it's running out of steam. I'm no Mystic Meg, but I sincerely hope that their isn't another incident of an asylum seeker found to have been involved with sexually abusing, or harming another young girl; current public feeling is a tinder box just waiting to go off. Calling them names will only inflame them more.

Thank you for replying.

I agree with your view that calling people names and dismissing their fears is dangerous, but can't help thinking that deliberately choosing vocabulary in a 'backatcha' sort of way is every bit as inflammatory. And yes, deliberately confrontational. Both 'sides' of this discussion have to be respectful of one another if any progress is to be made.

there is no revolution ahead

Wouldn’t be so sure about that.

I use the word liberals doodledog because I don't really want to use the word left anymore, I think left and right are becoming increasingly inaccurate descriptors, and contempt for the working class isn't particularly left wing I am not talking about individual posters but rather an approach from a section of society ( mainly liberal middle class) towards those who express concerns on this issue (mainly the working class).

I don't know about revolution but I am worried, I am not sure it is going to be pretty. Do people think it is all going to calm down and everyone will nod wisely 'oh I see you were right all along diversity is our strength after all'.

windmill1

Hordes, and I mean hordes, of single fighting age young men, dispersed amongst the population in HMO's?

No thanks.

They have already shown what little - if any - regard they have for women by abandoning their own kind to poverty, persecution and abuse,

AIUI, many of those "fit young men" have been chosen and funded by their family back home, to be sent at huge expense to the affluent west in the hope they are young, resilient and tough enough to make a living there, and send money back home.

Far from having cowardly "deserted" their family, they've "gone west" as pioneers; just like the early emigrants to America and Canada (who were often the poor and desperate from Europe and Britain).

Or, closer to home and in time; look at all the single migrants who came to Britain after WW2 from The Caribbean, India, Pakistan. They had left behind their families including small children, because they were the designated family member most likely to "make it" in a cold country thousands of miles from home. But often at huge cost to themselves ; lonely, resented and rejected by the new country. Their assimilation and acceptance took decades.

I don't defend any crooks and criminals among the new migrants; but we should all try to remember that sometimes the most desperate and dangerous aspects of political and economic migration actually marks out the best qualities in young people; ambition, fearless determination to risk everything for a better future; and for the family they left back home.

I can't help thinking that deliberately choosing vocabulary in a ^"backatcha"

It was meant in a very much "backatcha" kind of way; particularly because growstuff had thought her comment was so smart she accompanied it with a laughing emoji. Not much respect there was their? But it very much proves my point; it's that kind of put down, dismissive attitude that creates resentment and anger for those who are most impacted by unmanaged immigration; shut them down and accuse them of racism for too long and they'll express their frustrations in other ways. The government is only now coming to realise this; perhaps other posters should too. It's not the best way forward.

Galaxy

I use the word liberals doodledog because I don't really want to use the word left anymore, I think left and right are becoming increasingly inaccurate descriptors, and contempt for the working class isn't particularly left wing I am not talking about individual posters but rather an approach from a section of society ( mainly liberal middle class) towards those who express concerns on this issue (mainly the working class).

I didn't think you were having a go at anyone on here, but th fact remains that I don't understand where you get the idea that 'liberals' (or 'lefties, come to that') hate social media. That's not my liberal leftie experience at all.

Again, I agree that writing off the opinions of others is dangerous, and I am not hopeful for the future either, but respect has to go both ways, and kowtowing to inflammatory language and propaganda is not the way forward, IMO.

Hear, hear butterandjam 👏👏👏

Nobody knows about legality until we process the applications, Primrose53

These people are seeking asylum.
Their status is yet to be determined, obviously.

We will not be staying here again."
Very prescient! 😀

sundowngirl
If someone has been processed as illegally here they will be waiting deportation.

Hate is the wrong words actually they want to control social media, it is quite frequently the default solution to complex problems.

they don't arrive in their thousands

32,000 is hardly hordes!!!

46,000 illegal immigrants have arrived in boats since Labour got in.

So, what exactly is the definition of thousands?
I thought I knew but obviously opinions must vary about what constitutes thousands

(Confused emoji for explanation.)

Galaxy

I don't know about revolution but I am worried, I am not sure it is going to be pretty. Do people think it is all going to calm down and everyone will nod wisely 'oh I see you were right all along diversity is our strength after all'.

No, I don’t think it is going to calm down. I don’t think it is a solvable issue though, do you?

Might have been a while back, not now though.

Radio five news at 3 pm was reporting on the outbreak of England flags on lamp posts. Some councils removing them as lamp posts are council property so permission needed. Reform have said in the councils they run, flags will not be removed. The news Also reported on an outbreak of painting red crosses on white background on round abouts

Iam64 there are also reports of the English flag being painted in potholes in the hope that the councils will fill them in.

Visgirl - Service personnel aren't housed in barges indefinitely.
That's the difference.
Same for oil rig workers etc who have homes to go to after the work period.

Allira

^they don't arrive in their thousands^

32,000 is hardly hordes!!!

46,000 illegal immigrants have arrived in boats since Labour got in.

So, what exactly is the definition of thousands?
I thought I knew but obviously opinions must vary about what constitutes thousands

(Confused emoji for explanation.)

I’d like to know the new definition of thousands too.
Is it only applicable after a certain number is reached, or is there a moving goal post, so that thousands will simply never be acceptable as a quantity to comment on?

My opinion on irregular migration is that if the majority of the electorate are happy have money in their pockets, a decent roof over their heads, have access to a NHS dentist along with ease of seeing their GP and/or hospital appointments then it wouldn’t be such a perceived issue

However when it is reported that the irregular migrants have instant access to healthcare and dentistry, get instant accommodation, along with reports of them working as food delivery drivers illegally. When you add to the mix the publicised cases of sexual harassment, assault etc. there is going to be unrest.

Any government, of whatever party needs to acknowledge this and be seen to act in favour of the electorate that put them in power.

Mollygo

Allira

they don't arrive in their thousands

32,000 is hardly hordes!!!

46,000 illegal immigrants have arrived in boats since Labour got in.

So, what exactly is the definition of thousands?
I thought I knew but obviously opinions must vary about what constitutes thousands

(Confused emoji for explanation.)

I’d like to know the new definition of thousands too.
Is it only applicable after a certain number is reached, or is there a moving goal post, so that thousands will simply never be acceptable as a quantity to comment on?

Perhaps it's like 50 being the new 30 and 70s being the new 50?
Fluid?

butterandjam - Thank you.
My grandfather came here from a troubled Europe and my husband's grandfather too.
Both set up in business here and sent money and "welfare" parcels home.
They were the ones who left home. Neither left a wife - but they both helped support family "back home".

Laboutine

^I can't help thinking that deliberately choosing vocabulary in a "backatcha"

It was meant in a very much "backatcha" kind of way; particularly because growstuff had thought her comment was so smart she accompanied it with a laughing emoji. Not much respect there was their? But it very much proves my point; it's that kind of put down, dismissive attitude that creates resentment and anger for those who are most impacted by unmanaged immigration; shut them down and accuse them of racism for too long and they'll express their frustrations in other ways. The government is only now coming to realise this; perhaps other posters should too. It's not the best way forward.

Are you a mindreader? No, you don't know what growstuff thought. (sigh) Unfortunately, so many people assume so much and others are just content to spread misinformation or hyperbole. Some just seem prone to paranoid hysteria.

GrannyGravy13

My opinion on irregular migration is that if the majority of the electorate are happy have money in their pockets, a decent roof over their heads, have access to a NHS dentist along with ease of seeing their GP and/or hospital appointments then it wouldn’t be such a perceived issue

However when it is reported that the irregular migrants have instant access to healthcare and dentistry, get instant accommodation, along with reports of them working as food delivery drivers illegally. When you add to the mix the publicised cases of sexual harassment, assault etc. there is going to be unrest.

Any government, of whatever party needs to acknowledge this and be seen to act in favour of the electorate that put them in power.

Well said!

When people are living on the streets, single Mums are living in mouldy, rat infested accommodation in fear of being moved out, people need to use food foodbank, there are queues round several block for a dentist, can't get a GP appointment, it's not surprising that people become resentful.

The Government is tackling the issue of illegal immigration in some way by decreeing people from certain countries now need visas. They introduced this so hurriedly, it resulted in people coming here to visit family for a holiday having to cancel as they could not get visas in time.

Firm, decisive decision-making is needed, not knee-jerk reactions and sticking plasters.