Future of the Monarchy

If, as a nation, we decide to keep it then it should be massively scaled down.

But that is in our power, as the people, now.

Perhaps we should not be expecting so much from our Monarch and his/her extended family. It is the fault of the population of the UK and in fact the Commonwealth that we expect them to become Presidents and Patrons of thousands of charitable organisations, other bodies etc., not just as a notional head but to be actively seen supporting these organisations.

Whether that would prove to be disastrous, especially for those charities they currently support, would remain to be seen.

vegansrock

But if we did have a president as a figurehead to wave and host banquets they wouldn’t have any political power as we have a parliamentary system , where parliament is actually sovereign. We could have David Attenborough, Olivia Coleman or Ant and Dec as president for a 4 year term.

or Ant and Dec as president for a 4 year term

Would they share the salary?

StonesofDestiny, interesting post on the monarchy which reflects much of my own thinking. I have become increasingly anti-monarchy as it currently exists. If, as a nation, we decide to keep it then it should be massively scaled down. I am of the opinion, as stated previously, that there is no perfect system and, power and influence of a small group of individuals ,will always find a way to 'control', be it by birth, politics economic, military, religious or any other reason one can invent.
As for Buck House, not a gay pub, but a massive Museum/Art Gallery to house the gifts and treasures accumulated over the centuries so that, we, the people, get to enjoy them.
Along with the slimming down, let's have an elected Upper Chamber, represented by worthyCitizens of the Realm, rather than Lords, Ladies, Dames, Sirs etc.

Or as I said before, nothing to stop PWilliam standing for election and he’d probably have a good chance of getting in.

But if we did have a president as a figurehead to wave and host banquets they wouldn’t have any political power as we have a parliamentary system , where parliament is actually sovereign. We could have David Attenborough, Olivia Coleman or Ant and Dec as president for a 4 year term.

Caleo

I am sorry--- my response should have been addressed to Indigo, not Galaxy.

Having re-read my comment, I am not aware that I am objecting to anything Caleo:. Please explain what you mean.

vegansrock

There would be nothing to stop Charles or William standing in an election for head of state should they wish to, at least we’d know then if they really wanted the job. Not sure why everyone imagines we’d get a President Trump- our system is nothing like that of the US.

Our system would change if we got rid of the monarchy and had an elected head of state. Maybe we wouldn't get a Trump but maybe we would. No way to predict.

Which they are entitled to do, if they can prove the need.
But yes, also not sure how this 'deviation' evolved.

vegansrock

There would be nothing to stop Charles or William standing in an election for head of state should they wish to, at least we’d know then if they really wanted the job. Not sure why everyone imagines we’d get a President Trump- our system is nothing like that of the US.

Farageland will resemble Trumpland

There would be nothing to stop Charles or William standing in an election for head of state should they wish to, at least we’d know then if they really wanted the job. Not sure why everyone imagines we’d get a President Trump- our system is nothing like that of the US.

lemsip

why has what you earn come into a conversation about the monarchy may I ask?

such smugness from some also!

Because apparently nurses and teachers are being fed by food banks.

Maremia

I think higher education is wonderful, but don't believe it is necessary or even suitable for everyone.
And, wasn't Johnson very highly educated?

Original IQ can be augmented by good teaching. However it is true that some individuals are uneducable.

I am sorry--- my response should have been addressed to Indigo, not Galaxy.

Indigo8

Caleo

Galaxy

Yes no nonsense has been coming out of the university educated at all

I don't claim that higher education in social sciences and arts is fail safe. I do claim that such education makes it more probable that members of the electorate will be better at critical thinking and empathy. And yes: empathy can be learned from the arts-- empathy is part of what arts are for.

A surprising number of British prime ministers had degrees from Oxford (including all three women) and a smaller number from Cambridge, mainly in arts subjects. Even Sir Keir Starmer has a post grad qualification from Oxford.

I am not sure how relevant this is - just saying.

I'd not vote for an MP who could not think critically, the better their judgement the better the MP. A higher education in the arts and social sciences teaches critical thinking.

I don't see precisely what you are objecting to, Galaxy.

Caleo

Galaxy

Yes no nonsense has been coming out of the university educated at all

I don't claim that higher education in social sciences and arts is fail safe. I do claim that such education makes it more probable that members of the electorate will be better at critical thinking and empathy. And yes: empathy can be learned from the arts-- empathy is part of what arts are for.

A surprising number of British prime ministers had degrees from Oxford (including all three women) and a smaller number from Cambridge, mainly in arts subjects. Even Sir Keir Starmer has a post grad qualification from Oxford.

I am not sure how relevant this is - just saying.

The king doesn’t pay inheritance tax, rest of the family do

I think higher education is wonderful, but don't believe it is necessary or even suitable for everyone.
And, wasn't Johnson very highly educated?

A good start would be for them to pay Inheritance Tax.

why has what you earn come into a conversation about the monarchy may I ask?

such smugness from some also!

Galaxy

Yes no nonsense has been coming out of the university educated at all

I don't claim that higher education in social sciences and arts is fail safe. I do claim that such education makes it more probable that members of the electorate will be better at critical thinking and empathy. And yes: empathy can be learned from the arts-- empathy is part of what arts are for.

Allira I just wanted to put it out there that nurses and teachers can earn good salaries. Obviously mine were on lower salaries ten years ago but that's normal isn't it.

Allira

^Moreover, the glorification of traditional aristocracy undermines the meritocratic society.^

I do believe we need an elected Upper House.

However, having a hereditary Head of State does not bother me, in fact, I think it is preferable as they are symbolic figureheads.
If we had an elected Head of State we would need to be extremely careful to retain a Parliamentary system rather than a Presidential system.

I strongly agree we need an elected Upper House.

I agree we'd need to be "extremely careful to retain a Parliamentary system rather than a Presidential system".
Extreme care in that regard is in fact an educated electorate.
Educational standards correlate with voting trends.

Graduates (university degree holders) were significantly more likely to vote Remain.

People with fewer formal qualifications were more likely to vote Leave.

This was one of the strongest demographic predictors of voting behavior in the referendum.

I think that we have to begin to look at the constitution and make some real changes.

No one should be above the law. Therefore criminals in court should be subject to The People v whatever. Not The King.

The King should be subject to the law the same as everyone else.

theworriedwell

Just to clarify Allira my kids both earn more than £40k even though one is part-time after maternity leave.

Yes, that was an average theworriedwell

I know some nurses can earn far in excess of that as can some teachers but the starting salaries make those I quoted the average amount.

JaneJudge

theworriedwell

JaneJudge

are they single income households?

Was that for me?

Yes it was. Rent on a 3 bed house where I live is £2k and it isn't even posh.

Now - why is that?

What possible difference could having a different Head of State make to the housing crisis in the UK?
Who is accountable?

I'd blame successive governments.