Stronger links with Europe? KS

The President is in charge of defence in France, not the government.

I think the salient point is “we”, (the UK and other leaders) don’t have to agree with allies or their leaders politics, we simply have to have agreements in place and be able to debate and negotiate sensibly and have agreed “rules” in place.

Trump won’t be around forever, but I fear the damage he is doing will far outlive his terms in office.

Cossy

I think the salient point is “we”, (the UK and other leaders) don’t have to agree with allies or their leaders politics, we simply have to have agreements in place and be able to debate and negotiate sensibly and have agreed “rules” in place.

Trump won’t be around forever, but I fear the damage he is doing will far outlive his terms in office.

Am hoping beyond hope that Trumps highly damaging and openly disgraceful terms in office will send a message to peoples around the world who might be tempted to vote for a far right populist leader.
Especially those thinking of voting for Trumps mate here in the UK, Farage.
We have seen the writing on the wall and though Farage might not be as epic in the damage he could inflict, be very sure that damage would be inflicted.

Not a fan of Starmer but at least he's kept us out of another war unlike Tony Blair.
Trump is a very foolish man who has gone in way over his head without even thinking of the consequences let alone apparently having an objective. Now it's caused such chaos worldwide he wants out and can't understand why other countries ie the UK didn't jump right in to help him out.
He's also worried about the mid terms. He's telling us now that Hormuz is our problem when it's only the actions of the US and Israel that have caused the problem in the first place.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=axYQRpVhHyQ

Phil Moorhouse's analysis of Starmer's speech.

Brexit shouldn't have happened. We need to rejoin Europe if the EU will have us back. I am sure the terms won't be as favourable though.

Delene100

Brexit shouldn't have happened. We need to rejoin Europe if the EU will have us back. I am sure the terms won't be as favourable though.

You appear to have got away with it!

Any minute you will be told we are still part of Europe.

We are still part of Europe. Brexit, leaving the EU happened. We need to have good relations with all the countries in Europe for our security and defence, but that does not mean to do that we have to rejoin the EU.

And talking about not being around forever, Pamela Bondi has just been fired.

GardenofEngland

We are still part of Europe. Brexit, leaving the EU happened. We need to have good relations with all the countries in Europe for our security and defence, but that does not mean to do that we have to rejoin the EU.

We were part of Europe back in 1952 when I could write my full address in all my books. 🙂

We were part of Europe back in 1952 when I could write my full address in all my books. 🙂 ???we all were and will be forever in Europe. But not the EU club.

Currently we are a little canoe paddling around the edges of our much larger neighbour pleading please let is back in, we don't like your rules but we want the bits we like. They are saying tough, when you accept our rules we will think about it.

It's us that has to change they aren't going to give anything away.

David49

Currently we are a little canoe paddling around the edges of our much larger neighbour pleading please let is back in, we don't like your rules but we want the bits we like. They are saying tough, when you accept our rules we will think about it.

It's us that has to change they aren't going to give anything away.

We should never ever have left and I do hope those, like the hypocrite Farage, are very happy with themselves!

As an MEP and one of our representatives, he should have have supported those who voted for him, and did the job he was paid to do, fighting our corner and attempting to bring about change.

Mmmmm sounds very familiar?

We definitely need strong ties with Europe. However we need control of our borders. It was the free flow of people that created the Brexit vote.

It was the American electorate who voted Trump for President. I feel safer with European electorates including British voters----despite the rise of Farage.

We don't appear to be pleading to be let back into the heart of the club, merely holding talks about mutual co-operation on some aspects of our trading relations with the EU, and on combined defence against future military attacks. Both are sensible moves given our geographical and social position so close to the European mainland.

Elegran

We don't appear to be pleading to be let back into the heart of the club, merely holding talks about mutual co-operation on some aspects of our trading relations with the EU, and on combined defence against future military attacks. Both are sensible moves given our geographical and social position so close to the European mainland.

We should be Europeans before we are British. This, because a European defence bloc stands as a counter to the USA, China, and Russia.

There is quite strong support for governments you wouldn't like in France, Germany, Italy, etc, this is the point I am trying yo make, what will you do if those governments you don't like take power in Europe.

what will you do if those governments you don't like take power in Europe.

Align with the governments which aren't France, Germany or Italy?

I t would be interesting to see just how powerful France & Germany, as so called 'top table' countries would be in those circumstances. In theory every country has an equal voice

Incidentally, it looks as though Hungary might be swinging back to at least the 'centre' as Orban looks in danger of being defeated.

I don’t see that happening to all countries at the same time though Galaxy? There are a lot of member states in the EU, the whole political spectrum is covered between them, whether a government is right or left leaning fluctuates by country, but overall the mix doesn’t change much.

Galaxy

There is quite strong support for governments you wouldn't like in France, Germany, Italy, etc, this is the point I am trying yo make, what will you do if those governments you don't like take power in Europe.

Yes but so far there is nothing as bad as Trumpland or Russia.

But presumably people didn't predict Trump before he arried on the scene , and of course there are obvious key players within the European Union, countries will swing from left to right ( or whatever terms we use, personally I am not sure those terms are particularly pertinent these days) I just don't feel it is strategic to base alliances on who is in power.

An alliance with a group of countries is always going to be more robust than an alliance with just one other country though, because political whims are less likely to affect the alliance overall.

What it boils down to , for me, is that I _feel _more European than I feel American , Chinese, or Russian

Galaxy

But presumably people didn't predict Trump before he arried on the scene , and of course there are obvious key players within the European Union, countries will swing from left to right ( or whatever terms we use, personally I am not sure those terms are particularly pertinent these days) I just don't feel it is strategic to base alliances on who is in power.

If I’m honest, I remembering discussing Trump when he first stood for election, around about the same time as Johnson’s stood for election, along with many of my peers we didn’t feel either of them were suitable leaders.

Seems we were right about both, imo, Johnsons’s legacy is “wasting money” and needless Covid deaths, I’m talking about care homes and lack of quick action at the beginning and PPE. Trumps legacy, well, where do we even begin??