"It's the Thing that counts..."

What expression should he have used? <trying to keep up with ever-changing trends>

I suggest you read it more deeply than skimming, jings. I understood him to be speaking up for people against whom he feels there is, possibly unconscious, prejudice, in the industry he works in. No question of superiority.

*GranntTwice You should not feel insulted, because I would not dream of insulting you.

I should have put it as "If no-one mentions a disability . . ." because some people avert their eyes rather than look a disabled person in the eye. If something is never openly mentioned, it becomes a secret and a secret can become something to be ashamed of and therefore hidden, which takes it round in a circle.

I know that there ARE people who feel lessened because of their disability - I have had a PM conversation with someone in exactly that situation.

But it is not a thing to fall out about. Peace.

Well, I'm not past that. I skim read your article. I am amazed that Gransnetters can see nothing wrong with calling black people "coloured".

Cumberbatch was obviously raised in a world where white people thought themselves a little above the "hoy-palloy" (sp) of all kinds.

I think he showed himself up to be a supercilious prick. Which I have always suspected him of being.

The incident I am referring to took place in the early 70s when coloured had no derogatory taint.

We're past that, jings. Are you saying Cumberbatch was deliberately being offensive?

Have you even read the Cohen article?

You could regard having a leg in plaster as a temporary disability. I certainly would.

Read the book "Small Island". Read about lodging houses after the war with notices in the windows - No coloureds. No dogs.

We will know we're near to regarding people as (potential) equals when the colour of someone's skin is irrelevant except for purely descriptive reasons, just as describing someone's hair as dark or fair is not taken as insulting now.

Loopy - there is a huge difference between being in plaster and having a disabilty

Elegran - you are verging on the insulting now. My disability is Jt a ' dirty little secret' and there is no way I feel second class because of it. What would make me feel second class would be someone, as in your example, asking me at a social do what was the matter with me? What they should be doing is asking me the sort of questions they would ask say one else - about my job, where I've been on holiday, my dgc etc. Asking about my disability means that is how they are seeing me and I am way more interesting than that! I have to say though that if I had my arm in plaster, for example, I would understand someone asking how it had happened - somehow that doesn't seem so intrusive although I accept that might be a tad
What makes disabled people second class is being treated differently when it's not appropriate or relevant

The word Coloured to describe someone has been a no-no for at least 30 to 40 years - where have some of you been?

I didn't mind people asking in the slightest when in plaster, in fact it was far preferable to being invisible in a wheelchair for months! But then I'm the sort of person who chats to anyone, regardless of where I am, but I'd never be intrusive, just friendly.

That was to GrannyTwice

You don't get what I was saying either, so we are equal.

In conversation with someone (not a complete stranger, in fact, but someone at a social do to whom he was chatting) my son-in-law was asked a perfectly polite question by someone who was interested in him and his life. He found her choice of terms unusual at this time, but not offensive - because it was not meant to be offensive.

You would find that intrusive. That is up to you. But there is no diffeence to me between that question and saying to someone with a plaster on a leg "That must have been painful, what did you do to it?"

If you never discuss a disability with anyone, then it becomes a dirty secret - and it should not. That is the route to people with disabilities feeling that they are second-rate citizens.

The problem is that words change their meaning as those inclined to sneer will hijack innocent words and turn them into derisory ones.

Coloured was once an accepted term - I was tripped up by that nebulous moment when a word slips from favour. It's a bit of a challenge to stay up to speed.

I always remember when, at the height of politically correct, I was called to the ward to see a man who was, as the ward sister put it "height challenged." I had to fill in some boring form with him and asked how he would like me to describe his "disability" for the purposes of acquiring whatever benefit he was applying for his answer was: "I am 70 years old; I was born a dwarf; I have always been a dwarf; and I will die a dwarf. Put that on your form!"

Galen- you might not mind being asked (as you have gathered, I do) but do you think it's ok for strangers to ask ( which is a different point)?

Clearly I am lacking^emotional intelligence^, and no, I don't remember when the phrase coloured people was used disparagingly. I seem therefore, along with Cumberbatch, to have been 'raised in the ark'....... Somewhat insulting I feel.
Ouch

Elegan- you just don't get it do you? Can you explain to me why a complete stranger ( intelligent or otherwise) should ask me what's wrong with me or why I walk as I do? That's actually defining me by my disability , that's all they see. I don't want their totally unacceptable curiosity interest

I don't mind being asked, but then as a doctor I anm always interested in causation of morbidity

Cumberbatch was not using the term in the way it might have been use in the South Africa of apartheid and that would have been obvious to even the meanest of intellects that heard him, so why get all het up? He wasn't being offensive so why take offence? That's the long and the short of it.

<Waits for someone to jump on the expression "meanest of intellects">

The people making a fuss about what Cumberbatch said are just stirrers and troublemakers, whatever colour their skin is.

That's better Anya. Anything is better than white!

Your choice, GrannyTwice, but it doesn't mean they insult you by taking an intelligent interest.

Raised in the ark? Attended a public school...what's the difference?

Jingle - I couldn't agree more.