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Pedants' corner

I and Me.

(50 Posts)
mrsmopp Fri 07-Dec-18 00:04:29

Me and my friend are going on holiday.
She is coming with my sister and I.
My friend and I are going on holiday.
She is coming with my sister and me.

Why do so many people find this difficult?

MissAdventure Fri 07-Dec-18 00:21:54

A myriad of reasons, I would say, not least of which is the standard of education they received.

annep Fri 07-Dec-18 00:27:23

It really really annoys me. You would never say she is coming with I. grr.

annep Fri 07-Dec-18 00:30:47

Every morning in P7 we had to recite prepositions after which you used the object. It started.. about, above, according to, across, after, against. I still can recite most of it.

LullyDully Fri 07-Dec-18 08:25:54

This does irritate but seems so ingrained in so many that it can't be changed;like the borrow and lend confusion.
The sporadic use of myself and yourself is the one that drives me potty. It seems to be a recent ' affectation'.

JackyB Fri 07-Dec-18 08:37:35

As I speak German most of the time, it would be unthinkable to use the accusative where the nominative is asked for or vice versa. But the French also do it. They say "Moi" where the nominative is called for:

E.g. "Qui a mangé tous les bonbons?" (Who has eaten all the sweets?) The only possible response from a francophone culprit would be "Moi". There is a German joke about this, where in the same situation, the German would answer "Je!"

mcem Fri 07-Dec-18 09:08:50

I think some folk believe that using "I" is somehow more polite or correct. They know that "me and my friend are going" is not correct and somehow infer that using "me" is usually wrong.
It happens frequently on tv when someone says " Thanks from Xxx x and I " !!
I - nominative - subject of verb or sentence.
Me - accusative - object of verb OR following preposition.
From me, to me, by me whether or not friend is involved.

Elegran Fri 07-Dec-18 10:10:12

I don't know why they find it difficult, mrsmopp Perhaps they have heard their parents say it the wrong way round so often that it has sunk in. Being told something as a fact isn't nearly as effective as being surrounded by examples. The fact gets half forgotten ,so people say pick "you and I" because it sounds less ignorant than "you and me"

The simplest explanation (for those who will listen and remember) is that if you would say "we" you say "you and I" but if you would say "us" you say "you and me".

So - "You and I (we) are the only ones who can do this" and "These chocolates are meant for you and me (us)"

trisher Fri 07-Dec-18 10:13:54

I you need a simple way to do it if you can separate the "I' and make a sentence saying the same thing it's right.
So- <My friend is going on holiday.+I am going on holiday= My friend and I are going on holiday
Me is going on holiday sounds wrong!

Greta Fri 07-Dec-18 15:58:20

I am not sure how much grammar teaching goes on in our schools. I regret that we are so quick to copy what comes from America. The 'myself/yourself' seems to be a recent phenomenon and is so unnecessary.

JackyB, as regards the French, I'm not sure if you are saying that the 'Moi' after a question is incorrect. "Qui a mangé tous les bonbons?" 'Moi'. Since the pronoun here is a stress pronoun you cannot use 'Je'. It's not a case of nominative or accusative. But perhaps I misunderstood you.

rockgran Fri 07-Dec-18 16:13:11

I hate it when

"....for You and I...."

is use in song lyrics just because it rhymes in the right place. Grrrr.....

Bathsheba Fri 07-Dec-18 16:20:00

In the same vein, I frequently come across people saying "her and her husband are always going away", instead of "she and her husband". Again, remove the husband and you're left with "her is always going away" hmm.

mrsmopp Fri 07-Dec-18 20:40:56

Rock gran, "for you and I have a guardian angel on high, with nothing to do,... '

Elegran Fri 07-Dec-18 21:37:33

Ah, but that "for" is not the same as "for us", it is in the same grammatical category as "but" or "and" or "because". You can substitute any of those into its place.

"You and I have . . " = "We have . . . ."

Anja Fri 07-Dec-18 21:48:49

Our generation is just as bad. I remember a teacher telling me that you should always use ‘I’ never ‘me’ at the end of a sentence.


mcem Fri 07-Dec-18 22:25:20

anja I don't get that. Who would ever say e.g. "It's been a long tiring day for I"?
Could you give an example of what she said? I really have never heard this before.

MissAdventure Fri 07-Dec-18 22:41:46

It seems nobody is quite sure.
I blatantly have no clue.

Jalima1108 Fri 07-Dec-18 23:15:01

If you find out mrsmopp, could you let myself know please?

mrsmopp Fri 07-Dec-18 23:22:46

What exactly do you want myself to let yourself know? 🙄
I'm baffled by Anjas post.

MawBroon Fri 07-Dec-18 23:24:42

I feel that once you split them, it is obvious which is correct, but I suspect so many had it “beaten “ into them thar “I” is correct grammar and “me” wrong, that they overcompensate.
May I add in “myself” though?
I have just read elsewhere “myself and my wife”are doing something or other and every fibre in me screams”No! 😱😱My wife and I smile

MissAdventure Fri 07-Dec-18 23:30:56

Could it be 'Me and my wife?' too?
I only say what sounds right to me, but I've never questioned myself so much as I do since I joined gransnet.

Jalima1108 Fri 07-Dec-18 23:34:53

Why do so many people find this difficult?

"If yourself would like to book any trips during your stay in this wonderful resort, mrsmopp then please see myself after this welcome meeting"


MawBroon Fri 07-Dec-18 23:44:30

No Mrs Mopp you wouldn’t say “Me is travelling o France” so you wouldn’t say “me and my wife are travelling to France” would you?
Also I was taught that you always put yourself second (like good manners) therefore
“My wife and I...” etc

MissAdventure Fri 07-Dec-18 23:48:16

Ah thank you.
I thought that those rules had been usurped by new ones, but have to admit not to caring too much either way.
As long as everyone understands that my wife and I are going somewhere. smile

Jalima1108 Fri 07-Dec-18 23:50:24

I apologise for my digression.

It has been rather a long day for I.