Dog crates/cages

I would never use one and when I first found out about them I was horrified.

I think it's a pity that people use the worst examples of cruelty to make a point when others posting here clearly use crates properly. No one has said they cram their dog into a crate because they can't be bothered to train it, no-one locks their dogs in for hours and most never close the door, leaving the dog free access and exit. Leads and collars can be used in a cruel way but does anyone suggest owners shouldn't use a lead?

My sister-in-law’s cocker goes into a crate because they can’t go out and leave her unless she’s in the crate.

Our cocker has never been in one since the early training days. When she started upsetting her water dish and trying to drag her bed out of the crate, we dismantled it.

She has a bed upstairs and downstairs and when we go out, she goes on one or the other or lies looking out of the window.

My dog has a crate, but it has never in his life been closed or locked, the door is always open. In the wild, dogs live in dens. They like the feeling of security provided by an enclosed space. He has a blanket over it, his soft bed inside it, and he loves it, it’s his safe place. When we are out, he doesn’t move from it - it’s in the utility room, which has a glass door, and he will happily lie for hours looking out of the window, growling at squirrels.

ViceVersa

So is putting a toddler in a play pen cruel then?

Yes!

We have a fabric collapsible one for the car that is strapped in on journies....don't use it in the house tho

Unlike many domesticated animals dogs actually chose to live with us. It was a symbiotic relationship. We are now their pack and they seem to be quite happy for a crate to be their den.My daughters dog, who has access to all of the house, is often to be found under the sideboard. When I’m dog sitting I sometimes worry that I’ve lost her. It isn’t that she’s nervous, she just likes hidey holes. She no longer has a crate but it wouldn’t surprise me that, if she still had one, she’d use it.

A crate should only be used for safety reasons for the puppy/dog . I've had many dogs in my lifetime and never used a crate until I got my last 2 puppies , 2 years apart .
When I bought my oldest girl home at 8 weeks I already had a crate in the kitchen with a lovely bed in it. My puppy took to it right away . I used to leave the door open and she would go in on her own without being told, she loved to sleep in there. I had a blanket over the top so she felt in a safe place.
When my second girl came to me she was 9 weeks and she loved it too. I always used to find the older girl and the puppy curled up together in the crate , no doubts they both felt safe in there . Crates are a safe haven to a dog that has been gotten used to them in a kind way . My mind was at rest when I was busy with other things knowing they couldn't come to any harm . Until you've tried one you'll never know how good a crate is . My girls are now 9 and 7 years old, I've still got the crate in the shed and when I have to get it out both dogs rush to get in it together, it's hilarious, they're both much to big but they still love their crate. If it was cruel they would never do that . Used in the right way crates are brilliant for both dog and owner .

So is putting a toddler in a play pen cruel then?

Jaxjacky

My brother and son both have young dogs, both rescue spaniel types, they’ve never used a cage, just spent time training them so they can be left. Like in the olden days!

Precisely! We often see horrific photos released by RSPCA of dogs from puppy farms crammed into crates and the idea of putting any pet into one makes me shudder.

We trained our dogs to be part of the family and if you put a dog in a crate or cage you are doing it to suit your lifestyle not the dog’s.

I once put a post on here about a springer spaniel we had when I was a teenager. She came from working stock and preferred sleeping in a cooler place. I called it an outhouse and was well and truly told off for that! She had a big basket, blankets etc but chose to sleep on the cooler lino even in winter. The “outhouse” was an unheated room we called the wash house next to the unheated toilet we all used like thousands of families did in the 60s.

Funny how many considered that cruel yet think nothing of putting their pet in a metal crate! 🤣🤣

I feel limited use of crates is very useful, especially in the very early days, big enough for a water bowl, a bed, a blanket and a toy.

We used them for both our spaniels, at night for the first couple of weeks, then limited use, usually with the door open.

We used it in the boot of our hatchback until they were fully grown after which time they used seat belt restraints.

My brother and son both have young dogs, both rescue spaniel types, they’ve never used a cage, just spent time training them so they can be left. Like in the olden days!

I used crates for my last 2 puppies . They honestly loved them. Even now at 9 and 7 years old if I get the crate out of the shed they both rush to try and get in together but they are too big now
They aren't cruel when used correctly, it's a space of their own and when you have a puppy and you need to leave them for a while, e.g. cooking they're safe

Maybe it’s just me but I never liked to see any animal caged or crated.

When I was a child most families had a rabbit or guinea pig in a small hutch. Thank goodness most pet lovers now realise that is cruel. Same as caged birds. I hate seeing birds in tiny cages hung outside flats when we go abroad.

Maybe in years to come people will consider dog cages or crate cruel. We managed without them all our lives.

Jaxjacky

We know someone with a small (miniature?) Pomeranian which they carry in a front facing baby carriers, including when they’re driving. I hope they get stopped.

They do not need to get stopped - you need to report them. Someone else's' safety could be in your hands.

Unfortunately loose dogs in vehicles are the norm round here as I live in a farming area where dogs are hopping about in tractor cabs and on quad bikes all the time.

We know someone with a small (miniature?) Pomeranian which they carry in a front facing baby carriers, including when they’re driving. I hope they get stopped.

Luckygirl3 Dogs have to be restrained in cars.
My daughter has a harness for her partner's dog. It links onto the seat belt/isofix (I think actually the isofix). It has been crash tested but ridiculously they ot test them up to 30mph!

Your dog must be suitably restrained so they cannot disturb the driver of the car. This requires you to put them in a dog crate, pet carrier, or dog harness or use a dog guard in the rear of the vehicle.

Driving with pets is covered under Rule 57 of The Highway Code that states: “When in a vehicle make sure dogs or other animals are suitably restrained so they cannot distract you while you are driving or injure you, or themselves if you stop quickly.”

You could be prosecuted for driving without due care and attention if your dog isn’t properly secured

Crates are fine if left open and are a space for a dog to retreat to if needed. The problem is people shutting their dogs inside them. I’d say anything over an hour a day in one amounts to cruelty. There are some that shut their dogs in them overnight or all day. That’s a terrible thing to do to an animal.

In Sweden and Finland it's illegal to use a crate unless it's for specific things like travelling, however, I wouldn't want to use a crate to travel a dog unless it went into the crate by choice in the home environment. It seems you can use a crate in both countries as long as it doesn't have a door so it is open, everyone I know who uses crates has the door open anyway most of the time so the dog can come and go as it pleases. Seems a bit cockeyed to me as you'd need two crates!

I am not a dog person and get incensed by loose dogs in cars. What can people be thinking of?! I worked for a trauma service and saw injuries caused by loose animals in cars.

So, yes to crates in cars.

But the keeping of dogs is already a denial of their true natures as pack animals - keeping them in crates in the home just compounds that. It all seems crazy to me, and immoral to boot.

We've always used crates with our pups, the breeder of our first one recommended it and all of our border terriers have taken to using them straight away. They're not for shutting a dog away, they're meant to be a safe place for the pup to go to rest and sleep by choice! We always use one in the car and if we stay away with the dog. They're part of good training not instead of it. They must be big enough for the dog to turn round, stand up and have some freedom, my DD has a Hungarian Vizla, his is huge!

We use a dog crate for our two cats when we take them in the car. They snuggle up together and go to sleep a soon as we start the car engine. If they are loose they jump around and miaow and they are dangerous for whoever is driving.

Here

The cat, however, was desperate to go in it and settle down. 😆