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Relationship with adult daughter

(64 Posts)
Dolcelatte Fri 13-Apr-18 09:31:41

I have 3 DD and would appreciate some advice about DD1.

She had a good relationship with me and DH and her sisters growing up. After school she wasn't sure about going to uni so we supported her in taking a cookery qualification, but she subsequently decided to go to uni, where she met her current partner, whom she met in the 2nd year. It was clear that she was very keen on him and she dropped her long standing boyfriend from home to be with him.

We invited the new boyfriend to stay and indeed he came to stay on a number of occasions, usually for up to a week as his family home is at the other end of the country. He seemed quite shy in that he didn't really engage with anyone else in the family, and not very polite in some respects, never offered to say clear the table, or say thank you for having me after the first couple of times. But he was doing very well in his engineering degree, he and DD1 seemed happy and his family sounded nice.

Towards the end of DD1's final year, she said that her boyfriend was being given 35 thousand pounds by his grandparents and had about another 4 in savings, so wanted to buy a house with her and could we give her the money. I wanted to help her so took money out of my pension fund and said that I would let her have the money, but it would have to be expressed to be a loan in order to protect the position if they split up or if anything happened to her. I also had in mind that I had to be fair to all of the girls and it wouldn't be fair to make an outright gift just to one of them.

I then began to observe other aspects of the boyfriend's behaviour which caused concern. I won't set them all out as the thread would be too long, but basically apart from being rude, he was exhibiting signs of controlling behaviour. For example, he didn't want my DD to go on a holiday which she had already booked and paid for (I'm pleased to say she did go), was ordering around the other tenants in the house DD rented (he was doing a year in industry by then so wasn't himself a tenant), ignoring DD on occasions - one time he insisted on a face to face meeting after some disagreement, which involved her driving a 200 mile round trip. He also quit his job early and destroyed all his electronic files on the way out, along with sending his employer a rude message.

However, alarm bells really started to sound over the house. He didn't want to have a survey done, despite the house being bought at a cheap price and the agent saying there was something wing with the roof. He was resistant to any Deed of Trust, insisting that the house belonged solely to him and DD, and flatly refused to have any searches carried out.

I was worried about DD, especially as she had been in a relationship, albeit short lived, a few years earlier, which she subsequently told me was abusive. The final straw came when my other DDs came to me one day when he was staying, to say that they were worried about their sister as there had been row and she had been heard sobbing for most of the morning.

I am afraid that protective mother went into overdrive, i asked him to leave, at first nicely, by which time DD had run into the bathroom and locked herself in. He insisted that he had to speak to her before he left. I then lost it, I am afraid to say, told him he was controlling, not good enough fo my DD, nobody liked him and i wanted him out of my house. I went away for about 15 minutes, came back and he was still there and DD still locked in the bathroom. I said if he din't leave immediately i would call the police, so eventually he did, giving me a horrible glare on the way out.

DD came out of the bathroom, was in a terrible state, i and my sisters tried to calm her down. She did calm down after a while and then went after him. They went to his parents who agreed to provide the money which i was going to provide, as a loan, with a view to selling at a profit which would be shared, after a couple of years.

DD was upset but ame home a while later to work on her dissertation, obviously still loved us. I explained that i was just trying to protect her. She wanted me and boyfriend to be friends. I apologised to her and to him, although he just ignored attempts to contact him. We met as a family with him at DDs graduation a few months later and it was a bit awkward but we all managed. I also offered her the money for the house to buy out his parents, just as a gift, but she spoke to him and he said no, and i thought fair enough.

DD came to visit a few times after that a couple of times with boyfriend and i was super nice to him, said sorry a few times and hoped we were ok and he said we were.

Then after about 18 months he said his father wanted his money out of the house and looked at me. I didn't respond. I actually didn't have the money any longer anyway, but was worried it might cause more problems.

Anyway since then DD has become more and more distant. Last year she cut us off abruptly for 6 months and now just sends an occasional email if we are lucky. Sh effectively ghosted us for 6 oaths immediately after we had visited her ( the city where the house was, boyfriend did' meet us, and obviously we weren't invited to the house so stayed in a hotel). But she told us how much she loved us then just cut us off. Not just me but all of us. She hasn't had any contact with one of her sisters for nearly two years. They sold the house and have bought another one, but she won't give us her address.

She and I were close after the incident. She said I was her best friend and her role model, that she wished she could attach her house to mine. But she seems to have gone from that to being more and more resentful, says that i let her down by leaving them in the lurch at the last moment, that her boyfriend and her dog are her family now, that we have never welcomed boyfriend, that they come as a package, she will not see us without him, and he won't see us until we 'see her right', from which I infer they want money.

Neither of them have worked for the last few years and, so far as i can work out, have no intention of doing so. DD has said that they don't want to be 'wage slaves' or 'mortgage monkeys', that they are not like other people.

I find it hard to express the anguish of that 6 months without her and even now I feel that it is all hanging by a thread.

I would welcome any advice or wisdom from any GNers, as i know from reading some of the threads that some are in a similar situation. It is heartbreaking to be shunned by those you love so much.

Apologies for such a long post, which is my first on GN.

FarNorth Tue 17-Apr-18 09:52:08

I fear that if we did give her any money outright , he would take it over.
He definitely would.

You did nothing wrong and no sensible person would continue to hold a vindictive grudge against you because of one loss of temper under provocation.

If it hadn't been that incident that 'upset' him, it would have been something else.

I agree with others, keep light contact going and don't give any money, other than normal gifts.

Dolcelatte Tue 17-Apr-18 05:35:42

Don't give up hope Smileless. Your GC will grow up and want to know you I am sure, even if their parents don't. And I am sure that you would forgive DS if he resumed contact, which he may well do, in time.

Your DIL sounds like DD's BF, highly manipulative. If someone is with another person 24/7 (which DD is, as they are neither of them working), they are bound to be influenced by their partner.

Are you still in contact with your other DS?

Smileless2012 Mon 16-Apr-18 14:07:50

Realistically Dolcellate no, there's no hope now.

We accepted some time ago that the relationship was over and even if there had been a reconciliation, it would never be the same again. As time's gone on I suppose we've just got used to it.

We were fortunate that we never saw our eldest GC from 8 months and have never seen the youngest, so at least we were spared the heartache of losing GC we'd established a relationship with. That said, TBH I don't think I could ever forgive him for what he's done; the lies, the attempt to come between us and his brother and yes, taking away our GC.

Above all is the break of trust and as you've said, the disloyalty and rejection of, apart from his brother, his entire family.

I don't agree that you handled it "incredibly badly", as I've said, you did what any other loving parent would have done. I did witness the manipulation of our ES by his wife but even now, having been so cruelly and heartlessly treated by him for almost 6 years, if I were to witness her emotional abuse of him, well let's just say, she wouldn't get off as lightly as your D's partnerblush.

Dolcelatte Mon 16-Apr-18 13:17:01

I am so sorry to hear that Smileless. Is there no hope?

I agree that it is an incredibly painful situation to be in, but also agree with GrannyParker, who said that loyalty can't be bought. I do feel that DD has been disloyal and has rejected us all, and that is what hurts the most. I just don't understand how she could deliberately hurt me so much. I can't get my head around it at all.

Thank you for saying not to blame myself, that means a lot. I know that I have handled all of it incredibly badly, but can honestly say, hand on heart, that I only ever wanted what was best for DD.

Smileless2012 Mon 16-Apr-18 12:54:39

Hi Dolcellate and welcome to GN. I'm truly sorry for the reason concerning your first post on here. The advice to try and retain a measure of contact with your D is good, I hope that it will be possible for you.

We've been estranged from our S and only GC for approaching 6 years and although his wife was more subtle than your D's partner, up until the final cut out, there are distinct similarities, and those are evident in so many experiences of P's when CO by their AC.

I firmly believe that this man's treatment of you and his 'encouragement' of your D to cut you out isn't about what you did that day when, understandably, your desire to defend and protect your D got the better of you, it's because of what you haven't done.

You haven't given them money, when originally asked to as that would have been a loan rather than a gift, and more importantly IMO you haven't allowed him to control you. I really do believe that the need for control supersedes anything else.

Our ES's wife wanted us to jump through hoops, be at her beck and call when required and never have, let alone express an opinion of our own if it contradicted her's. She managed to get our once loving and wonderful S on side and eventually we lost him and our 2 GC. Not that I absolve him of responsibility, because ultimately he made his decision.

I hope and pray that you will continue to have some contact with your D but please don't blame yourself for doing what any loving parent would do in the same situation.

The pain of losing an AC through estrangement is beyond words and is a terrible daily burden. Don't make yours any harder by blaming yourself. This isn't your doing, it's hisflowers.

Madgran77 Mon 16-Apr-18 11:58:50

Putting money in doesn't legally give her a share if his is the sole name on the deeds!

GrannyParker Mon 16-Apr-18 11:49:20

It’s hard, but please don’t give in and hand over any money unless you are prepared to loose it. You can’t buy her loyalty, and if you give him an inch he’ll take a mile.

gummybears Mon 16-Apr-18 09:08:45

I will bet dollars to donuts that the house is in his sole name and DD has no share in it at all in law.

Which is one of the reasons he won't marry her; she doesn't have the protection in law of it being a matrimonial home to prevent him turfing her out on the street penniless when the time comes.

Dolcelatte Mon 16-Apr-18 08:35:24

loopy, I have thought about getting a private investigator, but DH feels that it would not be right to do so. It would feel like spying on her and it would make matters worse if she found out.

The she cut off contact it was about the time of one of the bomb explosions last year, so I was frantic, but she didn't reply. Then I remembered that I was still paying for her mobile phone contract so rang the company who assured me that the phone was in use. I know she should really be paying for her own contract, but I want her to always be able to get in touch if she wants to. I got so far as contacting one investigator, who thought it would be a good idea to ring her and say he had a parcel to deliver so could he have the address, but it seemed a bit obvious. I do have his parents' address, so I suppose I could get in touch via them if I had to.

As for how they live, they have no mortgage but are claiming benefits (JSA and council tax rebate), but live simply, grows lot of their own produce. DD is a vegan who doesn't drink or smoke (she used to), don't buy things or go on holiday. I did give her some money for Christmas and birthday, but only what I would have given her anyway.

loopyloo Mon 16-Apr-18 07:34:23

I would to see what a private investigator could find out about this situation. Where are they getting an income from?
I don't like the sound of it at all.
If desperate you could talk to the police to raise concerns about your daughter. At least you may be able to find out where she is living by doing some research.

Dolcelatte Mon 16-Apr-18 06:50:23

Thank you everybody, especially for your understanding of my reaction on the fateful day. I do regret it as, although I don't think I was wrong about him as time has shown, I do think it was a big mistake to make an enemy of him. His pride was injured and I feel sure that he wants to get his revenge by cutting me off from my daughter. It was out of character for me, but the final straw after a series of incidents. He apparently told DD that she clearly gets her 'batshitness' from her mother!

I also felt dreadful, because I am generally thought to be a welcoming person. My DDs have had lots of people to stay over the years, of both sexes, and I have always got on with them and they have always liked us (or so my DDs tell me). I always wanted them to feel able to invite their friends home and to know that their friends would be welcome.

DD does own a tiny share of the house. She had an inheritance from her grandfather - basically, DH's father gave him a sum of money to spend on the girls, as he thought best, to cover driving lessons, first car etc. We bought all those things anyway and have always supported all the girls, but they know that the money was always here for them (although the other two insist that they don't want it as we have done so much for them, but of course we will ensure that they do have it, as it is what their grandfather would have wanted). DD1 had always said you look after it, as I want to keep it for something special like a wedding. Anyway, she suddenly demanded the money and kept asking DH where it was, was it in a separate account, how much interest was there etc. This was about 15 months ago. Of course we paid over the money when she asked, but it was quite hurtful, as though she thought we might be trying to cheat her in some way. It just wasn't like her at all.

She has subsequently told me that this money went towards the purchase of the new house, in which she has a tiny share. He has clearly made sure that he has the rest, even though some of the money came from the renovation of the other house, which DD worked hard on, as well as driving him to the DIY shops etc. DD has previously told DD3 that she has been dropping lots of hints about marriage, but he does not appear to have taken them (which I am not sorry about!), maybe because he doesn't want to share anything.

GillT57 Sun 15-Apr-18 20:53:05

What a dreadful situation, and for what it is worth, my reaction that day would have been the same had my DD been sobbing. I do think those on here saying that you should have not vented on that day are being a bit unfair. This dreadful man is a manipulator and would have treated you, your DD,your family exactly as he has, irrespective of what he deems to be your unreasonable behaviour. Had you not thrown him out, had you provided the money he wanted, he would have created another reason to keep your DD away from you and her family. He has already given hints with his talk of future grandchildren. Please don't blame yourself, this is not your fault. Just keep the chatty, non judgemental emails going, your DD will eventually see him for what he is, or more likely, he will find another more profitable victim. Just leave the way open for your DD to return.

Madgran77 Sun 15-Apr-18 20:10:14

I think a lot of her contradictory behaviour and statements link to "pleasing boyfriend"! Keep gentle contact and be thee for her when she needs you. It may well be some flowerstime!

Nezumi65 Sun 15-Apr-18 08:36:10

He sounds mentally unwell (& not to say that as an excuse, just as a reason for his behaviour being out of the norm).

I think all you can do is send the occasional message to your daughter to keep the lines of communication open and so she knows that if she ever needs to leave she can go to you without judgment. In a way the house being unequivocally his would make it easier to leave as she wouldn’t have to be walking away from your money.

Benji55 Sat 14-Apr-18 23:41:13

Horrible situation for you. My advice would be the same as others on here, don’t get financially involved, let them work out their own finances, keep any possible lines of communication open with your DD and I think she will one day see him for what he is and return home.

glammanana Sat 14-Apr-18 19:37:36

As everyone has said this little creep is playing the long game and as soon as he realises there is no money pot at the end he will be off.
This happened with my DD over 20yrs ago now and it took a few years (4) for her to walk away on her own accord which I feel you may have to wait for,just keep the door open for her and keep sending loving family messages.
Your DD has to make the first move to come away from him and when she does you will be there.flowers

Luckygirl Sat 14-Apr-18 18:49:38

It is always very difficult when a beloved child appears to be making a terrible mistake in choice of partner. I feel for you.

But - I do not think there is, as this stage, anything that you can do other than what you are currently doing - i.e. keeping up contact in a low-key way that maintains DD's awareness of your continuing love and concern, but does not get you embroiled in anything heavy.

TBH I think that it might have been better to restrain your anger on that fateful day; but you are a mother and seeing your DD in such a painful situation must have been very hard. But what is done is done - and was done out of love as I am sure your DD realises at some level.

Like everyone else I think you need to back away from any financial entanglements with this man, who is clearly now trying to intimidate and manipulate you as he has your DD.

Just try and keep a channel of communication open with your DD; and bide your time.

Antonia Sat 14-Apr-18 18:17:04

You know that your daughter loves you, and she herself probably knows that she has got herself into a very difficult situation. Giving money isn't the answer here, as others have said it will disappear into BF's pocket. They both need to wake up and realise that working for a living and getting a mortgage is the norm. You may have to wait a while but in the end your DD will realise who really loves her unconditionally: her mum, and she will be back.

gummybears Sat 14-Apr-18 16:42:23

He is trying to lure OP into paying for access to the potential grandchild.

This is a long con.

sparkly1000 Sat 14-Apr-18 15:06:12

He says there may be a baby on the horizon?
And follows with a threat that you will not be allowed to see the baby, You are not being paranoid. This is emotional blackmail at it' s very worst and using a potential grandchild is despicable.
This little shit has brainwashed your previously loving daughter and sister and she seems to be trapped in a toxic and controlling relationship.
If a pregnancy does ensue I would just congratulate the couple and leave it at there.

Dolcelatte Sat 14-Apr-18 10:53:12

Thank you so much for the further advice and compassion. I was worried that people would think I had brought it on my self, by making him leave my house on that day. My family and such friends as I have told (I feel a bit shamed to be honest), have been very understanding, but I do tend to dwell upon the 'If only'.

There seems to be a consensus that I should not give money and I can see that, if I were to do so, not only would I not see it again, but they might expect more. I would also be worrying that DD was just seeing me for ulterior motives rather than out of love, which I couldn't bear. I know what Goodbye means by the 'little seed of doubt'.

Lulu, they don't have a mortgage. They have been able to buy a house outright by moving to a cheaper area of the country.

I do believe that his father genuinely wanted his money out (with profit), as that was the original basis of going ahead. He either expected me to buy out his share in due course or DD and boyfriend to pay him back. They would easily have been able to get a mortgage and could easily have got jobs but chose not to do so.

I think it is a good idea to keep the contact but to keep it light. I have today sent a friendly e-mail just saying what we have been doing and some family news about her cousins etc

I expect there will now be another silence, although she might send me a text on my birthday if I am lucky. But I don't feel that I could be any more hurt than I have been.

Having said that we were all ok, boyfriend sent an email to the family about 18 months ago, saying how he would never forget my treatment of him that day, when everything changed. He also said that they were proposing to start a family in a couple of years, so making it clear that I should not expect to see my GC. Or do you think I am being paranoid?

I think one of the pp hit the nail on the head in saying that DD was dependent on me but has now transferred her dependency to her boyfriend. One of the things that also worried me about the property transaction, which I did not proceed with, was her saying that he was 'in charge now' even though it was my money. I fear that if we did give her any money outright , he would take it over.

Goodbyetoallthat Fri 13-Apr-18 18:16:50

Definitely try to keep open lines of communication, no matter how tenuous they may seem at the time. We went through a period of semi estrangement with our youngest daughter (not boyfriend related) & I found it so hard not to react to the hurtful comments followed by periods of estrangement.
2 years on things have vastly improved she has a boyfriend who actually enjoys coming to visit us & things are on a much more even keel (though I still have that seed of doubt at the back of my mind).

It is so hard but I really hope that it works out for you all.

luluaugust Fri 13-Apr-18 16:56:36

I agree however slight the contact keep it going where you can, perhaps your other daughters could try the occasional text. Definitely keep money out of it, you will never see it again and lack of it may bring things to a head without you having to be involved. If there is a mortgage on the house how are they paying it? Good luck.

lemongrove Fri 13-Apr-18 16:25:54

Good advice on here dolcelatte I would agree with not giving any money at all ( unless things change in the future).
If they won’t work then they will have to live on whatever they can ( what on earth do they live on?)
It sounds as if your DD used to very fixated on you, and niw she has transferred all that attention to the man in her life.
All you can do is write/text/phone and tell her that you will always love her and always have done, and that they are welcome to visit you.Could be that she will see his controlling behaviour for what it is and leave him, or, she may understand he is controlling but loves him enough to live with it.Sit tight!

M0nica Fri 13-Apr-18 16:13:36

Dolcelatte, usually in cases like this, when your DD is still so young, things can change very quickly and she will return.

Many years ago I had two friends in your situation, one played it cool and kept quiet and within two years, her daughter was back, chastened, still childless and unmarried and things gradually resolved. The other raised Cain, wept and threatened, her daughter narried the boyfriend from hell, had children and when some 10 years later she left him, he followed her and stalked her and needed to take out a restarining order.

No-one can guarantee the out come, but A is generally more successful than B'