Parents of grown up children

Barbara there is an acronyms button at the bottom with all the abbreviations

My now middle-aged sons and their OHs have never taken me for granted, though that would be difficult when I take three trains to visit either family. My first GD lived close by and, at the time, I was working at both paid and voluntary occupations as well as taking an OU course. I was never put under pressure to care for her and her half brother but saw a lot of them at weekends. My DGD is still very close to me, though living far off.

I think everyone has said the same as I believe re the topic of the thread. It's sometimes difficult to believe that there are people out there who have wonderfully appreciative adult children when your own world is falling apart because yours are not. It's also too easy to feel guilty reading of the difficulties of others knowing that your own are lovely hardworking people who would do anything for you.

There seems to be higher expectation from adult children when it comes to childcare.
Do the internet forums encourage bad behaviour?
Some of the mumsnetters are very dramatic in their answers to problems posted.
There never seems to be a measured answer or any middle ground considered.
Certainly, they are very sure of themselves. Very quick to reply to OPs, no time to have really given thought to the question.

Clarification. The mumsnetters are quick to reply to OPs on their forum.
Not me being quick on this thread.

Lisalou
I am old enough, young at heart, to be your mother.I had a mother whose view was ' get on with it'. I do believe that I made a rod for my back in making sure I did not have the same attitude to my children. Unfortunately my eldest could not 'put up' with a mother who was not letting her, as she informed me, 'stand on her own feet'.I am not included in her life. Her sibling was and still is quite the reverse. What is the answer.?

I too agree with MOnica.

Well said Monica. Having had no maternal upbringing and only physical and emotional abuse as a child I was terrified I'd be an awful mum. I was pretty clueless and yes, did a lot for them, spoilt them, paid debts off. They have never disrepected me, as they always knew how far to push, I do think it is in the bonding, that there isn't a self entitlement allowed to brew at any point, I do what I do because it's needed - not desired or wanted. And I'm under no pressure if I say no.

theres no manual that arrives with your first child.Its all a mystery that we have to work out for ourselves.The very fact that so many have great kids and relatively few problems is amazing.I dont believe anyone who says they've never had any problems or a days worry with their children.
I think we all get the same problems but react to them differently...and thats where the parenting comes in
Depending on your style of parenting ,you can tell them they made their bed and they must lie in it or you can help with whatever you can as much as you can .
I'm a help type .
My kids know they can come to me regardless of the problem and I'll do my best .
I do a lot of childcare ,my choice .I cant think of any reason why I wouldn't look after my GC,I enjoy it .
My stance is I dont interfere ...ever.Sometimes my kids will say I'm more likely to take their partners side than theirs...and thats true ..because I know how stubborn my son can be and how my daughter can be a bit of a drama queen .Its not hard to be nice to people and usually they are nice back ,at least thats what I find

I don't suppose it's invariably the case that such grown up children were spoilt and allowed to be selfish when younger, but you do have to wonder.

I have known one or two mothers who were complete doormats/slaves to their children. After a while of wondering why on earth they did it, it dawned on me that they actually derived some sort of perverse satisfaction out of making martyrs of themselves.

I suppose it's no surprise if such mothers go on in the same way when their children are grown up.

Similarly I've known one or two who never stand up for themselves or assert themselves, never say 'no' - and then moan about how they're taken advantage of.

I think some people actually enjoy having a grievance to moan about. My mother could be like this now and then - would never come out and say what she wanted, and would then complain that so and so had 'made' her do or have this or that.
But it took me many years to understand that she actually liked having a grievance to harp on about - she enjoyed feeling like a 'victim'.

I think it is a generational thing. Partly our ault for being to accommodating! Would our parents fallen in line like we do as grandparents. I know my mum wouldn't have done. I'm
also a strong believer that you are treated the way you allow yourself to be treated. People don't like assertiveness, and can up the anti, but stick with it, and they soon learn...and voila, a happier life for us grandparents (smile)

I agree with much that’s been said but also, sadly I think we live in a more egocentric society. A lot more is about what people can have for themselves, experience for themselves...and so on, and I know I’m generalising, but compromising, making do, and sacrificing, aren’t concepts of today. This can lead to quite selfish behaviour, even if it isn’t the intention. It makes me sad.?

What an interesting thread Lisalou and what a beautifully expressed post by MOnica. It is good to balance out the discussions and explore why some issues generate such heartbreak.

There is an old saying that it is not what you do for your children but what you teach them to do for themselves that is important. Effective parenting is basically a process of planned redundancy.

I count myself incredibly lucky I have two lovely DDs. We help one with childcare on one day a week and my DD and son in law said they will not ask us to do anymore than this due to the fact they want us to see looking after our granddaughters as a treat rather than a chore. They are both independent adults and very caring and unselfish.

Of the young adults I see who I think are a little selfish are the ones who were still being coddled by their parents in their late teens and early twenties. I think they have got so used to mum and dad doing everything for them they forget as they get older that things are not as easy or their parents may not want to spend 3 or 4 full days childminding.

Our 2 DDs were made to go out and get jobs from the age of 16 as we thought that earning their own money would not only teach them how to manage their finances but also help with their work ethic as they had to get up early on Saturdays to go to work either cleaning caravans, shopwork or waitressing. They both learnt how to work hard as they had no choice and now in their 30s are financially solvent and both in good jobs. Protecting young adults from the real world does them no favours. We always treated them with respect though and encouraged their dreams and supported them when they needed it without doing everything for them. We expected the same back from them and we are very proud of the young adults they have become.

There are lots of stories on Gransnet of adult children cutting out their parents which I think is very sad and indicates that there is a lack of tolerance in some families. Respect has to go both ways.

At the end of the day if you live yourself , respect yourself and have brought up your children to respect and love themselves and to respect others you rarely have problems
I work with disturbed and very challenging children. There parents invariably gave them e everything except discipline and that is the problem. Lack of respect.
Joe
Child Psychotherapist

Jimbowl, agree with your comments and views. Disturbed children that I worked with were invariably from families that were classed as disfunctional, the mom usually put herself first and the child was left with no boundaries or any positive role model. The times I heard, she doesn't listen to me, she doesn't care what I do. Then there are the others that indulge and spoil their children, because they never had what they can give their children. In both cases, no respect either side..

I wonder if it's a side-effect of always putting the children first and making them the sole focus - they've become so used to being centre stage that they don't know how to care for others, being the centre of the universe.
In the smaller families that we tend to have today they also don't get to practice looking after another sibling. Our generation couldn't really avoid it.

I can’t complain about my D she is our rock and she will go up of her way to help us. She’s a very independent girl, when she was a little girl she was quite capable of getting on with things and has grown up that way. She is now 47 has a partner but they have their own homes and they meet up and have holidays together go places. She has no children she didn’t want them has a very demanding job pays very well and has never borrowed from us in fact she has helped us with money when things were tight. So I can’t complain.

Sorry to say this, but you reap what you sow. It's up to parents to teach their children to have thought for others. Too many children have been indulged, which has made them selfish and uncaring.

Having said that, my own mother wanted me to move to Australia so I could care for her in her old age! She was a cold, selfish mother and I owe her nothing, so I felt no guilt for saying my own children mattered more to me than she did, so I'd be staying in England.

"You tea what you sow" is just too simplistic in this type of situation Osieleah in my opinion

"you reap!!!!*

I agree Madgran. We spent 27 years sowing seeds of love, patience, kindness, understanding, tolerance and forgiveness only to find that the 'crop' we'd so lovingly tended withered and died.

That said our other 'crop' of 35 years continues to flourish, tended to in exactly the same way as the other one.

I think sometimes parents who had difficult childhoods overcompensate with their own children, to give them everything they missed. I have a friend who is tough, resilient and fiercely independent; she and her siblings had dreadful childhoods but all did well and enjoyed successful careers. Yet she has two of the most demanding, selfish and spoilt adult children I have ever encountered, still demanding and receiving financial and emotional support for myriad problems and giving nothing in return.

easybee yes that may be the case for some parents. My point was only that it is not a given in all estranged families.

You do not necessarily reap what you sow. Some children from loving homes turn out nasty and selfish. Similarly there are children who have grown up in really dreadful homes who grow up into delightful adults.

However the chances that children brought up sensibly will turn out sensible is much higher than otherwise and the same for children from problem families, they grow up problems themselves.