Son and daughter don't get on

Totally agree with PaddyAnn They need to grow up

You're right morethan2 whatever the reason it's not pleasant. I hope you're feeling better Crazyh and get an opportunity to talk to them about it.

I have only read the OP, will catch up with replies later when I’ve got more time. I just want to say CrazyH I know you have a difficult time with your children from other threads. All I want to say is you’re not the only one. My son and my daughter have nothing to do with one another. My son cut my daughter out of his life, and now he’s turned on us because he says we favour and support her. She’s had a difficult time lately and is recovering from PND. We actually love all,our children but there’s nothing I can do about it.
CrazyH, I would say look after yourself, because it’s the best thing you can do, and let them sort out their differences.

CrazyH. I find it amazing that the posters on here are quick to judge with regards to alcohol, not once di I think that the children where there rather a drink after the party had ended. I hope you are okay.

This is why I love Gransnet. What a great place to dump all our issues and, hopefully resolve one or two.
There are few of us out there who do not have family challenges.
My usual approach is to back off and as my dear old departed Ma would say “ leave them alone and let them come home wagging their tails behind them”
It works in a variety of situations. Let them sort it out.
Look after yourself - I’m sure you deserve it.

Well said Stella49! Why DO children's parties need alcohol anyway?

Don't get me wrong, I like a drink just the same as anyone else BUT there's a time and a place. Personally, I can't see this particular family changing whilst ever they are behaving so selfishly and bickering amongst themselves when they really should be focussing in the children!

I was a single parent raising two boys with one year between them. They fought and argued constantly over trivia usually. After every disagreement I would drum it into them that brothers are the closest relative you can get and how lucky they were to have a brother. I explained in years to come they would always have one person to rely on when they needed help. Now in their 50's they are good friends and always there for each other, no matter what. So all can be mended with patience and tact. As for bickering adults. A good talk is needed on how to improve the situation. Children are very quick to pick up on family fallouts and could well repeat history themselves if they think it's the norm.

Have had no contact with a sibling since our remaining parent died twelve years ago. It was only towards the end of a fourth and final unsuccessful meeting I had set up after the death to try to build bridges that I was made aware of the jealousy, envy and resentment (feelings mentioned by BradfordLass72) which she had felt towards me over the years. This shocked me, as she was the one who (as the one expected to 'do well') had had the benefit of all our parents' material resources and support while we were growing up. But I was the one who was happy at my much more ordinary school - and made close friends there I still see regularly after over half a century. Our husbands were very different people, too, which did not help.

I feel sad that this has happened to us - but it takes two to tango - and there has to be commitment on both sides to make any relationship work. I wonder now if our differences had been recognised and discussed openly much earlier on - and/or we had had some proper family counselling - whether this would have made a difference....?

Tell them if they don’t grow up and sort it out you won’t take them!
Or just take your daughter.
They’re adults. Just because they are related doesn’t mean they have to get on.
My husband doesn’t speak to his sisters. He’s always said, if they weren’t related he wouldn’t be their friends so why bother. It’s a bit sad but you can’t force relationships.

BradfordLass, I'm a smoker who doesn't drink but I, like a lot of other smokers wouldn't dream of smoking where we shouldn't nor around those where it would cause upset, so why don't those who drink have the same manners and consideration ?

We smokers now know our places in society but those who drink don't ! It really gets my goat as the more they drink the more brazen they get and think they can do as they please but if you're seen to be smoking------------Bah !

Both smoking and drinking bring its equal share of illnesses and are pretty well in the same category as a strain on the NHS so why is smoking any worse than drinking ?

Both cause cancers and both are socially unacceptable. Maybe if there were the same labels on bottles as there are now on cigarette packets people might think twice ? Shrivelled brains, knackered livers, and shot-at pancreas's.

I don’t know the history of your son and daughters relationship before they became adults and if they have always had problems getting on with each other. I have two siblings and the oldest is just 18months older than me and we have never got on all through our growing up. He became worse when I reached an age of being in control of my own decisions. My mum went through hell and back as she loved us all. His constant need of control and upsetting everyone made my mum avoid telling him she saw her own grandchildren from his exe’s. He is basically narcissistic and no amount of reasoning would help him see what he was doing. His pent up jealousy has probably ruined his life. When my dad died and my mum had started showing signs of dementia he was paranoid about my mum ending up in care and there would be no inheritance. Mum had made me and my sister power of attorney and he made sure my sister would not abide by the conditions of the contract and this ended up with me not being able to help my mum even with the social services, mental health teams and the solicitors input. I know this has gone of track to your problems but would like you to be aware that sometimes no amount of reasoning will solve your problem but do be aware that when you are looking at the future when you may need help please pick the one child you can trust and not all of them especially if their is jealousy as it causes much pain and nearly destroyed me. I cannot even lay my mums headstone as she made us all executors and my brother grasps on that last piece of control as he knows it upsets me. If they don’t get on then don’t bring them together at family gatherings and look after yourself. They are just behaving like childish adults waiting for mum to choose sides.

I honestly think this is an awful thing to row and cause an upset at a child's birthday party. I would have asked them to leave. Also after a 4yr old niece ended up drunk from drinking half empty glasses of wine left while we were all washing up I barred all alchohol drinking to our garage until the kids were 12+ even for my OH. It has no place in a child's life. Sorry

My eldest who is 44 spoils every family occasion by getting drunk, she is very nasty when drunk and will always pick on someone for an argument ( usually me ) but a couple of years ago it was her sister, she isn’t particularly nice when sober but is vile when drunk ( I know I shouldn’t feel like this about my daughter) but I do love her.
It got to the point last Christmas Eve when none of the family ( not even her adult children)wanted her to come out for our traditional family lunch as we knew what would happen so we decided she wouldn’t be invited and I told her why, I know it hurt her but I thought it may teach her a lesson, why should everyone else’s Christmas be spoiled because of her, well a year later and I have invited her to a retirement lunch she was really pleased to be invited and said she’s going to drive.
My point is maybe your daughter could do this next time she is in her brothers company and so won’t be drunk enough to lose her inhibitions and loosen her tongue.

Your son shouldn't BE torn between his wife and sister ,his wife should come first .Maybe speak to them when they've all cooled down/sobered up and talk some sense into them

Unless his wife was being total arse! I would never side with my husband against my brother if he were in the wrong, and vice versa.
Disgusting behaviour at a child’s party though.

My 2 sons can be like this. I was telling son1 that son 2 was going on a weekend break and he told me he and wife were planning to visit same hotel.Then said we'd better check dates so not there at same weekend!?

Alcohol and children’s parties don’t mix! Sounds like it caused people to act up a bit. Stick to tea next time!

Seriously though I disagree with my brother on Brexit and other politics but would not dream of raising these with him at a family event. If he said anything to me I’d ignore him.

My two didn’t really get on as children and certainly don’t get on now. One of them has no contact with either the sibling or with us and I haven’t seen my youngest grandchild, who is five, from the age of three.

You can’t change it and you can’t go around walking on eggshells in case someone says, or unwittingly does, something that upsets the other.

I’ve learned to live with it.

crazyH - I think you should take them to London for your birthday - there are several positives in the situation you described, one being that your daughter and son are both willing to be in the same room at the same time - what erupts between them is a different matter - what is important is that they have not put up barriers between them yet and you are not in the position where they won't both come to family gatherings, as so many families are.
The next thing is that people never imagine themselves in a different situation, so for example, they won't be projecting themselves forward to the time when they both have children and they will be looking for cousin relationships for their kids. If I were you, I would make it clear that they are being taken by you for a birthday treat, and on that day be up front and say that they can both rein in their petty jealousies/conflicts as a sign of their respect for you - and then you should tell them to extend that respect for your dil and your grandchild(ren) so that those little ones get the chance to grow up with cousins and aunts/uncles they can rely on - in a time when so many young refugees are to be found who have no parents, aunts and uncles, we should be grateful for what we have and the potential to build strong family units. Give them a talking to. Enjoy your birthday.

I'm amazed at the memory of some of you lovely GNs. It shows how involved we are (in a virtual sense ) in one another's lives.
Yes, you're right ....this is not the first time my daughter and my older son, have locked heads. He can be very opinionated and obnoxious, unlike his younger brother. So can she, at times. We have a family joke that he suffers from 'middle child syndrome'
Someone here mentioned selecting one to hold my POA, not all 3. I will get straight on to it. I will choose the youngest, I think. At the moment all 3 are named. If only life was less complicated .......

Suggest a few words with your daughter are in order. She should be adult enough to know that we can't always like people. Her SiL may not be her choice for her brother for whatever reason, but she really needs to put a lid on things when they meet up at family occasions - the only one looking stupid will be her!
As far as your birthday is concerned, I'd make sure they are all told of your plans and that you may well have changed your mind due to their childish behaviour!

WOW what a lot of judgemental responses regarding drinking alcohol. They seem to be responding to a different thread than your original post. I read it three times but could not find the part where you stated 'everybody was rolling drunk and unable to look after the children' and where does it state you were also incapable. You describe being a 'bit drunk', in my case that means two glasses of wine and I feel it affects my judgement slightly, in the case of my sister-in-law that would need two bottles to have the same effect on her so everybody has a different threashold. A lot of responses here do not seem to differentiate between a social glass of alcohol and being 'drunk'. Most european countries of the world social drink all day everyday and are not 'drunk' or incapable of looking after children. Responsible drinking means just that and if people cannot manage their drinking in that manner then agreed they should not be drinking around children. Please do not assume though that just because you cannot control your drinking and so it is either drunk or no alcohol at all that others are the same and offer judgemental advice that the solution to the arguing is not to drink. There is moderation, and the solution to the arguing is the adults need to work on their maturity and self-awareness and that includes their own safe drinking limits. If they cannot achieve this then I would avoid large family gatherings. No, I do not drink much and Yes, I have a large problematic family that to not socialise peacefully so I choose which events to atend and which not.

Yes I have made a spelling mistake and yes I do know how to spell, I am very busy and trying to type fast, yes I could use spell check but am old school and prefer to check myself, yes there are proabaly grammatical errors but I am more interested in getting my content across than doing an English exam

Brandy butter when you have seen a 4 year old vomit at least 10 times and then be totally unresponsive, had a GP called out and worried the child was going to die you will feel differently. Just 4 glasses of wine left on a table while we washed up in the kitchen an adjoining room for 10 minutes. She drank the lot. I stand by my post alchohol and kids don't belong together.

I am so sorry you had this incident and glad it worked out well in the end. Your solution to prevent this happening in your family again is right for you but it does not mean this is the answer for the rest of the world. Children and alcohol cannot be practically separated the world over for every event. Other views would offer, children and alcohol should not be left alone together for even 10 mins, children should be taught not to touch alcohol, European countries give a taste of watered-down wine to young children to take away the element of the 'grown-ups only mystery' and so they rarely consume an adult drink, glasses of wine should be placed out of reach of children etc. I am not trying to upset you or disregard what must have been a very frightening experience for you just offering there are lots of other options to match your
stance.

CrazyH, I'm sorry this happened and hope your GS wasn't too upset by it. Also I know it hurts to see loved ones fighting, especially AC. So my sympathies are with you.

I'm a little confused, though, as to whether there was alcohol at the party or if you drank (a little too much) afterwards b/c you were upset. If it's the former, I'm going to chime in w/ those who say there shouldn't be alcohol at a child's birthday party and that might be why DS, DD, and DIL got so out-of-control.

I'm also confused about who argues with whom. You say, at first, it was DS and DD. But then you tell us DIL "ended up crying" and that DS was simply caught in the middle between her and DD. I get that you were a little drunk when you were writing that, LOL, but now can you clarify?

IMO, all 3 were very selfish to let that happen at at child's birthday party (unless they were drunk which was also a mistake, IMO). Unless the bday boy was their child, I think DS and DIL should have left as soon as they saw things were getting unpleasant. Same for DD. Better yet, somebody should have changed the subject before things got out of hand. It's awful to have these arguments blow up at family events, but especially at a child's party. If I were the parent of that child, I'm sorry, but the offenders would never be invited to my child's events again even if they were my own brother and sister. Or I just wouldn't have family to my child's parties, only friends.

As for your "big bday," I know it must mean a lot to you. But all the more reason why I wouldn't take the family to London. Why put effort and money into an event that might very likely be spoiled by selfishness and arguing? In fact, IMO, they should be planning a big day for you, but chances are, the issues between ODS/DIL and DD make such planning difficult. You might be happier going out w/ friends or celebrating w/ each of your AC and families separately. If your AC ask why, tell them.

Wishing you the best, in advance!