I have just found out I am a granny .... from a stranger.

Alexa of course some people mean to offend, if you didn’t read the post you really shouldn’t comment about it and you certainly shouldn’t castigate any posters who defended queenie over a nasty post

So sorry, OP

This is why it is so important not to expose children to toxic people, especially narcs. The goal is to stop the dysfunction from moving to the next generation.

I wonder what negative effects your daughter had from growing up caught in the middle of your mother and your relationship.

What kind of lies did your mother also say about you?

Queenie, hopefully now your daughter is now a mother she will reassess everything. Surely she has to know the real you and also her grandmother. Think Bluebells advice is spot on, send the flowers tell her you think of her everyday and love her, then take a back seat again. It must come from her.

Send a large bouquet of flowers and a lovely letter saying how delighted you were to hear the news. Say how happy she must be at being a mother - just like you were when she was born, and this pleasure actually increases as time and years go by. Repeat how much you love her and ask her if there is anything at all she needs or you can do to help - allshe needs to do is to contact you and ask.

As an estranged daughter, I am not sure I would receive those flowers with the same intent they are sent.

This daughter did not tell the mother she was pregnant. That is pretty huge by itself.
The length of estrangement is also telling, it has been at least a year.

This daughter clearly doesnt want her mother in her life. Flowers will not a difference for the better.

We still dont know what the lies told by the grandmother are.

Aww, this sounds so sad, and one of these situations where you find yourselves stuck in it, ebbing and flowing for years and years. I know how that feels. My gut reaction is to get rid of your mother for good, and focus on mending things with your daughter. You’ve been given a great chance, because you’ve been told about the baby. What a lovely place to start....a complete new beginning. My personal opinion is.....we gave, or should have given our parents so much joy, and we’re not responsible for them in any way. We are to our children though, so bite the bullet and go for it with your daughter. I wish you all the best, and congratulations for your new grandchild.

I'm estranged from my only adult child and consequently my gorgeous grandchild , nearly a year now. I found out that my son had another daughter born last November, don't ask me how I've carried on with my life , everything stopped and every day I live with grief sadness loss ..... I cared for my granddaughter from the age of 7 weeks. My loss is huge , Lord knows what my granddaughter was told at the time , lies , emotional abuse.... It's shocking... My DIL the gatekeeper.
No family member has helped me , they enable the estrangement to continue....
What can I say to help you , I'm afraid not a lot , life is ... Life is unfair.....

Aquamarine, can you see that by calling your DIL the gate keeper, you are basically saying your son is incapable of making his own choices or making a choice to contact you? Think about how that sounds to your son. I once said to my husband, when my MIL said something similar, "You realise your mother is suggesting you are spineless?" Men are very capable of making their own decisions about relationships and trying to sort out difficulties, if they choose to. For my husband though, he chose the comfort of just withdrawing rather than saying to his mother, "Hey Mum, there's a problem here, can we talk about it?"

If women are forced into the role of social secretary, then I suppose they are reasonably the gate keeper of their households, especially if the husband decides to put that on her too.

i think the modern way of each partner being the one responsible for contacting their own family of origin, has much to commend it. avoiding the social secretary situation.
back to OP, it is difficult to advise without knowing what/ how your mother said to turn your daughter against you.
i think it is risky sending anything or mentioning that you know about her child, to your daughter.
as another poster said, it is significant that she did not tell you herself about it.
so she might be annoyed, feel it as intrusive if you refer to it.
is there anyone who could be a go-between.
has it been 4 yrs estrangement.
i think we need more information to understand the situation, and see if we can suggest anything else. take care.

When an adult finds themselves in a coercive controlling relationship Oceanmama they can eventually become so enmeshed, that although they think they are doing so, they're no longer thinking for themselves but behaving in the way their partner wants them to behave.

The impact of coercive control in adult relationships is such, that it is now an offense under the law pertaining to domestic abuse.

The one in control is effectively a gatekeeper, as Aquamarine has said about her DIL. All abusers seek to isolate their 'victim' from those who maybe able to influence them, who may see things in the relationship that make them uncomfortable, and mention them to the 'victim'. The first ones to be cut out are usually close family, followed by close friends.

Women are not the only victims of domestic abuse, men are victims too.

Coercive control is insidious and and if cleverly done it is very difficult for victims to realise what is happening to them. One of the strongest and most "together women I have ever met and I know very well, got pulled into a coercive control relationship. She got out of it because her partner died!! If it could happen to her it could happen to anyone.

"Coercive control is insidious and if cleverly done it is very difficult for victims to realise what is happening to them." Spot on Madgran.

I agree with those saying do nothing, hard though that is.

Your daughter does not want contact with you and believes she is right not to want it, so she is unlikely to welcome it.

How awful.
My mother was a narc, she died a month ago.
The relief is enormous.
The lies were unforgivable, I know she tried to ruin every good relationship I ever had.
Your mother will never change, leave the door open your daughter may see the light.
I’m sad for you.