Where have all the dads gone?

One of my daughters has three children, two fathers, both completely useless. Father no 1 pays not a penny, and never has done.
He’s had two more families, three more children, since my daughter left him, and he only bothers to see his daughter about once a year, although he frequently visits his family who live in the next village.
Father no 2, been off work for three years with depression, so no money there either.
My daughter earns a good salary, but has been living with us for the last few years, because she would find it very hard on her own.
I’m not saying she hasn’t made mistakes, in both cases we all tried to warn her, but she’s a brilliant mum, and the children are happy.
I don’t want to knock all men, I know there are loads of brilliant dads out there, but for those who choose to walk away, there seems to be no way to make them pay up.

Thank you for your honesty Sara1954 it does tend to validate what I said upthread. Some lads are viewed as ‘baby daddies’ these days by the girls & nothing more is expected of them. Because taxpayers, grandparents & food banks WILL provide and these immature randy lads can’t believe their luck!

As I've just said in another thread, the millionaires in government have squandered millions in the last few years, a lot of it to their mates. And yet, we're focusing on what is probably the poorest group in society. It isn't called the feminisation of poverty for no reason.

Urmstongran

Thank you for your honesty Sara1954 it does tend to validate what I said upthread. Some lads are viewed as ‘baby daddies’ these days by the girls & nothing more is expected of them. Because taxpayers, grandparents & food banks WILL provide and these immature randy lads can’t believe their luck!

Many of these baby daddies are long term boyfriends who visit each weekend and leave cash on the table when they leave, of course this suits the single mum nicely.

Many of these baby daddies are long term boyfriends who visit each weekend and leave cash on the table when they leave, of course this suits the single mum nicely.

Really? Do you know one of these?

This is the ridiculous sort of urban myth that is created as an excuse to hate the poor.

I have a feeling Katie59 knows exactly what she speaks of GagaJo. Just because it doesn’t fit your narrative of sainted single mums doesn’t mean it’s not true & isn’t happening.

It always amazes me how a question about getting fathers to take more responsibility can very quickly drift to 'lazy grasping stupid women'. Any conversation about this does tend to end up blaming the women who have the temerity to stay around raising their children.

I got a letter 2 years ago from the CSA saying they were closing my claim for child support from my ex husband as there was no prospect of getting any money.
My children are in their thirties and my ex died about 7 years ago!!!
They never did get me a penny and I worked, paid the mortgage and brought up my kids on my own.
I also know of several families that have children to get more benefits. My neighbour for a time had 5 children with 5 fathers, one of her daughters has nine children with 8 fathers and her eldest daughter is now having her second child no partner in sight.
This is not the only family that behaves like this.

My own Mum was a single Mother. I don't think she realised when she was 20 that the man she was marrying was to become emotionally, physically and financially abusive.

The thinking that young women get given social housing and lots of benefits is seriously outdated.

Urmstongran

I have a feeling Katie59 knows exactly what she speaks of GagaJo. Just because it doesn’t fit your narrative of sainted single mums doesn’t mean it’s not true & isn’t happening.

Hang on, 'sainted single mums' is your phrase. Not mine. But poor single women love their children just as much as middle class married women, I'm sure.

There may well be the occasional case of money under the table. But as I keep saying on repeat, the real corruption is happening now, in government. THEY take our taxes and give them to their friends. Those amounts are in the millions.

Why aren't those who are up in arms about a 'baby daddy' giving the mother of his child some under the table cash, up in arms about the kleptocracy we have in power . They take our taxes to distribute amongst their friends and family. We have actual evidence for that. As opposed to 'a friend of a friend knows a girl who...

sf101 your account is worth reading. Again it doesn’t fit the narratives of the bleeding hearts.

Surely a government (and modern day technology) can come up with a robust way of extracting money from wayward dads? I’d like to learn what happens in Europe. Bet it makes interesting reading.

Perhaps we could get the money back that was thrown at millionaires for covid contracts too. I don't have an issue about getting dead beat dads to pay.

Urmstongran, your two phrases, 'sainted single mums' and 'bleeding hearts' are offensive. I have several phrases I could employ here about an attitude that is cruel and unkind.

They can quite easily set up a deductions of earnings order on someone's wages now if they are in employment, which most people are. The issues are generally with self employed men who hide their earnings in my experience but lets just concentrate on poor people and women. It is so unpleasant

Hang on, 'sainted single mums' is your phrase. Not mine. But poor single women love their children just as much as middle class married women, I'm sure

I’m sure they do GagaJo but love isn’t the issue here.
It’s money & where to get it from to help these single mums to provide for their children. Some children have such a hard sad life because in part, of the choices of their own parents.

Well, the dads anyway - deciding to leg it and there seem to be no disadvantages to choosing to do so.

Yes I get what you’re saying GagaJo about say Matt Hancock giving his mates financial advantages during the pandemic.

But this thread isn’t about that issue. More robust posters would call that out as ‘whataboutery’.

Matt Hancock walked out on his own family

Let's face facts there are as many different stories about and reason for someone being a single mother as there are reasons and stories about marriages and families. No situation is typical. There are girls who get pregnant because they want a baby and girls who get pregnant because they think the bloke might stay with her. There are fathers who abandon their children and mothers who chuck out the father. There are fathers who fight for their children and fathers who find it easier to stop seeing them. There are fathers who pay and fathers who don't.
What's the common denominator- children. The CSA was set up supposedly to make sure children were financially cared for, it plainly isn't working. But it's very obvious that a child brought up by one parent is going to be worse off financially than one brought up by two and that because women still earn less than men a child brought up by a mother will be worse off than one brought up by its dad. So is it beyond this country financially to provide adequate financial support to all children from birth to 18? Of course it isn't. But it suits a certain agenda to allot blame and castigate someone, sometimes the mother, sometimes the father. rather than meet what is an obvious need.

My daughter did eventually go down the CSA route, but was told that as he had three other children he wouldn’t reasonably be able to afford it.
Child 1 wants and expects nothing from him. We’ve told her it’s his loss, she’s a lovely bright, loveable girl, and he’s missed all of her growing up.

There are plenty of single parent families where the dad(s) are no where in sight. And the women live on benefits. I know this because I used to work in what is known as a deprived area when I was teaching. When I worked in Early Years we visited every child at home before they started school or nursery. The mothers told me about absent dads, ‘He lives with his mum’ or ‘They’ve got different dads’ or ‘She has nothing to do with her dad.’ It’s out there and happening and has been happening for years.
Incidentally I think the CSA isn’t fit for purpose. You only need to read this thread to see that that’s true.

Good thread for discussion Lizbethann.

I totally agree that there are a lot of feckless fathers out there but I hate the censure that falls upon women as somehow the architects of their own downfall if they are left struggling single mums.

I don't have any figures to hand - perhaps urmstongran could supply some - of the percentage of mums who use popping out babies as a lifestyle choice against others who are single mums due to circumstance but I think the circumstance mums are by far in the majority.

Either way, this thread was started to ask where are all the DADS but straightaway the discussion has turned, as always, to the MUMS.

Single mums don't need any more censure or criticism or Les Dawson style sniffing and bosom lifting about their plight, they have enough to put up with taking care of the kids they love, putting food on the table and struggling not only financially but with the heartbreak of no normal family life, of being abandoned by some prick seizing the next laaady opportunity and moving on.

What they do need is a robust, fit for purpose CSA - we agree on that urmstongran - to ensure that walkaway fathers completely fulfil their financial responsibilties.

A shift in perception, so that censure falls on the all louche, useless dads whistling off to their next families, would be nice but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

Urmstongran
Just to say, these men are not ‘Randy lads’
Both now in their late forties, but with absolutely no sense of responsibility.

I do wonder when the pendulum swung so far the other way? No one wants the draconian measures back of sinful girls being forced to give their babies up for adoption (but there were no handouts and family shame in the community was a powerful driving force in the 50’s). Ireland’s catholic laundry scandal haunts folk to this day.

But surely we are too soft, too kind, too non-judgemental these days? Okay girlie you want a baby. But how are you going to provide for it? Have you even thought about it? No? Well don’t worry, us taxpayers can be dad - no problemo!

The system is clunky and not working. It needs fixing and however it’s done, more robust arrangements put in place.

Harder times are coming. That should focus minds. Sadly, unless we are rich, none of us can just have what we want in life.

I know of a man, 3 children to 3 different women and has NEVER paid anything to help with the children's upkeep. I also know of a lady who received I think £30 when her child was born, then dad was never seen again. However, to a certain extent it hacks me off because taxpayers ( unless mum works and sometimes cannot) are paying for the children when the dads should be, but dad is too busy swanning off romancing his next victim. Sadly the cycle goes on. I feel sorry for all the babies with no dads, and all the mums left bringing up baby on their own.

Apologies- some x posts as I was typing

Totally agree with you there Nannee49. I think my fury at these irresponsible feckless dads just spilled over. I sincerely apologise for homing in on the single mums but it just makes me SO furious how our governments can’t get a grip of the fathers (round the throat and up against a wall would be a good start) and force them to pay up.