Where have all the dads gone?

They can quite easily set up a deductions of earnings order on someone's wages now if they are in employment, which most people are. The issues are generally with self employed men who hide their earnings in my experience but lets just concentrate on poor people and women. It is so unpleasant

Perhaps we could get the money back that was thrown at millionaires for covid contracts too. I don't have an issue about getting dead beat dads to pay.

Urmstongran, your two phrases, 'sainted single mums' and 'bleeding hearts' are offensive. I have several phrases I could employ here about an attitude that is cruel and unkind.

sf101 your account is worth reading. Again it doesn’t fit the narratives of the bleeding hearts.

Surely a government (and modern day technology) can come up with a robust way of extracting money from wayward dads? I’d like to learn what happens in Europe. Bet it makes interesting reading.

Urmstongran

I have a feeling Katie59 knows exactly what she speaks of GagaJo. Just because it doesn’t fit your narrative of sainted single mums doesn’t mean it’s not true & isn’t happening.

Hang on, 'sainted single mums' is your phrase. Not mine. But poor single women love their children just as much as middle class married women, I'm sure.

There may well be the occasional case of money under the table. But as I keep saying on repeat, the real corruption is happening now, in government. THEY take our taxes and give them to their friends. Those amounts are in the millions.

Why aren't those who are up in arms about a 'baby daddy' giving the mother of his child some under the table cash, up in arms about the kleptocracy we have in power . They take our taxes to distribute amongst their friends and family. We have actual evidence for that. As opposed to 'a friend of a friend knows a girl who...

My own Mum was a single Mother. I don't think she realised when she was 20 that the man she was marrying was to become emotionally, physically and financially abusive.

The thinking that young women get given social housing and lots of benefits is seriously outdated.

I got a letter 2 years ago from the CSA saying they were closing my claim for child support from my ex husband as there was no prospect of getting any money.
My children are in their thirties and my ex died about 7 years ago!!!
They never did get me a penny and I worked, paid the mortgage and brought up my kids on my own.
I also know of several families that have children to get more benefits. My neighbour for a time had 5 children with 5 fathers, one of her daughters has nine children with 8 fathers and her eldest daughter is now having her second child no partner in sight.
This is not the only family that behaves like this.

It always amazes me how a question about getting fathers to take more responsibility can very quickly drift to 'lazy grasping stupid women'. Any conversation about this does tend to end up blaming the women who have the temerity to stay around raising their children.

I have a feeling Katie59 knows exactly what she speaks of GagaJo. Just because it doesn’t fit your narrative of sainted single mums doesn’t mean it’s not true & isn’t happening.

Many of these baby daddies are long term boyfriends who visit each weekend and leave cash on the table when they leave, of course this suits the single mum nicely.

Really? Do you know one of these?

This is the ridiculous sort of urban myth that is created as an excuse to hate the poor.

Urmstongran

Thank you for your honesty Sara1954 it does tend to validate what I said upthread. Some lads are viewed as ‘baby daddies’ these days by the girls & nothing more is expected of them. Because taxpayers, grandparents & food banks WILL provide and these immature randy lads can’t believe their luck!

Many of these baby daddies are long term boyfriends who visit each weekend and leave cash on the table when they leave, of course this suits the single mum nicely.

As I've just said in another thread, the millionaires in government have squandered millions in the last few years, a lot of it to their mates. And yet, we're focusing on what is probably the poorest group in society. It isn't called the feminisation of poverty for no reason.

Thank you for your honesty Sara1954 it does tend to validate what I said upthread. Some lads are viewed as ‘baby daddies’ these days by the girls & nothing more is expected of them. Because taxpayers, grandparents & food banks WILL provide and these immature randy lads can’t believe their luck!

One of my daughters has three children, two fathers, both completely useless. Father no 1 pays not a penny, and never has done.
He’s had two more families, three more children, since my daughter left him, and he only bothers to see his daughter about once a year, although he frequently visits his family who live in the next village.
Father no 2, been off work for three years with depression, so no money there either.
My daughter earns a good salary, but has been living with us for the last few years, because she would find it very hard on her own.
I’m not saying she hasn’t made mistakes, in both cases we all tried to warn her, but she’s a brilliant mum, and the children are happy.
I don’t want to knock all men, I know there are loads of brilliant dads out there, but for those who choose to walk away, there seems to be no way to make them pay up.

When ex-DiL decided she didn't want to be married to our DS it was entirely her decision - it came as a surprise to him - and she wasn't an exception. I've heard of a number of men who have been in the same situation, and equally shocked.

DS has always cared for his daughter 50% of the time. However, not all men have been as lucky. Another I know of would love to spend time with his daughter but his ex is obstructive even though he is an honest upright citizen.

It seems to me that some women choose to abandon their children's fathers simply because, these days, it is relatively easy to do. They can work, they should get financial help from the ex-partners, and it is more socially acceptable, even if it isn't always easy. Men frequently get the blame, but it isn't always their fault.

There will always be some girls who get pregnant to start their own family after leaving a bad one, those who get pregnant without bothering with contraception , those who are just promiscuous, and maybe ‘some’ that do it to try a short cut for a home !! But I m much more sceptical about that and of your story Umstrongran ( not saying your husband didn’t hear it) but I don’t think that really happens it’s a bit of an urban myth so many young girls with babies are in hideous bedsit’s, or temporary housing with just a microwave to cook on and a single bed and cot They aren’t given a houses or flat quickly! just the same way that some people insist refugees are given flash houses etc etc which just doesn’t happen, most are housed in dire situations

And none of this addresses the situation of a married woman a family woman being left with the children while the man walks away to start again with the next woman and doesn’t support the family he left

Seems as though the CAB are pretty toothless. This whole sticky mess needs a fresh approach. I wonder what is the best practice in some European countries? I would put money on it they’re not as soft as us about it all. We just mentally shrug it off thinking there’s no alternative but surely there has to be?

Very good point Katie59.

*spex

Agree with what teacheranne said.

You’ve got rose tinted apex on Gagajo about lifestyle choices. Himself was at an ATM years ago in Eccles during his lunch hour. Behind him two mums with buggies we’re chatting. One had two babies, the other had three. He heard the one with three confide to her friend “you need to get another one babe then you’ll be minted”. She then outlined the reasons why. He said he felt quite dispirited returning to work.

The benefit system has a lot to answer for.
Take 2 sisters one leaves school gets a job which pays for a rented flat and works her socks off to be independent.
The other gets pregnant and gets her own social flat and benefits, she is not allowed to have a man living with her so drifts through a succession of casual relationships, trapped as a single parent.

The benefits system should encourage couples to live together not make it financially impossible, a very large proportion of single parents cannot afford a partner living in they would loose too much benefit.

And what do women do when men abdicate their responsibility? You can't condemn women for mens mistakes. Until we have a society that holds men accountable for the children they make, this system will continue.

Relationships break down. And if the state can't make men pay, what chance does one woman on her own have? I speak from experience. My ex husband owes me thousands of pounds of back child support from 25 years ago.

Exactly.I remember hearing the famous footballer Martin, talking about struggles when young on the family due to low income and how hard it was on mom, but where was dad? I can understand those widowed and some men they just father children and walk away whether they are married or not. Some set out to do it alone , that I can’t understand, what a mistake for everyone involved, some even do it twice. Do they think ifvtgeveffectbon that child or just the fact they wants child. Surely if you had one child without a father, you would not make the same mistake. You bring a child into this world, they are for life, we owe that child the best we can give. They need a mom and a dad, grandparents and family, a place to live.

Gagajo the same happened to me I gave them addresses every time he moved but they never ‘found’ him although the first address was his parents and he was there for some months
I never got a penny for his three children, not one penny

Maybe the dads are just not being interviewed, or are at work in low paid jobs so not around much? Not everything we watch on TV is telling the full story. Sometimes programme producers deliberately look for situations which fit the agenda rather than give a balanced picture.

However, there will be single families where fathers are absent for lots of reasons as there always have been. Equally there are two parent families who don’t know how they are going to feed the children or pay energy bills, it’s rare to see them being interviewed.