Faith or indoctrination?

Some of the myths from other religions are very odd, and quite scary. At least ours are nice.

I sing to our apple trees on cold dark nights in December. Everyone does. Don't they?

Don't they???!!!

You reckon the story of Christ's (and those other fellows') crucifixion – essentially the entire basis of Christianity) is a "nice" story? Gosh.

Have you seen the Stations of the Cross in Catholic churches? Most are revolting.

Revolting depictions of a revolting story.

I thought we did have freedom of religion in the UK, even though there is an established church in England! A lot more freedom of religion than in some secular states.

Obviously not the crucifixion.

I was thinking more of the stories Jesus told. (the parables)

I liked 'em anyway. Although the prodigal son did make me a bit cross.

this is a good one Bags (read all of the article.

I chose to become a Christian when I was 15 with no input whatsoever from anybody else. I remained a Christian for over 20 years until it no longer made much sense and I felt was never allowed to question any of it, even the most bizarre outrageous stories within the religion. I then turned away, was agnostic for a while, was atheist for a while too. I now consider myself to be a Unitarian which allows me to question everything and does not say it is the ultimate and only truth, as many religions do. I think I believe in some greater force, although I no longer believe in this loving God stuff. However, my days of being a Christian are deep rooted as I still believe that I will be punished somehow because I do not believe in God. No matter how I try I simply cannot shake off the concept that I will somehow be overlooked because I won't repent of my 'sins'. The fear that religion can often instil in us is deep rooted and remains a way of controlling us. In many ways religion can be a source of empowerment but in other ways it's a damnation and often impossible to totally shake off.

If we have freedom of religion already in this country, then that is cause for rejoicing all round. Now we need freedom from religion in places where it has no right as well, which is why there shouldn't be church representatives in one of our parliamentary houses. Religious representatives should not have any more say in how the country is run than any other person on the electoral register; their membership of a religion should be irrelevant. It's about equality for all and no political or social privileges simply because of your religion (or lack of it).

Yes, the parables are fine, but Aesop wrote some good ones too. It's the original sin malarky and someone having to be tortured and killed in a barbaric way and all the bullshit about hell that gets on my wick. And that is the basis of the faith part of christianity. The moral, ethical part can be found everywhere, faith or no.

Nope - don't see any levity but do see lots of narrow- minded, self-righteous twaddle!
Noone has yet explained to me how attempting to include our neighbours is a serious threat to society as we know it ( or society as SOME of us know it ).
Have reached the stage I did last night - bored so off to check on 2 lovely sleeping GC's. Good luck to anyone attempting an intelligent balanced discussion!

Wow!

What a lovely lady.

Freedom of belief also includes the right not to believe.

Yes. But it doesn't protect one from things such as this (CofE trying to enforce archaic law and make non-churchgoers pay for church repairs). Freedom from is different from freedom of.

More complicated than the press story suggests en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chancel_repair_liability. And it has nothing to do with religion; this kind of dispute over land ownership and liabilities dating from the Middle Ages or even later crops up all the time. Personally, if I had been on the PCC of the churches that took action on CRL I would have voted against asking for the money. But I think there is an obligation on the church involved to inform people of the liability so that they can take out insurance and inform future potential buyers, as they should have been informed.

The doctrine of original sin has such a lot to answer for - generations of the guilt-ridden. Wondergrans's sneaking guilt about her non-belief is a case in point.

Yes, but it's entirely possible to be a Christian without accepting all that rubbish about original sin etc. Is that just a Catholic concept?

Britain is not a Chritian country because I can write this and not be burned for heresy. Very good essay by C S Groome.

CofE invests heavily in G4S prisons according to Frances Crook, CEO of the Howard League for Penal Reform. Makes money from punishing people. Very Christian!

#freedomFROMreligion is important for justice and fairness.

This is a genuine question. I accept that investing in some dodgy organisations is unethical. I don't like G4S, I'd prefer all our prisons, and other public services, to be owned and managed by the state. Given I don't live in a place where that happens, why is it unethical for the CofE to invest in G4S. The church needs funds, society needs for some folk to be locked up - job done is my simple view…….

Archbp Cantab. has just said that Britain is a post-Christian country.

@Ana - Are you saying it's possible to be a Christian without accepting the things that define Christianity? Because that doesn't make sense. Mind you, that is what so many people do - it's called "cherry-picking", and allows you to pick out the 'nice' bits and ignore the rest... but is that something you would support?

But then... from what O read here it seems that religion is all a matter of 'wouldn't it be nice if...' and not a lot to do with reality at all!

"The church needs funds". Yes. To keep its palaces in order and to keep its bishops in the manner to which they have become accustomed. Oh, and to keep prisons up to scratch. Don't forget that.

Sorry. It just seems a bit remote from the cuddly, forgiving Jesus image.