Stephen Fry on meeting God ...

Ah but is He?

Elegran there are many Christians who would agree with the points you make. I'm one of them.

The "facts" as they were in the Old Testament at the time might have been suitable for the readers at the time. If God could foresee that Jesus would update the Old Testament in favour of the New, perhaps He also foresaw that with more research and more detail being uncovered with every century, the "facts" of the timescale of the universe would become clearer.

Haha! soon. Thanks for the laugh.

God changed the rules. He didnt forsee it right at the beginning.
He was forced to change the rules along the way.

Ah! so that's how people cope with the inconsistencies, just move the goal posts.

More chuckles.

elegran as I've read my way through this thread I have wondered if I'd ever think of an explanation of the whole myth of creation in 7 days that would make sense to soon.
I touched on it earlier but it was once again head and brick wall time.
So congratulations on your last 2 paragraphs! Well done.
soon doesn't that make some sense?
Each 'day' in the Genesis story represents a period of time. A day is a symbol for an era.
Haven't you noticed that chronologically the 6 days of creation follow the same pattern and progression as the theory of evolution. So all credit to those ancient writings for seeing a logical development.
I've used this analogy in teaching and most children accept and understand the concept.
It's one of the reasons I was curious about soons views contradicting what children are taught in schools.
Either one has to tell children that school (and science) are wrong, or you really confuse them!!

The Bible has always been like this.

The goalposts ahvent changed. It has always been thus.

If I had known when I joined this site, that most posters did not know such things as this, I would have spelt it out back then.
I wrongly assumed, that virtaully all posters already knew this.

That is why I have never answered the "eye for an eye" type posts.
I wrongly assumed that virtually all posters knew that God changed the rules.

Instead, I now realise that virtually all posters, didnt know.

The original plan, by God, did not involve sending Jesus.

I take serious issue ( I.e. am bl**dy cross) at the assumption that we do not know. There are some serious brains and (more importantly) a whole heap of common sense on this site so don't get patronising about your "superior knowledge".
The only thing you are spelling out is an unthinking, unquestioning , irrational belief in your literal interpretation of the Bible.

We know " plenty", but some of us don't share your fundamentalism having perhaps had a more enlightened education, religious or otherwise.

If God has accepted that rules and concepts need tweaking and adapting why can't you?

So if god changed the rules did he then agree with the subjugation of women and them not having a place in any christian church? Because that was the result of the suppression of any accounts written by women.

soon, perhaps you would like to read this article and respond? The writer articulates (much better than I ever could) something of my own views.

Soutra, I know that you know.

mcem. The 7 day bit. The Bible is quite specific by saying "And there was evening and there was morning, the first day."
"And there was evening and there was morning, the second day" etc.

The Hebrew word, yom, can have a number of meanings, only one of which is "day of 24 hours."

mcem. The Bible has a beginning, a middle and an End. It is complete as it is.

So you think we should all stop learning anything else at all ? That no-one should examine the world about them?

Not study the stars, the planets, the nature of space, the continents, the oceans, the structure of the rocks, the chemistry of water, the anatomy of plants and animals and the way they grow and reproduce, the way their DNA governs the transmission of heredity, the history of life, from single-celled creatures in the primeval soup through creatures of more and more complexity and refinement, the lost species that couldn't thrive in changing conditions and the ones where some slightly different individuals managed to struggle through and reproduce to fill the gaps in the ecosystem?

You reckon we can just sit in the dark staring at our navel and say "No need. All knowledge was codified long ago. Everything else is false. Pull down the blind. The light is too dazzling."

I'll end my contribution to this thread with a quote from Dawkins' 'The God Delusion':-

The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. (p. 31)

I want nothing to do with this so-called god. I guess I first started to question when I read about Abraham and his son Isaac, Abraham being willing to murder his son. I was a child, and utterly disgusted and horrified. My nature is to question and I always did, until I rejected the lot.

Deliberately closing your mind is the only way to accept the bible. My mind is to important to me to close it down.

trisher - assuming I am understanding your post correctly.
Yes, the women keeping quiet in services is in the New Testament too. So they are not allowed above a certain point.

grannyactivist - as far as I understand that article, the writer goes with science. I go with God.

Soontobe I do indeed know what I know, I also know the earth is not flat, the waters did not "cover the face of the entire earth" , the world was not created in 6 days, Eve was not created out of one of Adam's ribs and the moon is not made of green cheese.
Mind you, I am open to argument on that last one.

Elegran. No I dont think that at all. Definitely not.

soon. You claim to be a Methodist, so how do you square the prevalence of female clergy in that church with your adherence to the notion that women must keep quiet in church?