Generation War; Our Mothers, Our Fathers.

OH and I visited the village of Oradour-sur-Glane a few years ago. We didn't quite know what to expect, but what we saw imprinted on our minds and in fact reduced us to tears. The awfulness of what befell those poor people was very very dreadful, and a lasting memorial of man's inhumanity to man. I'm not sure that I could face Auschwitz or any of the camps, facing the terrible things that happened there would I think need steady nerves. If I had lost family there then I would go as I would feel that I owe it to their memory, but not otherwise.

My son has been to Auschwitz twice; once on his 'grand tour' and then again when he went there with his girlfriend. Everyone said it was a strange place to take a girlfriend to [they were touring the area; he didn't take her just there] but it's somewhere that I would have been pleased for a boyfriend to take me to when I was young. He was very moved by it. I did go to Berchtesgarden [sp] on my grand tour, although I'm ashamed to say I don't remember much about it.

Yes they are Rowantree, especially my son who I hope will come with us. Next year the local dignitries are planning a memorial plaque for all the airmen who lost their lives in that area, and we hope to go then. Also my archivist friend is writing a book about these same airmen and their story, so I have been able to contribute my father's service record, plus a lot of photos of him during his time in the RAF. I am looking forward to receiving a copy in due course.
OH and I are going to France this summer too! My SIL lives in Limoges and we are going there for a couple of weeks later this year. I hope you go to France too and that it helps to relax you.

Nellie, I can't imagine what it must feel like to have never known your father but I can well understand your wish to visit his grave and learn more about his story. I really hope you go. It was another world, but part of our own personal history too and we need to go back, even though we know that they aren't 'there' any longer. Maybe it's a need to reconnect with our past.

I won't be going this year - I had thought I could do it, but my dodgy mental health problems were such that I couldn't contemplate it at the moment - and it would mean going by train, and visiting Berlin and Krakow and maybe Warsaw, where others of my family perished in the ghetto in 1942.
I am hoping I can make the journey next year though. This year we're going to France by car, which I hope I can cope with better!

It's good that your father's grave is still being looked after - how wonderful. I wish my grandparents had graves, but of course millions didn't.
When are you planning to visit? Presumably you'll take lots of photos. Are your family interested too?

Goodness Rowantree, your post IS interesting. I simply can't imagine how it must feel to know that 'for the grace of God' your father would have met the same awful fate as the rest of your family. I think it is so brave of you to visit where you came from and even more amazingly to visit Auschwitz, but I know a bit how you feel. I have been planning to go to Holland where my father and his companions are buried in a Protestant graveyard and have been in touch with a Dutch Archivist who has been absolutely fantastic, filling me in with details of the crash with photos (the Germans were very meticulous!!) photos of the grave, and telling me of the fact that they are so beautifully looked after by the local population. I do want to go, BUT I am quite apprehensive as to my reaction. I never knew my father, but I have found details of his demise quite upsetting and have wondered how I will cope with meeting him so to speak. So I keep putting it off, and feeling cross with myself for doing so. They were such brave young men and I MUST visit them all and say hello and thankyou.
I would be very interested to know about your visit and how you coped emotionally, if that is you are willing to discuss it.

I watched this with much interest. My grandfather won the Iron Cross in WW1 but it didn't save him or my grandmother from Auschwitz, or others of my family. That I am here today is thanks to the Kindertransport who facilitated the rescue of several thousand children, of whom my father was one.

I thought it was fictitional but the closing credits implied that at least one character was still living - was that then a dramatic ploy?

I agree that there were far too many co-incidences - they kept meeting/bumping into each other, and I am sure that they wouldn't have been so open about their friendship with Viktor. My father recalls his former friends shunning his company as a child because he was Jewish, and my grandfather's former colleagues in his old batallion wrote to tell him he wasn't welcome any more at their get-togethers. Viktor would have definitely had to wear the Yellow Star after 1941.

The Nazis regarded the Poles as 'untermenschen' - but I do know there was, and still is, widespread antisemitism. I am trying to psych myself up to visit Bytom in the next year or so - it's now in Poland but was in Upper Silesia when my father lived there as a child. I want to see where he lived, and where my grandparents were moved to...and finally visit Auschwitz, where so many, including my grandparents, great-aunt and other relations were murdured. I am not sure how much assistance I will get once I'm there, but I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

Notwithstanding all my reservations, I found the whole series riveting. I haven't yet watched the discussion, but we've recorded it and I will watch it this evening.

I did too Tegan. As I understand it Poland WAS anti-Semitic! I can see that they were upset by this portrayal, and I'm sure that a lot of people weren't, but a lot were!! There were anomalies in the series, I can't quite see that Viktor would have been able to walk so freely with Gerta around Berlin in 1941 without incurring a load of trouble for both of them! also surely he would have to have worn a yellow star? Presumably the meeting at the end was pre-arranged?!! In spite of this I DID enjoy it very much and didn't go to sleep once!!

Agreed; just look at Yugoslavia .I've read that the Poles [understandably] are rather upset by the series as the Polish characters were portrayed as more anti Semitic than the German ones. And that Viktors storyline was changed to fit in with available locations; he was originally intended to go to America. However, grumbles aside I still enjoyed [if that's he right word] the series.

I agree Tegan I think 'Hitler' is alive and well in a manner of speaking and we do have to be mindful. Watching a series like this does perhaps remind us in the West in particular the horrors of a full blown conflict. These often start as a skirmish and develop while hurtling down that slippery slope till it's too late. sic: 'Evil flourishing while good men do nothing' comes to mind.

Oh how sad, nellie. We often have conversations about this and have agreed that both myself and my daughter would have kept our heads down and protected our family whereas my ex husband would have risked our lives and been a Schindler type person. The film, Sophies Choice springs to mind when we explore the subject. People like Hitler are probably around all the time but need the right environment to thrive, so we need to always be on our guard.

I have always struggled to try and unravel in my mind as to what the German public did or did not know, what they turned a blind eye to, did a double think about, and any conclusions I come to seem to beg more questions! I think it was/is easy for us in our Island home to judge, perhaps rather highhandedly and moralistically what they should or shouldn't have done once the monster took over. Yes a lot of the population, especially young people were brain washed, older people perhaps less so, but I feel that the problem started at the end of the first war when Germany was SO beaten into the ground in every respect opening the door to the 'monster' and future disaster. How would I have behaved? Well there's a question! I have a sneaking (if I'm totally honest!) feeling that, while being very uncomfortable, I too would have turned a blind eye, been a double thinker. They were brave people indeed who spoke up. I have researched into and discovered the name of, the pilot of the night fighter who was himself killed a few weeks later, that shot down and killed the crew of Lancaster ED347, one of whom was my father. What do I feel about these deaths? Certainly no animosity, but a tragedy and a total waste of young lives, which about sums up the whole saga from start to finish.

I need to watch the discussion on iplayer if I can; I saw the beginning but had an early start the next day so had to go to bed. The write up on Wikepedia is very good. As a historical series it was quite wrongly written to show the Germans as totally innocent of knowing what the Nazis were trying to achieve but as a three part drama it was awesome. I'm still struggling with beautiful Friedhelm's death . But I so want to watch Heimat again; maybe BBC4 might consider showing it at some point? Also made me think [without mentioning any particular party but I'm sure you'll know who I mean] about how easy it is for people to be duped into hatred for their fellow citizens.

Yes, OH and I watched this and were riveted to it. The acting was superb and the 'subject' so thought provoking. The scene where the officer shoots the little girl was quite shocking, also the singer being shot right at the end of the war, an act of completely needless cruelty. Mind you this was nothing to what the Russians would have done had they found her. What terrible times they were, and perhaps we should all be mindful of what dreadful things even so called civilised human beings can do each other.

I watched this and thoroughly enjoyed it. Very good actors.

A scene I found harrowing was when the Polish AK leader, upon discovering a train wagon carrying Jewish prisoners, cold heartedly closed the doors on them again.

The discussion following the series was very interesting.