Phillip schofield

Is it possible to discuss moral issues on this thread , so many accusations without a scrape of evidence

I think the 'poor Phil' narrative is forgetting the boy in the case. PS has a flat, which I gather is up for sale for £1.2m, a house worth far more, a place in Portugal adjoining Holly's (reputedly worth £8m) and millions in the bank. He is 61 - an age when many people are looking to retire with far less behind them. He could walk away and have a life that most of us could only dream of.

The boy is in his 20s, has no job, a 'reason to need a lot of money in his life' according to Eamonn Holmes, and may struggle to get work in TV again.

Whatever people may think about 'trial by media', which this is not - it has just been people saying that PS was difficult to work with and that he had an inappropriate relationship with a much younger man - any sympathy going should surely be for him?

I am well aware of the decision of the ECHR NanaDana, but I think you missed the point of my post. I assume you have not followed the presentation of evidence and cross examination in a UK court and witnessed how a case that seems ‘open and shut’ on the evidence before the general public turns out to be anything but as the case unfolds. In any event, talk of a fair trial is somewhat premature when there is no evidence of criminality.

I'm pursuing the line of thought that it gets difficult is whenthere are children growing up without enough support and can be very unhappy and at sea and a good relationship with the teacher/coach can make all the difference.

Its defining the boundaries.

I dont know how on earth we change society so that male predators (and I mean small scale ones, not "pure evil" ones) think its OK to cross lines. Thats why we need more discussion about what those lines are.

I agree Galaxy. Wyllow’s point about teacher, social worker, therapist applies to football coach or workplace mentor as well. Especially in the heady atmosphere of tv

Teacher, social worker, therapist !

JaneJudge

Galaxy

I think we have to explore really difficult topics. When is having a relationship with a young person who you knew at 15 ok? We should as a society be able to talk about those issues.
Is what woody allan did ok? Should we not talk about that.
I am not comparing the two I just think if we dont talk about moral issues relating to power and young people we let them down.

I agree with you.

I really, really agree with this. When does an especially good relationship with a teacher or social worker or therapist- needful for the 15 year old - cross the boundary?

Its not enough to say, "touch" because although that is a no go boundary, emotional boundaries can be just as significant.

I get that point, however its an invitation to make a huge media circus so it cant come to court in that case?

NanaDana thanks, I did read that.
I didn’t think that there was anything ageist at all about it.
But it’s very easy to interpret things differently, especially when it’s solely the written word - so I’m not going to ‘disagree’ with you, as I don’t know what the poster actually meant (I can’t recall who it was)

Germanshepherdsmum

People often say, based on media publicity, that someone won’t get a fair trial. If they were to sit in court and watch a trial by jury, the way evidence is presented and people are cross-examined, they would realise that things in a courtroom look very different to sensationalist news items and social media gossip.

Unfortunately the European Court of Human Rights don't agree with you, GSM. I thought you had some legal background, or am I thinking of someone else? In considering the issue of excessive media coverage of a case, the ECHR have formally ruled that such coverage can indeed breach the right to a fair trial. They also state that " an extremely negative press campaign ... may affect the fairness of the trial and the impartiality of the jury". I think that's clear enough.

Anniebach

She hanged herself in February, was to appear in court in March

Annie, with all due respect, this logic suggests that anyone threatening suicide should not be tried in court.

Blackmail is blackmail, and should not be indulged.

I don't know a lot about the CF case, but my understanding is that she was a very troubled woman who took her life because of the impending court case, brought against her for domestic violence. It's very sad, but nothing to do with the Schofield case, which is about something different entirely.

Anniebach

Not possible to wipe from people’s minds what they have read

Absolutely, Anniebach. That's exactly why the European Court of Human Rights, in considering has the issue of excessive media coverage, has ruled that such coverage of a case can breach the right to a fair trial . They have also ruled that "an extremely negative press campaign.. may affect the fairness of the trial and the impartiality of the jury . "

FannyCornforth

NanaDana I don’t think that I have seen any ageist comments; or anything unfavourable about Mr Fry in particular.

You missed this then.. "Have you ever seen anybody looking so bored and uninterested as Stephen Fry’s very young husband? Every photo I have ever seen of them, he looks like he would rather be anywhere else." I'll refrain from attributing it.

Was there a relationship ?

Galaxy

I think we have to explore really difficult topics. When is having a relationship with a young person who you knew at 15 ok? We should as a society be able to talk about those issues.
Is what woody allan did ok? Should we not talk about that.
I am not comparing the two I just think if we dont talk about moral issues relating to power and young people we let them down.

I agree with you.

Usually, Annie, they have only read one side of the story. In court both sides are told.

Not possible to wipe from people’s minds what they have read

I think we have to explore really difficult topics. When is having a relationship with a young person who you knew at 15 ok? We should as a society be able to talk about those issues.
Is what woody allan did ok? Should we not talk about that.
I am not comparing the two I just think if we dont talk about moral issues relating to power and young people we let them down.

People often say, based on media publicity, that someone won’t get a fair trial. If they were to sit in court and watch a trial by jury, the way evidence is presented and people are cross-examined, they would realise that things in a courtroom look very different to sensationalist news items and social media gossip.

In domestic abuse unless there is clear evidence of violence it very hard to prove coercive abuse. Arrests may be followed by charges, but charges not brought because of

the victim doesn't not wish to proceed because it means dragging through it again and fear

tho charges brought weight of evidence not sufficient in complex matters when final decisions made.

Galaxy

I agree its difficult but how would you change it. I am talking about CF rather than Schofield, you cant have different rules for famous people.

I don’t know. And you absolutely can’t have different rules for famous people (though I’m not convinced it doesn’t happen.
But the relentless media publicity, even the self created stuff by PS on BBC, would make it difficult for anyone affected to get a fair trial if it came to that.
Look at the microcosm of GN. Some have already made up their minds that PS was grooming. The suggestions that there are even worse things to come, have already been voiced.

I agree its difficult but how would you change it. I am talking about CF rather than Schofield, you cant have different rules for famous people.

Galaxy

Yes I know the case Annie.
We cant not go ahead with charges of that nature because people may harm themselves.

Agreed, but it could be less of a media/social media feeding frenzy.
I suppose we could say they sign up for that when they take such a visible job.

Annie

Just reading the comments on here as I don’t watch This Morning, it would appear that this show has thrown a few people under the bus, so to speak. Maybe the show has run it’s course.