Mohammed Al Fayed.

This reminds me of years ago working in the NHS. The consultant professor performed an internal exam on a patient in front of several members of staff. I remember the acute discomfort of the woman involved. I didn't think his action was necessary and that he just did it for some sick kick. Never forgotten it.

I was once spoken to by a GP during an internal in a very derogatory way- I never went to see him again. He was horrible.

Oreo

This is all very one sided on here today.
We have no means of knowing who said what to who but anything is being believed whether true or not.
I’m all for waiting for proof of any crimes committed, but that’s me.I won’t be swayed by emotional comments otherwise.

One young woman recorded Al Fayed on a dictaphone, so we DO know!

Sparklefizz

Oreo

This is all very one sided on here today.
We have no means of knowing who said what to who but anything is being believed whether true or not.
I’m all for waiting for proof of any crimes committed, but that’s me.I won’t be swayed by emotional comments otherwise.

One young woman recorded Al Fayed on a dictaphone, so we DO know!

Don't you understand emotional and sexual grooming Oreo?

I had to have a medical examination when I started work for a bank in the 1960s. It didn't involve an internal but I had to undress. It was accepted in those days as others have mentioned.

What a detestable excuse for a man!

Witzend

J52

The doctor who gave the young girls internal examinations is telling the truth as she has not done anything illegal. The girls apparently consented because they were persuaded that it was a welfare check.
If that’s not an odd request from an employer I don’t know what is.

I don’t know about ‘illegal’ from a strictly official viewpoint, but surely an internal examination - just for a job in a shop or office - would constitute abuse? Because no way could it ever have been necessary in such circumstances.
To me, the doctor was complicit in the abuse.

Yes I agree, I was commenting on her openness and that she must be telling the truth. Albeit that she was possibly laying herself open to questions.
The focus is on Al Fayed, but what about those who played a part in knowingly providing the girls. They were equally to blame and should be held to account as is Ghislaine Maxwell.

Sorry, badly worded, not suggesting GM has anything to do with this appalling business.

Did Jill Dando know - was she going to investigate.

Oreo, it's almost impossible to believe isn't it. A rich and powerful man who was known to be involved in illegal activities, against whom there is credible evidence of sexual predation and who was a key figure in the impenetrable culture of patriarchy, could possibly be guilty.

Like Jimmy Saville and Ralph Harris, people behind the scenes had known for a long time what sort of man he was and it had been intimated for years. But it went against their own interests to blow the whistle or intervene. These are hardly shock horror revelations or the scoop of the century.

As I said in my previous post, regardless of whether or not the women involved should have found other jobs, it cannot possibly excuse or diminish his crimes. I think you are too fixated on that issue. If my opinion is of any value, I agree with you to some extent. However, it does not detract from the fact that men in power have exercised unfettered control over those beneath them (aided and abetted by other men in power) for far too long.

It's worrying Fayed bought a private army of spies and guards and even medically trained personel that he could threaten people and families with. This was no ordinary rapist.

I think Flappergirl and I and most everyone else thinks there should be adequate police and legal protections for whistleblowers

Caleo

It's worrying Fayed bought a private army of spies and guards and even medically trained personel that he could threaten people and families with. This was no ordinary rapist.

He had fingers in pies everywhere and links to other rich and powerful people.

Someone posted earlier in the thread that HM Queen Elizabeth did maintain some distance from Fayed, although I should imagine she couldn't be openly hostile to him because she was always diplomatic and also because someone would have been quick to label her racist.

petra

Allira

Claims had previously been made but police had taken no action, it’s been reported.

Mohammed Al Fayed’s former head of security told an alleged victim “someone could jump out the bushes at you” after she complained to Harrods about a sexual assault, lawyers have said.

Barrister Maria Mulla told journalists of a client who was threatened by ex-security chief and former Scotland Yard detective chief superintendent John Macnamara.

What a coincidence that Al Fayed's chief of security was an ex-Scotland Yard DC Superintendent and that the Met Police took no action when complaints were made to them.

Your certainly not suggesting there is a connection, are you 😱

Like a spider's web!!

Dai Davies, Scotland Yard's former Head of Royal Protection, warned the Queen about Fayed's reputation during his son's association with Princess Diana.

Mr Davies said he raised the concerns with Lord Condon, the-then Met Police Commissioner, as well as the Palace, but his advice was ignored.

The Standard
20/9/24

I thought it at the time and I think it now, what was Diana doing get involved with this sordid family?

eazybee

I thought it at the time and I think it now, what was Diana doing get involved with this sordid family?

Because she was unhappy, very needy and quite naïve too. Hadn't she just been rejected by Hasnat Khan? Fayed Snr was a very manipulative man, ready to seize any opportunity to get closer to the Royal Family.

She could holiday on Fayed’s private beach, on his yacht and have the cameras flashing , naive ?

Anniebach

She could holiday on Fayed’s private beach, on his yacht and have the cameras flashing , naive ?

Yes, good point.
Diana wanted to make Hasnat Khan jealous, according to her friend Rosa Monckton.

That was rather naïve though.

Elegran

Oreo

I still don’t get it, no matter how it’s explained.Just why would you agree?

Put yourself in her place, then you will get it. If you were a slightly built girl in your teens, taken by security guards to a locked room where a powerful man demanded sex, how would you walk out? Saying no could be your first response, slapping his face the next, but without the key you won't get out of that door.

I saw the documentary, and one of the women did say that she was escorted to his room, and could hear locks clicking behind them, which I’d imagine was his usual ‘security’ procedure, so she may not have thought it out of the way.
What I thought strange was one of them saying that she had to sign a non-disclosure agreement, and she and her lawyer had to witness all the evidence she had collected being destroyed or shredded, though she seems to have discovered transcripts of what happened.
Then there was the odious Max Clifford, saying everybody knew he was a ‘randy old sod’, but he had donated something like £ 250,000 to one of Clifford’s charities, so ‘ what was he to do?’.
I think the people involved in protecting him should be brought to account, but I do wonder if some of the women involved ( not necessarily the ones who were raped) did keep quiet because he could help them in their careers. There was one whom he told that he would send a film he had made of her to Dodi, and another who wanted to be a buyer, so not just wee shop assistants.

Allira

eazybee

I thought it at the time and I think it now, what was Diana doing get involved with this sordid family?

Because she was unhappy, very needy and quite naïve too. Hadn't she just been rejected by Hasnat Khan? Fayed Snr was a very manipulative man, ready to seize any opportunity to get closer to the Royal Family.

And Diana could be manipulative too, if accounts are to be believed. She knew the media would love the story.

OldFrill

Did Jill Dando know - was she going to investigate.

Jill Dando was a presenter. I doubt she alone would have had any information which could have been deemed worth investigation.

Charming men are very powerful. I can vouch.

Diana Step Mother Raine Spencer was a close friend of Al Fayed

OldFrill

Did Jill Dando know - was she going to investigate.

I believe so.

So this has been reported in volume since 1997?

The question is why have the MET and BBC waited for him to die, rather than asking about the women involved

flappergirl

Oreo, it's almost impossible to believe isn't it. A rich and powerful man who was known to be involved in illegal activities, against whom there is credible evidence of sexual predation and who was a key figure in the impenetrable culture of patriarchy, could possibly be guilty.

Like Jimmy Saville and Ralph Harris, people behind the scenes had known for a long time what sort of man he was and it had been intimated for years. But it went against their own interests to blow the whistle or intervene. These are hardly shock horror revelations or the scoop of the century.

As I said in my previous post, regardless of whether or not the women involved should have found other jobs, it cannot possibly excuse or diminish his crimes. I think you are too fixated on that issue. If my opinion is of any value, I agree with you to some extent. However, it does not detract from the fact that men in power have exercised unfettered control over those beneath them (aided and abetted by other men in power) for far too long.

I have already said he was obvs an odious man, even for the times he was an awful person, that isn’t in doubt.I know that you agree to some extent with my point of the women involved saying no to whatever he proposed to them.I think it’s an important point for others to realise you don’t have to go along with something you know is wrong by your employer.
There’s an interesting piece on the online news and on tv about a member of Harrods management team ( young woman at the time) who said that he would go around the store looking at pretty staff members and say ‘I want that one in my office’.She would then warn the girl in no uncertain terms that he would offer her more money, promise Park Lane parties and be showered with gifts but that she would then have to sleep with certain men.
I would have collected my bag and coat and left right there and then.
She says he was always asking her to work more closely with him near his office but she told him no, she was happy where she was and he didn’t molest her.
He was undoubtedly a sex pest of the first order I have no doubt.
I just challenge the posts on here who think girls had no choice and couldn’t possibly leave the store.