‘N word’ at the BAFTAs

Well I didn't hear the slur. I feel left out!

I thought the film was excellent. I cried when I seldom cry. The acting superb.

I don't know why the slur wasn't edited out perhaps in the same way that the film's opening line is F... the Queen!

It was an unexpected but welcome reminder of the condition which the editors thought they should leave in.
It certainly got publicity didn't it.

Perhaps I didn't word it well.I'm sure for the actors it was a dreadful experience up there on stage and I wasn't putting one kind of prejudice against another.Really its more the pile on that seems to have come from the likes of Jamie Fox and others that are adamant Johns words were said with intent and that it was racism that show a lack of empathy for someone who has also led a very challenging life and experienced prejudice.

Allira

Allira

"In the UK, coprolalia (involuntary, obscene vocal tics associated with Tourette Syndrome) is recognized as a disability. While it involves shouting offensive language, it is distinct from hate speech because it lacks intent. Legal protections against discrimination apply, but incidents can cause significant public distress and conflict with free speech/offence laws."

This is worth repeating.

*^it is distinct from hate speech because it lacks intent.^*

Of course it lacks intent and however upsetting it may be to be on the receiving end if you know the person has Tourettes you can be forgiving.Or you certainly should be.

Allira

"In the UK, coprolalia (involuntary, obscene vocal tics associated with Tourette Syndrome) is recognized as a disability. While it involves shouting offensive language, it is distinct from hate speech because it lacks intent. Legal protections against discrimination apply, but incidents can cause significant public distress and conflict with free speech/offence laws."

This is worth repeating.

^it is distinct from hate speech because it lacks intent.^

Washerwoman

Whilst the N word is vile and is associated with dreadful prejudice,and no doubt in the moment the 2 actors were shocked and upset I should imagine John has suffered just as much prejudice and dreadful treatment in his life for a condition that's out of his control.So yes be upset but also show some empathy towards someone also marginalised. I saw the film an it reduced me to tears.Also his first foul mouthed rant in the film made me react with discomfort. Until I caught myself and thoughts if this is how an actor in a film can provoke such feelings imagine what John has had to live with day to day.

Discrimination isn’t a competition you know - there’s room to feel enormous compassion for JD and have space to feel for black Americans. Also, given that this situation was avoidable if it had been better managed, you’d think anyone that really cared about JD would actually want blame to be allocated where it belongs and for maybe the BBC to behave more responsibly next time and thus protect everyone.. There is no evidence btw that the two black men had no empathy. And you know they are allowed to be upset as well although even if it’s appreciated that JD’s life is indescribably awful. Just being terribly sorry for JD snd saying the only people who should have shown empathy were the two black men does really smack of not wanting anything except black men to learn and change.

although I’m still waiting for you to explain your criticisms of them.

Yes, I have.

which resonates in a way we can’t understand as white peoples in the UK.
You are making assumptions about me and my family.

Tuliptree

If you can ask that question, then you are not interested in any answer I can give. Clearly you know nothing about American history

Oh don't be silly.

Allira

Washerwoman a kind and empathetic post.

Yes, I'm a sure the actors must have been shocked, especially as they are, I think, American, but must have been aware of what someone with Tourette's might say, not in any offensive way but because they cannot help it.
After all, the film that won the awards was called I Swear!

Saying that you think they are American demonstrates that you haven’t engaged at all with the issue of the N word which resonates in a way we can’t understand as white peoples in the UK. Without being sure they are American I just can’t fathom how you felt qualified to judge them - although I’m still waiting for you to explain your criticisms of them.

Allira

You're making things up, Tuliptree

No-one has said the two black actors behaved appalling as you claim.

They lacked insight ad empathy, even after the film ‘I Swear’ had just won three awards.
The irony is not lost on me.

How do you know they lacked insight and empathy? You’re making things up

Washerwoman a kind and empathetic post.

Yes, I'm a sure the actors must have been shocked, especially as they are, I think, American, but must have been aware of what someone with Tourette's might say, not in any offensive way but because they cannot help it.
After all, the film that won the awards was called I Swear!

Washerwoman good post 👍

Whilst the N word is vile and is associated with dreadful prejudice,and no doubt in the moment the 2 actors were shocked and upset I should imagine John has suffered just as much prejudice and dreadful treatment in his life for a condition that's out of his control.So yes be upset but also show some empathy towards someone also marginalised. I saw the film an it reduced me to tears.Also his first foul mouthed rant in the film made me react with discomfort. Until I caught myself and thoughts if this is how an actor in a film can provoke such feelings imagine what John has had to live with day to day.

You're making things up, Tuliptree

No-one has said the two black actors behaved appalling as you claim.

They lacked insight ad empathy, even after the film ‘I Swear’ had just won three awards.
The irony is not lost on me.

That was tongue-in-cheek too, btw.

GrannyGravy13

sixandahalf

Tuliptree

And I do wonder what the reaction would have been if it had been an anti-Semitic phrase.

The outrage would have been off the scale.

I doubt it, most intelligent people are aware of Tourette’s Syndrome and its uncontrollable tics.

Obviously they should be seen and not heard.
Or not even seen.

Perhaps shut away in a sanatorium if people find it so offensive for someone with Tourette's to be out in public with their disability?

sixandahalf

Tuliptree

And I do wonder what the reaction would have been if it had been an anti-Semitic phrase.

The outrage would have been off the scale.

Well, he still would not have been able to help it.
He has a disability which was explained in the film for which he received awards.
As GrannyGravy says, perhaps he should have stayed at home and sent a representative to pick up his awards on his behalf.

Tourette Syndrome and Disability
TS is a disability and therefore people are protected under the Equality Act 2010 from being discriminated against because of their condition. All the usual rules about discrimination apply to people with TS.

sixandahalf

Tuliptree

And I do wonder what the reaction would have been if it had been an anti-Semitic phrase.

The outrage would have been off the scale.

I doubt it, most intelligent people are aware of Tourette’s Syndrome and its uncontrollable tics.

Allira

Unfair post, Tuliptree

What I am saying is that these two men must have missed the message that was being portrayed by this film.

They seem to have no empathy or understanding of someone with a disability, even after this disability has just been portrayed to them.

They were more upset by being called an offensive name, which the man could not help saying because of that very disability.

In fact, they are discriminating against a disabled person instead of having any understanding even after it had just been explained to them.

No-one thinks this word is acceptable, nor is the word you mentioned acceptable either and no-one would normally use it.

However, the circumstances were exceptional.

And you know all this how? You are attributing thoughts, feelings to them , accusing them of disability discrimination- based on what? There was a groundswell of reaction from thousands that the sainted BBC could have avoided but hey why blame the BBC when there’s two black men who behaved appalling and caused it all? Plus ça change

Tuliptree

And I do wonder what the reaction would have been if it had been an anti-Semitic phrase.

The outrage would have been off the scale.

By the way my post was tongue in cheek

Unfair post, Tuliptree

What I am saying is that these two men must have missed the message that was being portrayed by this film.

They seem to have no empathy or understanding of someone with a disability, even after this disability has just been portrayed to them.

They were more upset by being called an offensive name, which the man could not help saying because of that very disability.

In fact, they are discriminating against a disabled person instead of having any understanding even after it had just been explained to them.

No-one thinks this word is acceptable, nor is the word you mentioned acceptable either and no-one would normally use it.

However, the circumstances were exceptional.

Perhaps the man with uncontrollable Tourette’s should just stay home, never leave the safety of his four walls just in case one of his tics should upset someone

As ridiculous as the above sounds, that is the only way to ensure that nobody is ever offended by his disability.

Oh then we could start confining those with visual disabilities that might just offend…

Oreo

Since the BBC edited out other words in the broadcast I think it could be said with confidence that one word, slightly muffled wasn’t heard by the team in the van as they claim to be the case.

Of course because the BBC should have managed the predictable risk better AND not left the unedited version on player as long as they did. But hey oh, interesting to see who’s now a BBC backer in what circumstances

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