‘N word’ at the BAFTAs

If the N word is deemed to be so offensive to some members of our society, why is it that it is often used in rap and drill music by black artists?

I know the N word is seen as beyond the pale these days - and rightly so for any offensive term- but this was involuntary , Tourette’s is a disability in itself and makes its sufferers lives hell.
But can we honestly take umbrage at this incident when the F word, C word and other expletives are 10 a penny- even deemed funny?
Yes, the Beeb should have handled it better, otherwise why the time delay? Editing is supposed to mean just that. But for those who claim to be “shocked” by the utterance, stop virtue signalling.

Nannee49

He was offensive only if he intended to be offensive. He didn't.

Of course he didn’t mean to be offensive but that does not mean it was ok for the BBC to behave as it did

He was offensive only if he intended to be offensive. He didn't.

My pov has always been that there was a lack of planning and preparedness. And also a down playing of the resonance of the N word to African -Americans. Of course life is difficult for people with Tourette’s - how could it not be? But that doesn’t mean other people can’t be considered as well as efforts are made to increase understanding of the condition and make it easier for them to participate in everyday life. That’s true of probably all disabilities. It’s shit having a disability and life is generally much harder but it doesn’t mean that the disabled people’s needs trump everyone else’s. It doesn’t and can’t work like that.

Well, it seems to highlight the message that I assume the film was trying to convey - that having Tourettes makes life very difficult, and sometimes dangerous, for the person that has it. If some people are saying John Davidson should not have attended, that is the height of irony.

If the racial slur was related to the two black presenters (the older gentleman did look rather stunned), I can understand them momentarily being shocked but hopefully they at some point realised that it was not deliberately aimed at them. As Tulip said, this occurrence was fairly predictable - I understand highly charged or stressful situations increase the likelihood of tic-ing - then the two presenters should have been pre-warned.

I heard two or three occasions when someone shouted but I didn't hear the words but even if viewers did hear them, so what!

Nannee49

I don't understand how a greater understanding of a disability is a free pass...what does that even mean...a free pass for what?

Sorry if I’ve not been clear. - the free pass is given to BAFTA and JD. They’re absolved of all responsibility

I don't understand how a greater understanding of a disability is a free pass...what does that even mean...a free pass for what?

Nannee49

What should happen and what would make a real difference is for "I swear" to be compulsory viewing then there would be no need for planning or fore warning or misunderstanding, everyone would know what's going on with no disrespect to anyone.

Well that’s not going to happen and why should it? What’s wrong with planning? It’s called organisation. Or is it free pass for everyone except black people who just have to suck it up?

What should happen and what would make a real difference is for "I swear" to be compulsory viewing then there would be no need for planning or fore warning or misunderstanding, everyone would know what's going on with no disrespect to anyone.

I font think equivalence in intent is equivalence. There’s a difference in how it resonates

Of course I understand it’s involuntary. But clearly not unexpected. So why didn’t BAFTA simply talk to the two actors beforehand and warn them it might happen? In fact talk to all the nominees as he might have shouted out other things that could have sounded shocking. I think being prepared could have made a real difference plus the BBC could have had a plan for any necessary cutting out before broadcast. As I said not well planned for.

The equivalence is in the intent tuliptree. Both verbal tics could be taken as shocking to differing sensibilities without an understanding of the condition.
Isn't illustrating the tic-ing and the distress it can cause the whole point of the film?

Tuliptree

And I do wonder what the reaction would have been if it had been an anti-Semitic phrase.

You do realise that he can't help it, right? Even if he had said something anti-Semitic, I would hope people would realise that. Put it this way, if he saw me in the street, he might well call me a 'fat c&nt' - would I take offence? No, because I know it's an involuntary tic - part of his condition.

He uses every range of slur known to man . Misogynistic, homophobic, racist. Because you know it is a disability.

And I do wonder what the reaction would have been if it had been an anti-Semitic phrase.

Nannee49

It's the constant repetition by the media of the phrase "racial slur" that grates with me. It is NOT a slur, there was no^intent^of deliberately insulting or needing to hurt but a symptom of this man's disability! Huge difference.
He tic'd "F*ck the Queen" at his MBE investiture at Buckingham Palace where the late Queen Elizabeth, with an obvious understanding of Tourette's, apparently chose to ignore it and calmly carried on.

I really don’t see any equivalence between f the Queen and the n word ( which has a resonance we don’t understand to African - Americans who were the ‘target’. )I don’t know what the answer is but saying it’s been over blown isn’t it. The possibility clearly wasn’t thought through and it should have been.

It's the constant repetition by the media of the phrase "racial slur" that grates with me. It is NOT a slur, there was no^intent^of deliberately insulting or needing to hurt but a symptom of this man's disability! Huge difference.
He tic'd "F*ck the Queen" at his MBE investiture at Buckingham Palace where the late Queen Elizabeth, with an obvious understanding of Tourette's, apparently chose to ignore it and calmly carried on.

Exactly butterandjam this is why I do not understand people say people are BBC bashing.

I witnessed a man with tourretes on a train once and sadly his outburst was directed at a group school girls. Everyone could see how upsetting it was all round and how nothing could be done. The BBC failed in their editing. It’s not BBC bashing.

theworriedwell

The BBC have explained the editing was being done in a van outside and they didn't hear the word. Apparently it wasnt very clear.

Handy bit of BBC bashing.

The BBC engineers inside the venue witnessed/ knew it had been said, (and exactly when in the ceremony it happened.)

The BBC producer and director was then responsible to then message the OB vehicle and alert them. They had two hours to do that before broadcast.

Long before broadcast , the OB staff had seen and heard Cummings apologise for it on stage.

"We never heard it" just doesn't wash.

Allira

"In the UK, coprolalia (involuntary, obscene vocal tics associated with Tourette Syndrome) is recognized as a disability. While it involves shouting offensive language, it is distinct from hate speech because it lacks intent. Legal protections against discrimination apply, but incidents can cause significant public distress and conflict with free speech/offence laws."

I was on a train a few weeks ago. A man with really bad tourettes got on, he immediately said he had it and could not control his shouting. Some people started moaning at his first outburst. Other people told them off which was good to hear.

It's a horrible condition.

Well it depends what they heard. I didn't hear it but it was supposed to be hard to hear and harder in the van.

There is some BBC bashing going on, doesn't mean it doesn't happen because you didn't do it. I didn't do it either funnily enough.

Allira

^So, ‘I Swear’, the excellent film about John Davidson and his life with Tourette’s Syndrome wins three awards at the BAFTAs^.

It seems to be the height of irony that a man who made a film about the problems he has with Tourette's Syndrome then received complaints because of something he couldn't help because he has Tourette's Syndrome.

I remember watching a film years ago on TV featuring people with Tourette's, it was enlightening.

Totally agree.
It was a film about a man with a syndrome, and he was there, sadly this took the joy away from him. He didn't do this on purpose, complete over reaction to this.

"In the UK, coprolalia (involuntary, obscene vocal tics associated with Tourette Syndrome) is recognized as a disability. While it involves shouting offensive language, it is distinct from hate speech because it lacks intent. Legal protections against discrimination apply, but incidents can cause significant public distress and conflict with free speech/offence laws."

theworriedwell

The BBC have explained the editing was being done in a van outside and they didn't hear the word. Apparently it wasnt very clear.

Handy bit of BBC bashing.

They heard and edited out other words 🤷‍♀️

No BBC bashing from me.