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new job problem

(33 Posts)
Ziggy62 Sun 19-Feb-17 23:09:28

after nearly 40yrs in childcare I gave up 2months ago and started a new career as housekeeping manager. I love the job and find it so much easier than childcare. One of the cleaners who has been there since the place opened about 3yrs is causing a few problems and i'm not sure if its worth the stress. She has never been a very good cleaner but she is a pleasant woman. Due to lack of hygiene and cleanliness the place was nearly closed down at the end of October, which is why they decided to employ a housekeeping manager. Up until Friday we got on really well, even though her cleaning isn't up to my standards. Its part of my role to carry out supervisions with staff, last Thursday we had the 4th one since I started. I explained in a calm manner that we are repeating the same things at every supervision and if her efforts don't improve the home manager will be asking why. She was fine after the meeting and for the rest of the day but then on Friday she was very grumpy and hardly spoke. Apparently she went to the office saying I had threatened her during the supervision. I was so cross as this was completely untrue. I'm off now till Wednesday but so upset. I re-married last September and this problem is having an affect on my home life. My new husband must be fed up of me complaining but its constantly on my mind. Not sure what advice i'm looking for. On one hand I want to leave the job and just get a part time cleaning job (which is what I applied for originally) or just keep going and hope things improve

hildajenniJ Sun 19-Feb-17 23:35:51

Sounds like your staff member needs to go on a training course. Does the home arrange these for the domestic staff? Could you ask the manager for a cleaning course for all the cleaners so that she doesn't feel singled out? Maybe something with a certificate at the end. Do they have a disciplinary sytstem there?

Jomarie Sun 19-Feb-17 23:53:31

This might seem a little brutal but my advice would be "stick to your guns" - they (your employers) thought you were "up to the job" so prove them right. You're the new guy on the block and he/she resents it - probably thought they should have got the job themselves - so it's just a question of staying true to yourself and believing in the new you - I bet your new husband believes in you so why not prove him right? Confidence is the key - whether you have it or not just pretend that you have - believe in yourself AND follow HildajenniJ's advice.

Ziggy62 Sun 19-Feb-17 23:59:33

I'm not sure if there are cleaning courses available but I will ask, thank you. There is a disciplinary system

Lyndylou Mon 20-Feb-17 05:40:42

Weekly 1-1 chats, clear objectives, lay out what you expect of her and document if she is achieving it or not. Doesn't have to take long, probably best if you can keep it simple and succinct, but make sure everything is written down and, most important, that she signs it as a clear and true representation of the meeting before she leaves the room. I would write up bullet points before hand.

I used to do this sort of thing a lot, now I'm temping I see major problems arising because managers are being too nice and not dealing with issues early enough,

jusnoneed Mon 20-Feb-17 08:07:01

I think you need to get all the cleaners together, explain/show them exactly how you (and the management, who should back you) expect things to be done. That way no one will be able to say you are picking on them and everybody will know where they stand.
You are their boss first, friend second.
Always found it best to set things out clearly with staff.

Christinefrance Mon 20-Feb-17 08:20:45

Yes Lyndylou is right, ensure everything is documented, be clear about the objectives.
A management role will always bring these issues, as others have said you are not a friend or co-worker you are their manager. If it's having a detrimental effect on your life perhaps you need to reconsider your role, is it worth the stress ?

NanaandGrampy Mon 20-Feb-17 08:49:27

Document everything.

In these days of litigastion for the drop of a hat it is always wise to be always on your guard. I hate to say it but that is the way of the world these days.

You need to have processes in place to protect yourself from this sort of allegation and also to protect your staff.

They need to understand those processes too. As someone said above- clear objectives, weekly 1-2-1s . If someone is not performing you need to be clear and explain that to them, put in place improvement goals and make sure they understand that if you have to go down the route of dismissal you will have covered all your bases.

I have been there and I know how stressful this is . Maybe take time to consider if management is really your forte too? Not everyone makes a good manager.

Ziggy62 Mon 20-Feb-17 09:57:24

oh thank you so much for such sensible advice. The supervision meetings are 1-2-1 and I write down all we have discussed in front of her, she then reads through it and signs (as do I). But it was day after this meeting that she accused me of threatening her during the meeting, so now I am reluctant to do more supervisions. I have a get together will all the cleaners on a Wednesday morning so at least then I have others there. At the moment I have to check cleaners work and sign their work sheet and discuss any thing not completed to standard. We also have an order in which the cleaning has to be carried out (bathrooms first etc etc) and she is blatantly ignoring it now and cleaning in the complete opposite order (bit like the awkward 2 yr olds I used to work with)
Anyway I am no longer discussing issues 1-2-1 for the time being, I will make notes of issues and bring them up in the Wednesday morning get togethers, then get cleaners to sign that document so it doesn't look like I'm just 'picking' on here.
There was a young girl who took on my role in the few weeks before I started and this same cleaner went to the office accusing her of bullying her.

Jaycee5 Mon 20-Feb-17 10:27:31

I think you should put your concerns in writing and give a copy to the management. People have a totally different reaction to something that is formal and written down. Set out what you expect to be done to solve the problem. You have tried telling her and doing so again is not going to help.
I learnt the hard way that it is not worth trying to be a boss and trying to be friends. You are doing what you were employed to do and as long as the management support you, you should carry on and be firm.
Remember that the issue of cleanliness for the residents is more important that this lady's hurt feelings.

Jaycee5 Mon 20-Feb-17 10:33:22

Remember also that false accusations are a form of bullying. It is a way of putting you in the wrong and trying to make herself a victim.
You should also record the fact that since bringing things to her notice, she has completely ignored the cleaning system and is becoming obstructive.
It is not worth getting stressed about. The management should have given her a verbal warning of dismissal (or allowed you to do so) by now.
The management sounds very weak and whether you will be able to stay will depend on whether they support you or not rather than how this woman behaves.

Caroline123 Mon 20-Feb-17 12:17:26

I agree with Jaycee,some folk try to manipulate things to their advantage.
You sound to me to be doing it right, but may need some management backing with this one issue.Id have a word with management about the way forward.
If she gets away with undermining you, the others will lose respect for you.It sounds like the previous manager couldn't deal with her,so don't try to be her friend,be her boss until she tows the line!

jevive73 Mon 20-Feb-17 12:33:04

is it acceptable to record on tape performance reviews

nipsmum Mon 20-Feb-17 12:36:53

i agree with documenting everything with time and dates. you are her boss not her friend. I found that socialising with staff and then trying to maintain disipline was impossible

Ziggy62 Mon 20-Feb-17 12:43:33

I was meant to get a message from manager today with regard to us having a meeting with this cleaner. Havent heard anything so far so when I return to work on Wednesday I will put my concerns in writing. Lots of sensible, useful advice. Thanks so much, I really appreciate it

Ziggy62 Mon 20-Feb-17 12:46:06

jevive73, I did think about recording supervisions with her but will need to check with manager is this is allowed. For the time being I will ensure I only speak to her when other staff are in room and then she cant accuse me of any wrong doing. Also going to tell caring staff who complain about her to put it to me in writing via email

Marydoll Mon 20-Feb-17 12:52:24

I know what you mean about it all affecting your home life.
My husband worked in HR and his advice to anyone having problems at work with a boss or member of staff was always to write down and date everything said between the various parties.
I followed his advice when I went off long term sick and was having a bit of a hard time at work. When I had to retire on ill health grounds I produced all the documentation. My employers were horrified at what had happened to me.
My advice, keep a diary, write EVERYTHING down, no matter how trivial. This will give the whole picture of what is happening. Think carefully before you say anything to her. Your managers will be expecting you to deal with it professionally (not that you won't). Good Luck.

Ziggy62 Mon 20-Feb-17 13:09:55

Marydoll, great advice. Yes I agree, I am making sure everything is now in writing and any communication I have with her will be written down and then signed by both of us. I have so much paper work to catch up on as this is a new role but am wasting so much time trying to get this woman to do the job she is being paid to do.

VIOLETTE Mon 20-Feb-17 14:30:17

Do you know what her standards were like under the previous managemet ? if it is a home you work in you could ask the residents if they are happy with the standards of hygiene and cleanliness ,,,there is a lot of publicity nowadays about hidden cameras ..and whilst you may not like this idea you could stress to your manager how important hygiene and cleanliness standards are kept up ......if your current management is unwilling to address this issue, maybe the firm you work for has a higher management structure you could approach ?

Nobody likes doing this, but sometimes it is necessary. Do you think she may be 'trying it on' with you as you are new to the job, or do you know how she got on with the previous manager ? and have you asked her outright if she has a problem ? she might like to talk it through out of the 1 to 1 situation ?

Marydoll Mon 20-Feb-17 14:30:44

I don't just mean any discussions. Please make a note what is said by her to others others about you. You do not have to tell her you are doing this..
When I was teaching, I was sometimes involved in child protection issues. I always reminded less experienced staff that even although they thought something a child said about family life was insignificant, it should be noted, as it often added to a wider picture for all the siblings. Your employers need the whole picture.
Good luck and I hope you have a resolution soon.

Lupin Mon 20-Feb-17 17:10:35

I managed people for years and had some ticklish situations to deal with, and feel that you must not back away from issues with this person if she is defying you and the way you are all expected to work. You must confront it in as calm and as professional a manner as you can. It sounds as if you are doing all the right things. Do make sure you will get the support you need from your own boss.
These are early days in the job for you. Stick to your beliefs about what you are trying to achieve. If you get on top of this particular issue you will find life much easier going forwards. Leave the job behind you when you go home. Try not to let it stress you out so. Be strong. Best wishes to you.

Ziggy62 Mon 20-Feb-17 17:24:43

Marydoll, yes I see what youre saying but how do I prove what she is saying if the other staff aren't prepared to admit it to manager. ALL the carers and nurses complain about her work but since she reported me for threatening her, they are now going very quiet, as if they don't want her to get into trouble

Lupin, thank you all good advice. I have remained calm although in private I am furious.

rosesarered Mon 20-Feb-17 17:40:08

You are the one in charge, not her, so yes, stick to your guns and with any luck they will get rid of her.If her cleaning is not up to a high standard then you have every right to tell her to improve.Tell your line manager what the situation is with this woman.

Eloethan Mon 20-Feb-17 18:11:12

Ziggy62 You sound like a very competent manager and one who treats people with respect and fairness, and not, as some have wondered, one who is undermining her position by trying to be "friends" with the people you manage.

Since it appears this woman already has a "track record" of being rather difficult, I would imagine that the managers above you and her own work colleagues have at least an inkling of her shortcomings. As you say, her colleagues probably have a certain amount of loyalty towards her but that doesn't necessarily mean that they will not understand and quitely support your position.

As has been advised by other posters - and which you probably were aware of anyway - ensure that you carefully document all conversations and incidents. Continue to be calm and pleasant but as *roses" says, "stick to your guns".

Jayanna9040 Mon 20-Feb-17 18:20:41

It might help to phrase things impersonally eg "the sinks should be scrubbed and dried" rather than "you should scrub the sinks". She can't take it as a personal threat then.
Personally I've never found the talk to everyone as a whole approach effective as a couple of people have suggested. It just makes those who are doing a good job resentful and feeling that they are being criticised too. They will not respect you for fudging the issue.
If the standards and expectations are the same for everyone an accusation of bullying has no foundation.