Covid19 Vaccines in Production

Buffy I’ve read various reports of this and I’m more confused than ever - some say production will be ready to go if vaccine effective and others say what you say - they’ll produce in advance. I’m still not holding my breath for something this year - it just seems too good to be true

suziewuzie you’re right, I’ve checked and some clearly state AstraZenica starting to produce 30,000 doses before the results are known, so that vaccinations can start immediately the results are known, probably June/July.
While others, as you say, state the production will start when results are known and be ready by September.
No wonder there are disagreements on some forums when the information is so different.

I think its great news and I look forward to being vaccinated although as I believe I had Covid 19 in February I may not get it.

It’s irritating isn’t it Buffy because this is such an important issue. My head tells me that they wouldn’t spend money on actual production but I’ve no idea how much of a potential waste that would be anyway. My understanding is that with any drug the real costs are the years of R and D most of which are fruitless

It's extraordinary that in the same briefing at the weekend it was also stated that there may never be a vaccination. The messages are just incredibly mixed. It's damaging to their credibility and trust. We are a long way from a vaccination to pretend otherwise is counterproductive.

I don’t think they can guarantee anything Daisy, it’s true, they may never find a vaccine but they would be fools not to try.
They are letting us know they are trying to find one and we just might possibly have found one.
Fingers crossed....

What’s happening is the politicisation of vaccine development. Sadly some of the scientists involved have made unwise comments or at least comments that can be taken out of context for a ‘soundbite’. We only need telling facts -that vaccine development is ongoing, that we are at ‘x’ stage in recruitment, that the Govt is providing ‘x’ amount of finance, that Phase 1 has been concluded etc. Comments ( ill informed or otherwise) on % chance of success or guesses ( and that’s all they are) of dates of availability should not be being made. It was good news about production capacity being made available well in advance but now providing that information seems to have led to a muddle between capacity and production ( bit like what happened with testing). I also think there’s muddle in the press between what’s going on at Oxford and Imperial.

That's my understanding too suziewoozie. The capacity to mass-produce a vaccine is being made available, but we're nowhere near having one.

Thousands of scientists are researching all sorts of issues, such as repurposing of current drugs for treatment and vaccination, the reasons why some people are more affected than others, the actual structure of the virus, the correlation between Covid-19 deaths and diabetes and the use of ACE inhibitors, etc etc.

There are small pockets of volunteers being recruited for trials and various hypotheses based on data. It's known, for example, that the sugary coating of the virus and ACE2 have something to do with how Covid-19 affects different people, but there's a long way to go to find out how that knowledge can be used in practice.

It could be that no vaccine giving life-long protection is ever produced, so it's important that we can learn to treat it better and to identify people most at risk.

Meanwhile, the best that anybody can practically do is keep well away from anybody who could transmit the infection. Without carriers, the infection would eventually die out - and small pockets of outbreaks could be dealt with. If we have diabetes and/or hypertension, it's important we keep our blood sugar under control and try to lead as healthy lifestyle as possible to keep blood pressure in check.

This is the official press release from AstraZeneca …

www.astrazeneca.com/media-centre/articles/2020/astrazeneca-and-oxford-university-announce-landmark-agreement-for-covid-19-vaccine.html

Nowhere is there any commitment to dates. All it does is confirm that there has been (thank goodness) some forward planning, so that if a safe and effective vaccine is ever found, the production capacity will be made available and the government has committed funds to it.

No thanks I'll pass

If you google Oxford trial Covid 19 (sorry cant seem to put a link) you can go on Oxfords webpage and find detailed links into the trial. Basically they have adapted an existing vaccine in the hope it protects against CV. A thousand volunteers over a few weeks are being given the vaccine or a n other. The volunteers will not know until the end of the trial if they received it. They all need monitoring for side effects and testing to see if they contract it. They are all healthy individuals between 18-55. They think around six months before they have enough data to prove one way or other. Even if it's a goer I cant see many of us receiving it this year unless you got a letter from the Government or work on the front line.

This is the link:

www.ox.ac.uk/news/2020-04-23-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-begins-human-trial-stage

suziewoozie
Yes, I think your post of 8.40 today sums it up well. And growstuff yours too.
I’ve been a bit worried since my last post on this thread because there were various releases in the news yesterday saying the Oxford vaccine might have been found to have failed already in monkeys. But I’ve decided to move back to my original thoughts of being optimistic because it’s really so early in this pandemic. Hopefully something will be developed.

maddy what I do believe is that there is excellent work going on in the UK ( and elsewhere) aimed at developing a vaccine and ( as grow says ) improved treatments. That gives me hope - what I yearn for is responsible reporting ( which is a bit silly I know) and the responsible managing of the expectations . I appreciate and would not criticise people who feel more excited about the possibility than I do but I guess that’s a personality thing

I once went on a trial of a new herbal tablet for a particular ailment it was a blind trial so no one knew if they were taking a placebo or the real thing When the results were all printed the people on the placebo had more side effects than anyone taking the actual pill They ranged from tummy aches headaches D and V, right through to suicidal ideation

I was on the real pill had no side effects but no help with the problem either ?

I agree with you suzie. I think it's cruel to keep raising expectations. The mumps vaccine took six years to develop - and that was quick for a vaccine.

What does give me some hope is that researchers are finding out more and more about how the virus affects people. For example, the majority of people who have died have had thromboembolisms, which have effectively blocked oxygen to the lungs. There are existing medications to help prevent thromboembolism, so maybe they can be adapted. It's also known that the "spikes" on coronavirus are covered in sugary polymers and there is already ongoing research on them. It's known that ACE2 receptors bind with the virus to cause infection. Research is needed into why so many diabetics have been seriously affected and needed hospitalisation. It could be that they have other co-morbities, but it's been known for ages that diabetes isn't just a problem with blood sugar and affects the whole metabolic system.

There could be other ways to treat Covid-19 other than vaccination and, hopefully, governments will continue to fund the research. International cooperation will be essential.

I just wish the media would stop giving the impression that there will be a magic wand and all we have to do is find the right wand, which will make everything alright.

Buffybee, the Oxford one was the one used on monkeys.

growstuff and suziewuzie if you scroll to the bottom of the the link provided by growstuff at 12.00 you will see:-

LATEST 18 May 2020
Funding and manufacturing boost for U.K. vaccine programme

This states because of the 65.5 million funding made only recently the manufacture is starting immediately as I originally thought.
I think that things are moving so quickly with this development, people are quoting out of date information.
Probably from only the day before.

^Dr. Alexander Douglas, the leader of the research group at Oxford which has developed the manufacturing method said, ‘We have been preparing for large-scale manufacturing of our vaccine candidate since February.
This funding enables manufacturing to start immediately and so will make vaccine available as soon as possible, while adhering to the most stringent safety standards. The methods developed here in the UK will also enable the production of vaccines for other countries.’^

You can’t get clearer than “ this funding enables manufacturing to start immediately”, from the leader of the research group at Oxford, can you?

Thanks Buffy if only our journalists could get this right. That’s very helpful - I’m surprised I have to say, it’s quite a punt but the potential rewards are enormous.

Yes suszie I had read previously, someone said that if, Professor Sarah Gilbert, the female scientist leading the Oxford team thought she had come up with something, she is so brilliant, we can be reasonably sure she has.
So much so, it would be worth rushing out the vaccine before the testing results, if the Government would fund it.
Massive punt as you say but the lives saved if she’s right......

Buffybee I think you need to read that statement carefully. It does not state that manufacture is starting immediately.

"This funding enables manufacturing to start immediately and so will make vaccine available as soon as possible,"

It states that the facilities are available to enable manufacture as soon as possible, in other words, when a vaccine is ready for production, which at the moment it's not.

It's all in the future - not now!

growstuff I’m sorry but you are reading the quote wrongly.
The statement reads clearly that, manufacturing will start immediately.

Two more links Buffybee …

www.ft.com/content/ddf8ec8c-dc30-43b3-847e-c412704a0296

www.sciencefocus.com/news/oxford-coronavirus-trials-heres-what-we-know-so-far-about-the-covid-19-vaccine/

Human trials have started, but nowhere is there any indication that any vaccine is about to be mass produced. AstraZeneca is planning to produce it and the government is committed to funding it, but it's nowhere near ready to go yet.

No, I'm not reading the quote wrongly. Manufacture on a mass scale will NOT start immediately.