Police Funding for Madeleine McCann

Yes that was what I was referring too GG. I can understand why you spend a lot of time there, it's a lovely place and we hope to return.

You are correct Jalima1108 and Iam64 about the " lifestyle choice" opinions among social workers and police officers.

Nobody said that police officer watched a 12 year old being raped.

That's not what I said though Anniebach

Iam64 said:
I can say with certainty that some police officers and staff from other agencies did conclude that children were making ‘lifestyle’ choices.

and I said that, unfortunately, that is just what they did, ie conclude that the children were making 'lifestyle' choices.

Jalima. You know of a case where a police officer was called out for a missing child, found her and saw her being raped yet did nothing ? just walked away ?

I have no wish to cause a disagreement, I know some of these poor children were in the care system, I an sorry but I find the story of the 12 year being raped and a policeman seeing it happen a little over the top, these children were let down by social care, police, local councils and some by parents . It must have been heartbreaking for you both dealing with these poor victims of abuse .

No more to say.

I do not think one police officer would do this. Sorry but you stretched it to the extreme .

Unfortunately that is just what they did Anniebach, beyond belief but true.

should the poor mother of the little one in the NAFI be critcised ?
I certainly didn't criticise her Anniebach, I feel so sorry for them.
The mother thought the little one was with the aunty, the aunty thought she was with her mother in the supermarket.

Sad to say, but as a social worker in the North West in the 80s/90s I had the same experience as Iam. This was especially true of girl's who were in the 'care' system.

Annie I don’t want to draw this out unnecessarily but I don’t want to ignore your long post either. I had close knowledge of child sexual exploitation. I can say with certainty that some police officers and staff from other agencies did conclude that children were making ‘lifestyle’ choices. Dreadful, indefensible but true. The parents of those children were often accused of neglect. I’ll leave it there.

I cannot condemn the McCanns as I have left children in a hotel room before. Would I do it now, absolutely not.

Iam. I know the police ignored the abuse . I am saying the McCanns are always condemned harshly by many for making the wrong decision. Yet when we discuss the awful child abuse by gangs not one parent is criticised , it’s always social services, police, government cut backs, I am saying in these awful abuse cases there are parents who allow daughters to roam the streets at night,
Your last post was so unfair , a child doesn’t come home ,parents start frantic search, police called, they find the child being raped and dismiss it as the child’s choice , I do not think one police officer would do this. Sorry but you stretched it to the extreme . Cases of gangs abusing victims were ignored but not as you claim .

Some parents make wrong decisions, some parents neglect their children for much longer than one evening,

When Sarah Payne was murdered the public wanted the murderer publicly hanged, the law was condemned for allowing the man to be free to kill the little one. Can we say
‘Those children shouldn’t have been left to play in a field whilst their parents went to the pub? No. Yet the McCanns are constantly condemned

Smileless if you are referring to them digging on the headland, that is a “designated area for flora/fauna” the locals were outraged!

We spend a lot of time in Luz and it has suffered due to Maddie’s disappearance.

We saw that too GG when we were there. There was a film crew there as well, this was about 3 years ago when there was a lot of waste ground being dug up and searched.

Locals feel that they and where they live has been tarnished, tourism has been hit and every time this is resurrected, more damage is done.

It's a beautiful place and the locals are lovely.

Praia de Luz is very anti the McCanns, when we were there the “Stop” signs on local roads had “The McCanns” written under the word stop!!!

Before our friends could start building their villa the grounds had to be re checked, particularly when they were excavating for the pool.

The family have to live with their guilt for the rest of their lives. Her siblings may have what if it had been one of us that went missing moments.

I think that as well when I read of a child drowning in a swimming pool or being knocked down by a parent on a driveway or private land - imagine having to live with your culpability (real or imagined)

Sorry Annie, I don’t understand your point. My point is the overwhelming evidence that the example I gave was all to frequent, with vulnerable children being reported missing by parents or carers and found to have been given drugs and alcohol. It made them more compliant, less able to resist and most importantly, much more likely to be seen as less deserving of scarce resources than other children/families.

When my daughter was small we would leave her alone in the hotel room whilst we had dinner. I would never do that now but I’m much more of a worrier now. Also there are lots of cases where the child is abducted and killed and the body found where it would be easy to say that the parents should have been more careful, I think there must be thousands of situations where parents have been lucky not careful. I think it’s so unkind to start the blame game and anyway the circumstances of an abduction are completely irrelevant to the arguments for spending money on searching. I can’t think of anything worse than being a parent in a situation like this who knows they should have behaved differently.
Jal I hadn’t heard that story - very sad and again botched at the beginning. But it demonstrates how rare these cases are very young children whose bodies are never found.

Harsh words Chucky but you are right.

The parents were selfish beyond belief.

As others have said - if the parents wish the search to continue, they should be prepared to fund it themselves.

This happens the first time the child is missing ? She is found being sexually abused by the police ?

Maybe the definition of 'neglect' needs a thread of its own. 12 year olds leave the house in the afternoon, due back for their tea between 5 and 6, fail to return. Parents call their friends, go out looking, child not home by 9 or 10, police are called. Police find child out of her head having sex with multiple males in some dingy place. Police conclude child is 'making life style choice'. No one is arrested or prosecuted.
Parents spend a number of dreadful years, worried out of their minds, trying to involve agencies who are supposed to help them, to no avail.
12 year old girl is now in her 20's and begins to realise she was exploited and abused by the group of men. She goes to the police with her friends and family and a proper investigation follows with the result many men are convicted and imprisoned.
That is what happened with a large number of those 12 year old girls (the boys aren't so willing to talk currently but watch this space)

Sarah Champion was critcised by her party leader for writing an article in a daily newpaper on grooming gangs

I remember that case Jalima.

When my daughters were 2, they were either in a pushchair or on reins , should the poor mother of the little one in the NAFI be critcised ?

I think there is a comparison, child neglect is child neglect, why is allowing a 12 year old girl to be out at night less neglectful than leaving a 4 year old in an apartment in the evening.

What is unfair about this discussion, the children subjected to abuse ? The blame is laid on cut back on resources, police fearing being accused of racism, never any critcism of the parents of the children who allow their daughters to stay out at night even all night .

I'm not going to add to the parents' agony by going into the rights and wrongs of what they did. There but for the grace of God.Perhaps more money has been allocated to follow a specific lead?

maryeliza there was another case of a little British girl who went missing in a German supermarket many years ago, Katrice Lee who was only just 2. The case was re-opened earlier this year and I don't know what progress, if any, has been made since then.

news.sky.com/story/new-search-for-british-girl-katrice-lee-missing-from-germany-since-1981-11357021

The not knowing must be terrible.

perhaps someone else has mentioned this case, I haven't read the whole thread.

The issue of 12 year olds being groomed for child sexual exploitation is not the best comparison with parents who leave 3 under 4 year olds in a holiday apartment. I don't want to re-hash the criticism of the McCann's in saying that, I'm sure they've relived the decision they made endlessly and daily.