Considering voting SNP?

If you listen to many SNP supporters they’ll tell you that Brexit was very definitely on the table and it was one of the reasons us unionists voted to stay in the UK ie we were assured we would stay in the EU! (We didn’t/we weren’t btw).

You’ll not get me defending anything the Tories do - but neither do I think it excuses the shambles of FPTP and what that means for democracy in Scotland.

I have no idea of that vote result just stating the facts as you say. As I said before Scotland did not vote for independence last time BUT BREXIT was not on the table then.. At that vote there was no discussion around the potential of leaving the EU so really a new vote is right and proper if based on the result of Brexit where the majority of voters in Scotland want to remain. So that raises many things but not not least by dragging them out of EU against their will is ignoring them. As for being ignored again i refer back to what i said before he hear/see & interpret what we want and from different perspectives. It is as current today as it has been for the past 50 years and I know some will believe much longer back through history. What sort of Democratic party buys the voting power of say mabe the DUP ?? oh yes it was the current tory party.. one example of many non democratic actions by this current government.

We had a referendum a while back about changing the voting system and Scotland voted by 1249375 to 713813 to stay with FPTP.

The SNP are not insulted any more than any other political party - although given that we have a unionist party in power in Westminster they’re hardly going to be seeking out the views of a minority party which seeks to break up the UK 5 years after being told by the Scottish people that they wanted to remain part of the UK.

Whether that will still be the case after 12/12 if the Tories win an overall majority I’m doubtful, but it’s important to get the facts correct.

Well the UK aparantly want FPTP and as Scotland is part of the UK atm for GE votes it abides by the rule. In Scotland alternative voting mehods are used when it relates only to Scotland ! Another reason maybe the Westmonster UK Government should pay attention more to Scotland as contrary to previous messages on this post, in the main the SNP are dismissed, ignored and insulted. Of course they are getting a lot more attention now becasue of the GE and IndyRef2. Personally just maybe not liking the result and wanting it changed is becoming a bit to common! just a joke as I am a remainer

I know - but we were talking about the GE and the results which put so many SNP MPs down at Westminster in comparison to the actual share of the vote. 66% wasted votes in Scotland is shocking.

I quite agree that the FPTP system gives an unrepresentative result - but consider this - The Scottish Parliament operates under a PR system whereby of the 129 members, 73 are elected FPTP and 56 via the PR list system.

However the last SG election gave the following result:

SNP 62 seats. CON 31, LAB 23, GREEN 6, LIBD 5, Independent 1.

So, not very different from the GE result after all, except for the Green Vote, which you will notice, overtook the LIBDs, and gave the pro-Indy parties a 2 seat advantage over the Unionist Parties.

Let’s leave the rUK out of this for a minute. When you’ve got 66% of votes in Scotland having no impact on the seats in Scotland then something is very wrong. The SNP got 36.9% of the vote in Scotland but 59% of the seats, Labour got 27% but just 12% of the seats, the Tories got 29% vote share and 22seats while the LibDems got the 6.8% of the vote and seats. That’s in Scotland - and it shows how bad the FPTP system is.

The reality is we all see , hear and interpret what we want.. as a scot living abroad (still with vote in GE though english council as last uk address) I think Scotland starting to make and impact on the English because they are talking more sense and acting more maturely than the current government. NS is a leader and knows what she is talking about and is not bumbling, rude, childish, biggoted, no massive millions in or on or offshore banks, no private education, studied Law not a journalist, Genuinely cares and understands the people and her country but is still human so does not always get it right. England is looking round for something the similar not liking what is currently on offer. God only knows who on earth votes for the likes of Jacod Rees-Mog...

In response to those that think it is an unfair system that allows Scotland to have more MP's than Lib Dems even though higher number of votes cast..... In Scotland there are only around 60 seats that can be fought AND all parties in the UK can fight for these seats. In England there are hundreds and hundreds of seats and the SNP have no candidates in England ............It is not unfair as if the Lib Dems or any other party wanted to get more of the Scottish seats then campaign in all council areas, truly get in and care about Scotland, its people and its needs...fight for them and they will win seats. All the seats are up for grabs if you like, it is up to the parties if they want them enough. The number of voters in the country is limited by the population! Scottish tories, labour & lib dems all have seats in westminster just not as many as SNP.

Is that Iain Lawson of the SNP and formerly the Honorary Consul of the Republic of Estonia?

Yes - you were right, that’s blatant propaganda

And here is the Party Political bit.

You do have an alternative. You can use your vote to give Scotland through the SNP the power and mandate to give us the chance to do in 2020 what we should have done in 2014. To vote again in Indyref2 and get it right this time

Independence is coming. I know it. Westminster knows it too. That is why they are desperate to delay it for as long as possible. This allows them to plunder Scottish resources, at no cost to themselves for another few years before the inevitable break comes.^^Your vote is important. Let the SNP have the mandate to improve all our lives, but in particular the lives of our children, grandchildren and generations as yet unborn. Let them grow up in country that is unquestionably their own, where we use our educational abilities, entrepreneurial skills, where there is a sense of decency, honesty and a steely resolve to make life better and more just for not just ourselves but our friends and neighbours as well We have no excuses, to win Independence our people must demand it and deserve it. The 12th December will be an important step on that road. Join us by voting SNP.

I know this will be seen by some as blatant propaganda, but Hey Ho there is plenty of that on the other political threads. It was a new thought for me and may resonate for others.

JUST THINK ABOUT THIS.

If the vote had been YES in 2014, by now we would have been fully independent for a few years. We would have been fully in the EU or at the very least an EFTA member. So we would certainly have been in the Single Market and probably the Customs Union as well.

We would have full employment as a lot of the companies who have left for Europe would have looked at Scotland first and moved North.

We would not have wasted a penny on Brexit our money would have been spent on improving the infrastructure needed to support all those incoming new businesses. Like new ports, new air routes, better communications.

Any fair minded person must surely see now that voting to stay in the U.K. has proved a huge mistake. We now face another Westminster election where our votes hardly matter to the outcome. Holding only 8% of them is not a good hand.

How do we use them this time? Elect the Tories? What about Labour? Don’t worry your vote will only count if a big slice of three other countries agree with you, or at the very least the big one, the one with well over 80% of the votes does.

Iain Lawson

Wheniwasyourage your friends could find themselves jumping out of the frying pan into the fire!

Not a Boris fan either but we're sick of the mess SNP have made and their obsession with independence. They've had more than a decade to demonstrate competence and have failed. I'll not be voting for them or Tories.

We are liftime conservative voters but our sitting MP is rubbish and we hate Boris with a vengance so it will be , for now , SNP but we would never vote for independance . It's going to be interesting to see what happens.

I don’t live in Scotland but in the north of England. We always seem to be at the bottom of the pile when it comes to investment. The A1 isn’t dual carriageway between most of Northumberland and Edinburgh. All the new infrastructure starts in the south east. HS2 isn’t coming this far north either. I go along with the SNP saying the UK is far to London centric, not to mention Wales either! I’m not surprised they are pursuing independence as they didn’t vote to leave the EU.

If I lived in Scotland I would vote SNP.

We need PR, then we would all have a voice and parties would have to compromise. FPTP is not a useful way to govern. Example: the H of P over the last three years.

They'll learn their mistake soon enough!

What gallusquine said.

We got yet another communication from our totally useless Tory MP this morning saying absolutely nothing about the Tory plans, just whinging on about Nicola Sturgeon and Jeremy Corbyn, neither of whom is standing in this seat. I am fed up with all this fuss about independence at the moment. I hope it will come within my lifetime, but at the moment getting the right-wing Tories out is, to me, much more important.

SueDonim, I was recently talking to a friend who lives in England and is married to an Englishman, and when Scotland becomes independent, they will be moving here, so it works both ways!

I'm not happy with the way Scotland is being governed. It's never been as bad as it currently is, in my experience. The NHS is appalling (the way it's run, not the staff), education has been decimated by the SNP, and local services are non-existent. As for transport & roads, don't get me started.

It might be alright if you live in the Central Belt but if you're rural like me, the SNP don't give a fig about you, except for your money.

I was at a small gathering last week, of eight of us. The talk got round to politics(!) and I was astounded to hear that one born-and-bred Glaswegian said she'd be off to England if Scotland left the union. Another person whose adult children are mostly doctors, nurses and scientists working in the NHS, said two of them will leave Scotland, (one of them for New Zealand) and another person's son-in-law will apply to go to Canada. My own dd, when she's qualified, will also choose England over an independent Scotland.

I was truly open-mouthed at these people, who I would never in a hundred years have expected to hold such opinions. I love Scotland, I have joy in my heart when I see the beautiful surroundings, and I am so sad at what it's become.

vote brexit party .or like me i vote ukip., or green..

I am not happy with the way Scotland is being governed and I will not be voting for a party who have only one agenda, while we have a hospital that sits, unfit for purpose costing us millions a month. Another hospital, brand new that is having serious issues with infection. The Emergency services stretched to the limit. No , I freely admit struggling with who to vote for but it will not be SNP or the Green Party, who, in Scotland are just the SNP in disguise. I do not like Patrick Harvie either, he just agrees with the SNP. No mind of his own.

I will be voting SNP because I am happy with the way Scotland is being governed at present and I ultimately want Independence.

Some sort of coalition might be good as long as SNP don't run (or try to run!) Scotland. Remain in UK and remain in Europe and have a more centrist coalition running the UK for the benefit of us all.

At this point we have to decide whether we want many more years of Tory rule or whether we want Scottish independence.

In the words of Our Great Leader, it’s like asking if it’s preferable to be run down by a lorry or a bus.

So, if little Englanders no longer run the country, will you want Scotland to rejoin the Union?