Gentle Parenting

Best not to comment it's only perceived as criticism. My grandson slept in his parent's room until he was 12 on a mattress on the floor, they actually accommodated him!! He is 16 shortly and thankfully has now "grown out of it".

This is a frustrating situation which many of us as mums go through. Difficult to stay away but let your daughter come to you.Unsolicited advice will make things worse. You may not approve of how your daughter conducts her life but it is her life not yours. What would you do if she lived in another country as do my child and her children.
I am sure that as long as your daughter knows that you are there for her is all that you can do.

It's so hard not say anything but it is best to try not to intervene. That will be resented and cause bad feeling. I know I've been there before. I don't think you should go over the top with helping, the way the children are bought up is her choice and so the consequences of that lie with her. So do what you want to do, but no more. Parenting is very different now, we have to just suck it up!

Stay out of it. You won't change anyone's mind, and will only cause aggro for all. Lose/lose...

Only another 10 years until they won't let her into their rooms and will barley speak, happy days, we have all been there. Once upon a time kids did the decent thing and had an afternoon nap as well.....

You could perhaps tactfully mention the 3 Day Nanny programme in conversation. Just say you've heard its got some really good hints about parents getting their evenings back. It's quite a good programme and has got loads of valuable tips about consistency which is what childcare is all about really. I'm quite lucky as I used to run Mother and Baby classes so my DILs and DD do,sometimes ask for advice but I do always make sure to end the advice with 'but all mums and children are different and what works for some won't work for all!

I am the luckiest Grandmother in the world and it is pure luck - (so far) two DDs have produced offspring (3rd yet to, fingers crossed) and both have brought up their children exactly as I brought them up. Both girls have busy lives and really do not have time to be able to spend all night soothing little ones. The children have a very definite bedtime routine, supper, bath, bed and a story then lights out and the door slightly ajar. The two little girls sleep thru until at least 7.30am - the boys are similar. Both DDs had early days when the babies refused to settle, they went in, did not take them out of their cots, but stroked them and said sleep now, put them back down and left. Now instead of having to get babysitters, they often take the children out with them as they will sleep anywhere so long as they have their cuddlies. I know they are lucky but they did work at it and it is what they wanted. Others who want to spend all night with their children can do that instead but the exhaustion on their faces is awful. I wonder what DD3 will do if she has a baby - probably the opposite!!!!

My concern would be more for the children than the mother. What is this kind of parenting teaching them? That the world revolves around them and their every whim is indulged. The current thinking seems to be that children need to be taught resilience and self-reliance. You can't start that too young!

Watch the brilliant 'Three Day Nanny' on Channel 4. She is a Norland trained nanny...kind but very firm. She soon sorts the mothers out, and the children benefit from having boundaries, and from from less exhausted parents.

I think this child centred obsession is very boring and unhealthy for both parents and children. But I agree with other posters. It is probably not a good idea to interfere. My feeling is that I am a different role model for my grandchildren, and they can see other ways of doing things, that hopefully will benefit them.

I've adopted the attitude that if they want to make a rod for their own back then they have to live with that. DD was like that with her first but they've become harder better over the years.

Their boys come for overnights quite often and I had a very strict bedtime regime; bath, story, teeth and toilet, bed and lights out after 15 minutes. Works a treat, even from babies, slightly adapted now they're older.

They used to ring up about 8.00pm to see how their little dears were doing, only to be told 'they've been asleep for the last half hour'. SiL has beeh known to ask 'Do you drug our children?' (jokingly I think)

Let them get on with it, they'll learn.

I stepped in on a similar issue. I asked permission to do so. My daughter was exhausted, and while the three-year-old has her twisted round his little finger, he is fine with me, listens to the boundaries I set, and his tantrums are fewer and shorter. (I am a long distance granny and they came to visit for ten days). I spoke clearly to my daughter and she was grateful, saying she may not take all my ideas on board but is listening. I took him off her hands as often as possible and she got some rest. This allowed her to get some clearheaded thinking time, and things are much better.

My daughter is an advocate of 'Gentle Parenting', but in her eyes it all hinges on mutual respect and care between parents and child. She is quite firm with DGD, and doesn't let her rule the roost, but on the other hand, she is very patient with the little girl, gives her a lot of freedom, and will listen attentively to her when she is unhappy, even if she's in a strop through being overtired.

I look after DGD two days per week,and I am quite impressed by how good natured and well mannered she is at only 2 1/2. She's a happy and affectionate wee soul, and although she enjoys attention, she can amuse herself quite happily if given appropriate play materials.

That's not to say she's perfect - she's not a good sleeper and takes ages to settle at night. If she overnights with me, she always creeps into my bed, after which I don't hear a squeak, and that's fine by me, but I understand my daughter's wishes that she sleeps in her own bed at home - most of the time anyway!

It's such a common problem that tots won't settle in their own beds. I suppose on an evolutionary scale, we're still cavemen, and it's natural for us all to huddle together through the dark hours of the night. It's not surprising that so many children crave the comfort of another warm pelt beside them, so is it really a problem?

Anyway, gentle parenting or not, I really don't like to see spoiled brats who make their parents' lives a constant misery. I suppose that whatever fashionable name you give it, good parenting is always going to be a mixture of common sense and a great deal of love.

My own children went to bed early after 1 story and a quick bath and they had nightlights on and slept til morning, unless they were ill of course. It was a routine I started when they were very young. Luckily my daughter is the same with her own children, but many of her friends are not. I suppose it's all down to personal preference so I wouldn't say anything if I were you. She will find out in time I think, that her bedtime and sleep habits may well lead to her frustration in the future when she needs time to herself and her kids are still demanding her attention.

Manxgirl it may be worth you researching the growth hormone and its role in child development then you could perhaps have a discussion that sleepless nights do have a negative effect on children that their mum does not realise. If you do a search for google scholar rather than just google you will find some articles on there.

The growth hormone is released during the night hours of sleep and pandering to protracted sleep routines and bed sharing will not help a child learn to settle and develop a lifetimes ability and skill to get a good night sleep. It IS a skill and skills have to be taught and learned. It is difficult and discussions dicey. At the end of the day you may have to wait until exhaustion sets in, but in the meantime it will do no one any favours while the situation carries on.

Good luck.

washerwoman If we believed our daughters, our DCs would all be totally screwed up because we put our babies straight to bed after a feed and they will feel lonely.

I often felt that my very young GCs were somtimes so tired that the stimulation of continuing to sooth them was more stressful for them when they just wanted to be still and sleep. My own daughter in particular often showed this.

I am going sound quite smug here. My youngest daughter and her husband has 4 children. The oldest 14. The youngest 5. I visit them for a long week end accationally it is a joy to spend time with them.
The youngest asks to go to bed about 6.30 as he says he's tired. A bath a story then he goes to sleep and does not need someone with him till he goes to sleep
My daughter is fair and strict. Where no means no
You have Tojo start as you mean to go on from their early years.

When our daughter was little, my two favourite sayings were: "Never let them outnumber you" and "Mummy always wins because Mummy is bigger!" That is, don't let them be the boss! Seemed to work well, because now she is grown up, she has a lovely husband, a fantastic job, lives in New York and we Skype every weekend and get on really well. Sorry, not terribly helpful, but you shouldn't let your children rule the roost and you have to look after yourself - if you aren't happy and are worn out, they won't be happy either. I don't mean they should come second all the time, but you need time for yourself and they shouldn't get in the way of that.

I've just had four weeks of the DGCs and I'm interested in seeing the way that dd2 's parenting differs from mine. I do think they see me as a childminder not as a grandparent who has valuable input for the children but as someone who will do exactly what the parent wants.
Here the children have not got out of bed until 7.00 from lights out at 7.45 pm. At home both children wake and get into parent' s bed. Now as obieone suggests their mum is lonely when their dad is away but she is shattered from interrupted sleep. She says she hates getting up to put them back in their own bed but I hate the fact that she is driving here with them when she is so tired.
Again the food they are so picky and don't like this or that or the other. I have been putting food, very small amounts in front of them,take it or leave it. Supreme indifference if they leave it and after their initial surprise that I wasn't going to cook anything else we seem to have clean plates. Sometimes a bit of cold blooded ruthlessness helps in bringing up children.

Starsgran you sound like you've got it sorted especially when it comes to food.

My DD has just the one - my lovely GS aged 6, he has his moments, no little angel but still a lovely boy with boundaries, he is not very demanding & plays well on his own. He also has lovely manners as neither parent will tolerate a rude child.

I don't always agree entirely with the way my DD brings him up but I never interfere - things change - ideas change

Good luck to all you lovely GMs out there & hope all works well with your DC & DGC

My DS and DiL both work and both share equally looking after the house and their 2 young children. They have a good mix of fun and rules and the children are generally well behaved. But the bedtime ritual is so time consuming that DiL never comes back from the bedroom. I mean.....never. Whether there are guests or they are on their own. DS sometimes says to me how much he misses the time they should spend together in the evenings. Instead he spends every evening on his own with DiL asleep in bed by 9pm. This has been going on for over 6 years and I know there have been many upsets about it. It seems a sad sacrifice. I listen sympathetically but never comment except perhaps to say things will change in time.
My other gripe is the excessive praise given to the children for the tiniest thing they do! But they are good children so it must work for them!
But I would never say

I think the only thing you can do is leave them to do what they wish in THEIR home.
However offer to have the children to give them a break ,be that for a few hours or occasionally overnight. Whilst the children are with you you instill YOUR rules/standards.Children are very savvy and will eventually tow the line. I would then gently mention the positive experiences/habits experienced whilst children with you. Over time they may begin to ask themselves questions as to why children behave differently with you. As an experienced Health Visitor I always look first to the caregiver if i Child is exhibiting unwanted behaviors. Good luck

Ha ha I love all these comments about what we used to do and it worked - bedtime was bedtime - no arguments . One of my sons really loved his bed - he told me so - he was so tired out after a day of playing outside or busy in the house "helping" with activities that he used to ask to go to bed sometimes. in the 60's and 70's I didn't seem to have all these problems with my four boys going to bed or picking up their toys or sitting at the table until we had all finished. Many lovely chats we all had round the table at mealtimes. . Then it was all hands to and clear away / wash up or put in dish washer later. We did things together all the time - hoovering, baking, playing, shopping. P,lease may I leave the table was expected and only if they had eaten all their food - none of this sloping off to play with a toy mid meal !! They were all part of the family team but knew who was in charge and where the boundaries were. Respect for your parents seems to be gone. My family wouldn't have dreamy of saying no to anything we asked Of them - they might try to make a convincing argument but that's different. I think they grew up to be caring and considerate team players always willing to help others and they can all cook!!

Different generations usually do things differently and I can't help thinking that child-centred rearing is just so much better for children when done properly. Getting children to help make decisions allows children to negotiate, express their feelings, etc. It may be a harder path to start with but should equip them for life. Kids generally give up wanting to sleep with parents and being clingy sooner or later; it sounds like your daughter is being the best one available and it may be supporting her by learning about the new methods or talking to her about what her philosophy is about what she does may help you understand her and even get her looking at whether everything she does is in her children's best interests. I have been amazed at how much more secure my GC are in the long run than I was at that age even though I was brought up to be independent.

Sorry Nelliemoser I meant that maybe my DD would feel a bit lonely in the evenings as her partner works away and therefore maybe more be more inclined to prolong the bedtime routine with her little girl.Not the baby ,but my post probably wasn't very clear!Anyway as she's only a week old there's a way to go yet.
However as DD was brought up with a dog or two always in the house,much loved but not allowed up on the sofas and now has her own dog who has his own throw on the sofa,yet is very well behaved I shall respect her decisions on parenting.

Personally I wouldn't interfere. She has her own way of doing things and when they go to school things will change I am sure.

Not all young parents are the same though. My DIL is very hands on, but strict too. This is a snippet of a converation I heard between her and my son the other day:

Son "he's a great kid, we'll be best mates soon"
DIL " no you won't! You're the parent. You'll have plenty of time to be his mate when he's grown up and knows how to behave"

I had to laugh .