The EU and how it works

Thank you whitewave - great idea.

Well, you've got two years to do it in. That'll be nice.

But with luck we will be ahead of the game jing Mind you I am wondering if I have bitten of more than I can chew hey! ho!

Better get a move on - according to the Guardian, David Cameron is drawing up plans to bring forward an in/out referendum on Britain’s membership of the European Union by a year to 2016 in order to avoid a politically dangerous clash with the French and German elections in 2017.

Not two years any more. The referendum will be next year.

If you want your grandchildren to learn about it, there is a kids corner on the www.europa.eu website, too.

Thanks whitewave. I'm terribly ignorant of this sort of thing and I need to understand it better.

What is the easy bit is the structure, the rules, looking at how democratic it is etc but where it will get more difficult is where there are disagreements e.g. too much power etc and the way those arguments came about and developed - anyone got any ideas? What I would like to do is to be as objective as possible and keep debate out of it - that could be for another thread.

Somehow I don't think my grandkids would give a the proverbial, durhamjen.

"CHARTER OF FUNDAMENTAL RIGHTS OF THE EUROPEAN UNION
Preamble
The peoples of Europe, in creating an ever closer union among them, are resolved to share a peaceful
future based on common values.
Conscious of its spiritual and moral heritage, the Union is founded on the indivisible, universal values
of human dignity, freedom, equality and solidarity; it is based on the principles of democracy and the
rule of law. It places the individual at the heart of
its activities, by establishing the citizenship of the
Union and by creating an area of freedom, security and justice."

From the grown up version, but the kids version is just as informative, and has games.
My eldest granddaughter is 22, so she can manage the grown-up version.

The kids corner is definitely a sanitized version! But I dont suppose that many children go on it.

It makes my grandson feel good as he knows all the flags, all the buildings, all the capital cities. He can also click on other languages and find out if he knows any words there.

He can also learn more Danish.

I might look at the one aimed at grandchildren, perhaps I will understand it better!

The thing is, it is so complicated and has been such a long and involved process to get where we are now and there have been so many treaties and amendments to treaties that it would be impossible for most people to get their head around it all unless they have a legal brain imbued in European law.

You have to go back to its foundation and that was mainly to keep the Germans in place at the centre of a peaceful group of Europeans. In this it has succeeded. Peace for 70 years. Now what? The EU sees itself as a force between the East and America with business links to China and India. Dealing with these two opposing sides then, size is important and so the EU grew and grew and needs an awful lot of money to cope with this enlargement.
A single currency and free movement of peoples was intruduced to free up
the single states and cut down on beaurocracy. The UK wants to alter this and I doubt if it will be successful although David Cameron is well respected.
The EU is open to young people who want to widen their scope and see other countries. The UK doesnt seem to have grasped this or to take much part in this. Each young person, who has studied or finished his apprenticeship can go and live on a grant in another European country for 6 months and see what life is like in another country.
For this they will have to have learned a foreign language and here again the Uk is hanging back in this respect,
If the UK comes out then the centre of the EU could move to the East. Poland already wants Germany to play a bigger part, to exert more power. This could result in the centre moving from Brussels to Berlin. Whatever happens America will look to the EU before remembering its'special relationship'
I hope the UK remains IN. anything else is irresponsible regarding future generations of British children.

rq - that is what I did.
The kids one is actually very good. Well, as far as I know not being a child!
Glad your gc likes it dj. It is a good learning tool.

MargaretX - you are not saying that the EU means less bureauacracy are you?

Sorry whitewave. Forgot to keep debate out of this thread.

Next lot

Yesterday I found out that the EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT has MEPS voted in by us who discuss legislation, but surprisingly has no powers to introduce legislation. So democratic? Yes to a point.

EUROPEAN COUNCIL

Members are the Heads of State/government
Has no legislative powers.
Is a strategic and crises solving body, and is the main mover of European integration.
Guides legislative policy and foreign policy.
Meets (E.U SUMMITS) twice every 6 months in Brussels

This is where you hear about Our PM's coming back and moan on about how unfair certain Treaties are - remember Maasricht - more about all that later.

I ma not sure but I would imagine that this is where other ministers like Chancellors also have meet ups to discuss various issues.

Democratic - once again the bodies meeting up are voted in by the European voters, so yes but they have no powers to pass laws only indicate the way forward and to debate legislation/treaties.

Folks I was wrong with regards to assuming that EUROPEAN COUNCIL is where other ministers meet up. They meet up - wait for it - in the Council of European Union!. Getting that sorted as we speak but seems bloody complicated.

I like this pic of the EU parliament building in Strasbourgh equating it with the Tower of Babel

Whizzing along today!

Summary so far

EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT - MEPS who vote on legislation but no powers to produce legislation. Has budgetary authority.

EUROPEAN COUNCIL - Members - Head of States.. Once again no legislative powers, a debating chamber, but sets the tone and way forward.

The next body is the;-

COUNCIL OF EUROPEAN UNION - sometimes known as the Council of Ministers. Based in Brussels.
EU Civil service underpins.
This is where you hear of the 6 month presidency - each country taking in turns.
Members 28 National ministers who have particular portfolios - there are 10 in total called configerations . e.g.general affairs, environment,foreign affairs, economic etc.

No legislative powers. But vote on and and debate proposed legislation.

They also share budgetary authority and legislative authority with the Parliament. Consent from both are needed.

Coordinates economic policy of members - presumably this is for those in the euro? Not sure of that.

Votes are weighted according to each country's level of population - so UK, Germany France and Italy each have 29 votes and the smallest is Malta with 3 votes

When voting they can be of 3 sorts,
1. a simple majority
2. qualified majority i.e. 73.9%
3. Unanimous

Various legislation/laws
The strongest is 1.Regulation - this is directly applicable in its entirety.
next -2. Directives - Bind members to certain goals that they must achieve, but do so through their own laws
3. Decision - focuses on a particular person or group and directly applicable - (not sure what this means)
4. Recommendations and opinions - non-binding

Hope you are not loosing the will to live!!!!

So the MEPs are the only ones who vote. I wonder if UKIP ever do that.

Got that wrong. Council of European Union do as well.
MEPs vote on legislation but do not produce legislation.
Council of European Union do both.

Why do they have/need so many bodies?

Sorry, whitewave, all three of them say no legislative powers.
Is that right?