Me again. I couldn't manage to get the exact narcissistic link Yogagirl but there was a article about 'winning the game'. Apparently you can't win if you play the game, the only way of winning is to get out of the game. For those of us who have backed right off and make no attempt at contact our awful S's/D's and their sociopathic/narcissistic partners, perhaps we have got out of the game - and if so, maybe in the long run we'll win.
I'm going to go back on when I have more time and have a proper read. Would like to be able to get on to the Forum you've been on. I must have done something wrong 
Oh well, I'll get my hubby to try when he gets back from work. It isn't easy being a technophobe 
. To be honest I'm more than a little bit pleased with my self for being able to include little pictures with my posts 
- there's another one!
Gransnet forums
AIBU
Celebgran - open square bracket, put the word in and then close square bracket. They are all listed at the bottom of the page where you post your message if you scroll down. 
Thanks katyk
Didn't sleep last night so appreciated that cup of tea Smileless
One year today since my s.i.l told me to "F***-OFF, one year since I saw my beloved Laila and Jack, infact it was the Tues b4, which was the 13th (that dreaded date again) when I last held them in my arms and gave them a kiss and cuddle and told them I loved them
I wonder if they remember it's a year today, probably not.
I will try and send you another link to that page Smileless and Celebgran and yes what you say is true, about staying out of the game, I went into the game, so now have no hope in hell of seeing my GC, only when they break-up will I see them again Hope your feeling better today Celebgran I would say its the stress making you ill, I feel like I have been holding my breath for a whole year! it's the early mornings thats thw worst!!
I'm going to see a play tonight as well, so hope it takes my mind off things
Afternoon ladies. Thanks for giving us the link again Yogagirl I have just been on; most informative and helpful. Took my babies to the cattery this morning for when we go away. Always feel guilty for leaving them but the lady who looks after them loves them almost as much as I do.
Didn't go the gym this morning as I woke up with back ache and then bought myself a small bar of milk whole nut chocolate. So 3 things to feel guilty about, cats in the cattery, not going to the gym and eating chocolate . My little dog (other baby) goes to the kennels tomorrow so that's more guilt!
Really sorry that you had another bad night Yogagirl . Have you thought about taking some of the herbal remedies that they're always advertising on the tv? They've never worked for me if I'm honest but I know of others who've found them quite good.
So what's this play you're going to see tonight? Murder, mystery, drama, musical or comedy? I need details, details, details. Whatever it is I hope it makes you and helps you to relax. We're meeting friends for a meal tonight. More food I probably shouldn't be eating and probably a few 
. You know what that means don't you? more guilt!
In case you have another bad night Yogagirl another 
for you with a big X.
Hello Smileless
I find it a big wrench too, leaving my little Westie when I go away, so far I've managed to leave her with my ND, but I do need to find another home-from-home for her, as ND can't always be available and she works full time too, wish she'd hurry up and have her babies! My little Westie is pestering me for her dinner now, roast chicken roast pots, veg and gravy, only a little bit spoiled 
I feel so sad today, it being one year ago when this nightmare began, as, of course, to everyone else, including my ND, its a non-event! I've just e-mailed my Son and thought better about mentioning it, so I've now done what my nasty s.i.l ordered, which is make it a taboo subject, I vowed I wouldn't do this, but here I am 
Glad you found the link this time Smileless its very interesting isn't it.
I'm taking 'St.Jon's Wort' at the mo cost me £40 a pot!, when they're finished I'll get those 'Kalms' that are advertised, for day and night time. Before this I was dead against any anti-depressants, so Nasty s.i.l has scored a hat trick 
.
I'm going to see Shakespeare's 'Lady Audley's Secret', hope its good, the last one I saw was 'Romeo and Juliet', its in a beautiful Old Manor House that King henry The 8th used to frequent.
Well Smileless keep eating the chocolate and stay away from those horrid gym's, they just make your muscle ache!! Enjoy your night out and here's some 
, in case the chocolate runs out
. And yogagirl is painful anniversary for you hope you enjoy play.
Well love new car! Bit stressful dealing with it all but salesman was brilliant made us feel special and look ages explaining it all.
Well have good evening smiless and yogagirl and thanks for link will go look later got have rest and cuppa nowl
Hope you sleep better tonight yogagirl x
Enjoy your cultural evening Yogagirl. It's a good thing that you are out tonight as this is a very painful anniversary for you.
Like you, we don't mention the sit. to our lovely S. Not sure if it has become a taboo subject or if it is bec. we don't want to spoil the contact that we do have with him . Because of the lies that he was told about me (we know this because he mentioned them to his dad) I don't really know what he thinks or believes. I feel as close to him as I ever did, so may be he hasn't given what he's been told much, or any credence.
Your nasty s.i.l. has not scored a hat trick; don't you go letting your self believe that he has. Herbal remedies aren't the same as anti depressants (not that there's anything wrong with them if you need them and they help). You have been amazingly strong to get this far (wish there was a little picture of a medal for you but will have to do.
Glad you're pleased with your new car Celebgran; enjoy.
Morning ladies. Glad you had a lovely evening Celebgran. You're right it does hurt like hell; some days everything hurts doesn't it.
Began my day with a . Lovely S 'phoned from the beach in Aus. to wish his dad a happy 60th bday and when I spoke to him he asked how I was holding up. Now he never says anything any more which is specific to the sit. with his brother. It's always along the lines of 'how are you guys doing'; 'are you OK'. You know, light hearted general enquiries. Well I was so pleased that he had 'phoned his dad and then taken aback by his question that I started to cry! I told him it was so hard and that I'd seen our gs. last week with the childminder which really upset me, and he kept saying 'I know mum'. So here I am typing away on here bec. I know you will understand; crying my eyes out when I should be excited bec. we are going on holiday and packing our case!
Why did he ask me? has his bro. said something, like he's unhappy, misses us, wishes this had never happened? I shouldn't even be thinking along these lines, giving my self false hope.
He'd pulled up outside his house last night as we were driving past on our way out and as we approached he lent over to the passengers side and ducked down! He knew it was us as we are the only ones with the car we have.
Sorry ladies for getting for starting your week end's off with my but I had to talk to the only people who really know what this is like. My gransnet buddies. What would I do without you. and thanks for listening.
Morning Girls
I did vow I wouldn't come on here this morning, but here I am , laured on by my ND wanting me to see a pic of my previous sister.i.l (one I dont see anymore, as my B.i.l wife, now divorced) anyway I confirmed that, yes she has had a face lift and botox! she looks good though.
Hello Celebgran thank you for your kind words and nice to hear you are enjoying your lovely new car. Most of my friends have GC and as lovely as it is to hear about theirs, it does bring a lump to your throat. A friend asked me " how's your GC" Thursday, I had been avoiding asking about hers, that was born about the same time as my little Laila, she was gob smacked when I told her, I did well up, it being a year the next day. Yes I enjoyed the play las night, we had a good night, nice to have your mind filled with plesant thoughts for a while
Ah! Smileless sorry to hear your upset and just b4 yours hols. Well, fancy your NS asking how you are holding up! that was nice, as I've said, my S wont speak about it either, so its special when they do. He must have more time to think about things and being away, he could see things more clearly from your point of view. We grasp at small things don't we, my ND txt me, past midnight, last night, to say D has put something odd on her FB page, still waiting to hear what is it, hope it's 'she's left the B*******! My s.i.l used do do that ducking down in the car thing Enjoy your hols Smileless and not too much
Hello grangrumps How terrible for you!! Did you watch that programme during the week (I always record,think it was weds) about "count down to muder, slaughter on the farm' about Jeremy Bamba!!! to you all, you deserve them! and have a good w/e xx
Yogagirl I have special interest in Jeremy barber as his cousins live near us and we knew them from school. I am not certain he was guilty.
Sorry smiless about you being upset here's and have fantastic time on your holiday. Was good your nice son mentioned it, we have complete shutdown if try talk to our son about his sister. He said once long time ago he had over 2 years hearing about child we dont see and was sick of it. Nearly 5 years now.
Must admit would love to have told my daughter about car and it makes you sad inside. However not had tears for week or over since my hrt appt, my daughter always cared so much if had health problems bygone world now!
Yogagirl glad evening was good, we. Just never give up hope. A dear elderly neibor who had long estrangement from her son said to me she prayed to be able to accept things as they were and that they would change but she had to accept she did not know when. I her case it was when her husband was very ill he died but reunion took place. I find some comfort in thinking like that I have accept things are bad but they may change one day, if that makes sense.
Off paint toenails now! Dance tonight and away Tom for one night to Potters leisure resort soul night and 5 course dinner drinks inclusive !
grangrumps1 I wish I could think of something to say regarding your S's. awful remark, but as can't I hope these will do it for me.
Thank you Yogagirl and Celebgran, you're right of course; it was lovely that our nice S asked me how I was holding up. That's probably what made me cry, I just wasn't expecting it. Oh dear that makes it sound as if he isn't normally nice! he is of course it's just not a subject we get in to these days. I was just so touched bec. it made me realise that he does think about the awful sit. we are in.
Curious to know what your D's strange post on FB was Yogagirl; hope it is something positive. Pleased you had a good evening; did you have a better night's sleep, I do hope so.
I hope that if God forbid your S is ever in the same sit. as you and unable to see his gc. that family members will continue to listen to him and him support for as many years as he needs Celebgran. Honestly, what are they like
Hope the toenail painting was a success; what colour did you choose?
Managed to get my self sorted eventually: all packed and ready to go. Thank you one and all. I will get on line a.s.a.p. (hopefully Monday) to catch up with you all.
Have a lovely weekend for you all xx
Afternoon ladies (it's morning here). Arrived safely thanks Celebgran Weather a bit disappointing today as very cloudy; should be sunny from Thursday on wards. Sorry that driving through the village where your D. lives was upsetting for you . It's strange how we put ourselves through this isn't it? Some days I don't drive past our S's house when I'm going out of our village and some days I do. It's a bit like when you have a mouth ulcer and you know if you touch it with your tongue it'll hurt but you do it any way.
Like you, I don't understand how children can be so cruel to their parents . Had an interesting conversation with a friend before we came away who said she couldn't understand how often the children of bad parents do what ever they can to preserve their rel. with their parents and children of good parents can some times be so awful.
I wonder if for those horrible kids with good parents, they think bec. we have always been their that they can do and say what ever they like and we will just put up with it.
Hope all is well with you Yogagirl as you haven't been on since Saturday.
Best wishes to you all.
Morning Celebgran
Get that bucket out, thats what you get for choosing the posh colour lol
I have sensors on my car, they are loud, anyone sitting in the back complaines about them! Yes it prob is the reason your irritable, halfing your hrt, but it will sort it self out. I took a 'Kalm' tab last night to help me sleep, I was a bit worried, I thought my head would hit the pillow and then I'd wake at 7am, but I didn't notice much difference, still awake by 6am. I do think about families seperated by countries, but at least they have Skype, mob. txt and e-mail, so still have contact that way. I think about when I had my first child, I lived in Africa, but came home to have her, then went back when ND was 6wks old, must have been hard on my mum, I think about that now, and am sorry if i caused her pain, but we came back before my ND was 2yrs for my mum and everyone else. I didn't even have a land line there, so only letter writing! Philomina, I want to see that film, sounds v.sad, and Toby roast yum!
Had another email from my Son, his gone up to Aberdeen to work, he asked me to apologize again, ND and I think he's been talking to nasty s.i.l , but totally sorted now and seeing him for Xmas, seeing all my prev. in-laws too, apart from f.i.l to cheer you up xx
Morning Smileless
Glad you arrived safe and well, not happy with the weather!! It's -3 here!!
Run-up to my D B/day, Sat and then their ann. Tues, it was Friday and Mon last year of course, but these dates were 10days after nasty s.i.l told me to FF and where, looking back, I could have perphaps nipped this all in the bud, if only I had remembered it was their first ann! but I was in trauma and therefore forgot. More on this Friday. Think thats right regarding good parents-v-bad.
Here's some [sun] to make your hols more enjoyable. xx
lol (get it right!)
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