Cut out of their lives 3

Smileless People were not "just being judgemental" of msmac.

msmac was alleging that her grandchild had been physically abused but did not want to do anything about it in case she lost contact with the child.

Assuming the allegations she made were true, there was no point in just "being supportive" so as not to hurt her feelings when a child could be seriously injured.

It needed to be reported, however difficult that was in the circumstances to find the right authority.
What else did anyone think could be done in those circumstances?

Ignoring allegations of abuse was not an option.

smileless

Smileless I've pm you.
Just read your poem, it brought a tear to my eye, it really did! A beautiful poem, that you will be able to pass on to M when you see him again in the future & I really hope that will not be too far ahead.
Your friends on here are with you today, walking by your side, holding your arm throughout the entire sad day.
God Bless xxx

To assume that of course the grandmother is completely perfect and must be backed up against all others, and that everyone else is being selfish, cruel and spiteful to them (including those who try to give constructive advice) does not necessarily help her. It may even re-inforce something she is doing that is making the situation worse.

Sometimes the outsider sees more of the game than someone who is in the middle of a similar but never exactly the same problem themselves. Many posters, in truth, have been through difficult relationships and come out the other end, with some painful self-knowledge on the way. Others can suggest possible new ways to relate to the family members with whom there is friction.

There are (yes) one or two people on Gn who can be abrasive for the sake of it, but those who have given advice to troubled posters are trying to help them sort out the problems they posted about. Those were posted under the heading "Am I being unreasonable", remember. Sometimes the answer to that question is "Well, yes, on some things you are! A better approach might be . . ."

One thought that kept occurring to me when I was temporarily deprived of contact with my grandson was 'do you want to be in the right, or do you want to see him again?' There was no contest - whatever it took. I kept my mouth shut and did whatever I could to be helpful, including capitulating on what most people would say were highly unreasonable demands from ex-DiL. Riding it out until her anger and spite switched to someone else was awful, but the benefit was that I got to start seeing my grandson who was in turmoil at home and at school, whilst my son was taking court action to formalise his access. I slipped up once and said that I didn't like what she was doing to alienate my grandson from his dad. Apologised a few days later and explained that we all have a wobble sometimes and asked that she would see it in the context of how she acts when under stress. It was 3 months before I saw him, though, and only because she needed someone to look after him when he came out of school one day.

Three years on, there's a much happier grandson who sees his dad as often as he wants and may be going to live with him when he starts college. I see him every week and email him freely. Ex-DiL is still hostile but doesn't have the power to make my life miserable now. She can't argue with someone who won't engage in an argument, can she? She's busy fighting with another ex now, and has cut off another set of grandparents.

Unhappily, some grandparents may have gone beyond being able to retrieve the breakdown that has resulted in them losing contact with grandchildren. It's a horrible situation to be in and I hope the children make their own informed decisions as they grow up, but for those grans who are still trying to get things back on a civil footing I would say don't engage in arguments and power games - you'll make a bad situation worse. Apologies and offers to help might stick in your throat, but they are nothing like the agony of being deprived of contact with a much loved grandchild.

One final thought - when this thread runs out, why not change the title to something more appropriate? 'Am I being unreasonable' invites posters to consider whether you might be.

When I was living with my parents i followed their rules.
It wasn't my house. I didn't pay the bills.
I respected their rules, i did what i was told.
I didn't like it? Tough. Again. It wasn't my house.
10000% no smoking, back at 10, i hung my coat up, washing in the basket, shoes off at the door..etc.

Now i'm an adult.
I have my own house and own children.. I still follow their house rules because it is not my house.

We have house and rules.
No smoking, no dogs, school uniform in the wash basket, Dd helps with tidying her bedroom, bed at 7, no visitors after 6 unless its a weekend...etc.
It is our house. We pay the mortage, we pay the bills. We have the say. We make the rules. Dont like it? Tough.
Visitors not following those rules are disrespectful and rude.

My dad allways said 'My house, My rules'

Its their house OP. You cant dictate what you can do in someone elses home.

I really hope you your DGC made a safe arrival and you are having lots of baby cuddles! I hope everything is ok and everyone is happy! X

Wise post!

Smileless huge hugs today your poem made me cry, I feel for you from bottom of my heart xxxxxxxx

Smileless I could not agree more having just read your post. nothing will. Make today easier but I am always here for you got dash out now will pm later. Xxxxxx

whenim64,
Thank you for your post.

So pleased that this day in coming to an end. Thank you so much Soutra for theand to you Yogagirl and Celebgran for your kind words on here and the pm's you've sent. I've had some other pm's and I cannot tell you how much all of this kindness has meant.

It's hard to believe that two years have now passed. I try not to think about how it will be in another year's time as it's much better to just take each day as it comes.

Oh well we have our holiday in Florida to look forward too; departing on Thursday. There should be plenty ofso I'll be sure to send all of you some.

Take care all, and thank you.

Wow is that this Thursday smileless? How long for ?will miss you. However has come at good time for you both have wonderful time do you good to get away and focus on fun! Hugs xx

Good post whenim65 I apologised (for things I hadn't done or said) I said I would change whatever it was he didn't like about me, I would have done anything to stay in my beloved D&GC lives, he & his mother would have non of it (remember no blood relation to my precious GD Laila) Three months of keeping quiet & after trying mediation, I started down the road to the court for visitation order to see my beloved GC, biggest mistake of my life

Yes it has come around quickly hasn't it Celebgran and as you say the timing couldn't be better, no coincidence there though. We'll be away for 3 weeks, but don't worry, you wont get the chance to miss me as I'll be keeping in touch.

It's lovely to learn that you now see your gs whenim and that he sees his dad and is much happier now that things have settled down. Sadly for some of us, it isn't just our s.i.l.'s or d.i.l.'s that have taken away our gc, our own children have done it too. So it's a double whammy; no s or d and no gc either.

You tried so hard Yogagirl before you went to court, and when mediation failed you had the courage to do so. I know it didn't work out but you did a very hard and brave thing by trying. We all have to believe that one day, when our gc are older they'll seek us out. I know of other people this has happened too.

One of my friends friend's was contacted just before Christmas by her 18 year old gd who she hadn't had any contact with since she was 7. They met up in January and have met up several times now. They email, text and 'phone one another regularly but her daughter, her gd's mother doesn't know any thing about it. It'sthat the gd is going behind her mother's back but at least she's found her gm and now has a relationship with her.

Just remember Yogagirl that when that glorious day comes for you, you'll be able to tell them just how hard you tried to be a part of their lives and they'll know how much you love them and how desperate you were when they were taken away.

for you all.

I have come and read the thread as some very nice lady invited me to do.
I am so sorry Smileless that it has been so long about your gs. My troubles of not seeing my gc for over a month are trivial in comparison of yours.
May you have a safe vacation and thank you for your comments.
I did not expect people to "just take my side", but have some empathy.
And the person that said we all have too much grief is correct. But sometimes, it is nice to realize you are not alone and unfortunately someone can identify with you and you with them.
I love your poem Smileless.
Since I am from the US, I don't understand some of the local dialect. Sorry.
I think some are not feeling real well, I hope you have a speedy recovery.
I don't understand about the smoking. I don't smoke.
Hope all is having a nice day.

That poem by Smileless should be fronting a campaign somewhere.

So sad.

smileless that's a very poignant poem from you

Do t beat yourself up yogagirl if my dear husband would agree I would go to court, is nearly 6 years and realise I will be unlikely to see my beloved Grandaughter mollie again.

Whenim there is nothing I have not tried or offered to do despite absolutely no contact from my daughter since march 2009 and via solicitors I have still sent presents each birthday and Xmas and cards also at Easter however I finally realise none of it has helped and it just kills me to keep getting rejected so finally got courage to walk away. I have humiliated myself and set. Myself up for rejection and my beloved husband too far too many times.

It is so hard but I am only human and to treat another human being this cruel way is beyond me so have to accept a level of hardness must exist in my daughter and I doubt I would want her in my life again, it is horrid to admit it but I feel blessed and loved by family and friends I do have and finally moved on.

This Xmas nothing and ditto on my daughters birthday however I will always remember my little Grandaughters birthday she has had no say in this.

It is good it worked out for you whenim but as smileless says at least it was not your own Flesh and blood perputating the despicable estrangement.

That takes the pain to whole new level and double loss.

Glad you will be keeping InTouch smileless! Have amazing time. I guessed it was not coincidental timing [cake] but don't undo all that hard work. At gymn!

Yogagirl in your neck woods today source to see Barnum was lovley day out just damn foot was agony so hobbled about like old lady! Oh dear I suppose I am nearly! Please don't beat yourself up anymore you took brave decision and one day your Laila will find you like I hope mollie does me

Sorry msmac I been Away so not sure of your story and this iPad does t like.me scrolling back! Welcome anyway we are supportive bunch here on then whole and then kind friendship has helped. ME through some dark times.

No one has right to judge anyone else we all have some hidden sadness some more than other,

Hello Celebgran hope you enjoyed the show today, I had a lovely stroll on the beach in the sunshine as its my fur child Lilly's birthday today, she 11yrs & first day allowed on beach with her (doggie) Thanks for your kind words regarding the courts, & yours Smileless I've heard that people like them always win, as they are devious & manipulative with their lies & deceit!
Have a good trip tomorrow Smileless & enjoy your holiday in Florida. [Wine]
[Flowers] & for all

Would been great to see yogagirl!, I was hobbling about on my foot ! We ended up in pie and mash shop as took too long trying stuff on in marks.
Show was good! Always feel drowsy at matinees!it was nice and clean and okayish! Pie not very tasty Graham had pork chop which was yummy! Fresh veg very reasonable were going into Wetherspoon s but was soooo crowded no seats!

I try hard focus on Positives and who do have in my life doesn't always work but is only way forward yogagirl . If you hadn't applied to court you would have been upset you didn't like me so please draw line under it.

Have good day everyone x

Morning ladies. Just having some breakfast at the airport; flight leaves at 11, I'm sooo excited.

Thank you for your kind comments Kiora and Jinglbellfrocks. I would love to be able to start a campaign, but wouldn't know were to begin. Any ideas any one?

How lovely to see you on this thread msmac. The pain of being unable to see one's gc is almost too much to bare. Whether it's been for a month, a year or a decade. You are having to deal with the pain of being separated and also the fear of not knowing when or if you'll ever see your gc again. We are all in pain and understand one another's, regardless of how the suffering's been going on. for you msmac I know you'll find love and support here.

Dear Yogagirl, we've lost our children and gc but we have our self respect, our dignity and our integrity. We do not lie, manipulate, control and deceive. Perhaps if we'd done the former we'd still have some contact with them but I doubt it.

"What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul"

Oh *Celebgran you poor thing having to contend with that foot of yours. Let's hope that when you've had your scan they'll be able to isolate the problem and you'll soon be feeling better.

Sending you alland hoping you have a good day. Next time I post it'll be sitting by the pool in Florida. 'Till then, love 'n' hugs to you all.

Perhaps you could send your poem to Esther Rantzen. Wasn't she very concerned about this? Other than that, no, I don't know how you start campaigns.

Morning
I've just pm Smileless to wish her bon voyage, & explained that sadly I have not heard back from my DS
You are doing the right thing Celebgran in not sending cards & gifts to your D , I never have, only to my beloved GC, you can't reward such cruelty!
Have a nice day x

Just seen your post Smileless love that quote, I will use that for my class at w/e. Bon voyage