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In law issue... childcare

(305 Posts)
MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 01:10:54

I have been with Dh for 14 years, married 4 and have 8 month old son.
In laws create minor issues other than when they emotionally manipulated dh to buy house on same road using mil terminal illness as leverage. As i was pregnant i was forced to accept this or create war in my home. Since then my respect for in laws has gone n my dislike grown. It also created a permanent crack in my relationship with DH. But i visit in laws for a few hours every week to ensure mil n fil have regular access, send pics n videos and organised trips to the park and zoo.
My current gripe is me n dh agreed son will fo nursery 3 days a week n i will be home 2 days a week once mat leave finishes.
Today dh says we should leave son with inlaws every afternoon. I am livid as it is a big decision and i know they are pressuring and manipulating him again. He is using cost saving as an excuse and says nursery days are too long for a baby but he has enrolled on voucher scheme at work and i am not interested in saving pennies. He also fails to mention his families views on this. Clearly they have spoken about it and agreed in my absence and he is now “working” on me. This is the very reason mil wanted to keep us local.
I refuse to accept this because:
1. I think my son will benefit socially and intellectually from nursery
2. I do not want in laws to have regular time with son in my absence
3. I dislike their approach
4. I will not have childcare support thrown in my face later or made to feel indebted or grateful leading DH to be further manipulated
5. I don't want them to influence my sons way of thinking or behaviour
Please advise what i can do? Am i being unreasonable or selfish?
In laws dote on son.

paddyann Sat 03-Aug-19 01:44:16

Surely they cant be that bad if they raised the man you love and who is the father of your child? I dont understsand all these posts about DIL's hating inlaws,I have been a DIL for 44 years and I love my MIL dearly.That is not to say we haven't had issues in the past BUT she's a wonderful GM to our children and GGM to our grandchildren.I thinkyou need to sit down with your husband THEIR son and discuss this its his child too and he must have some say in how he's raised.I have a SIL and a dil and I would be horrified if they thought like this about me ESPECIALLY if I had a terminal illness .

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 02:17:29

Hi Paddyann
Thank you for your reply.

Firstly i dont hate my in laws. I do not respect them so much or like them due to their emotional blackmail re house purchase on same road. Is it unreasonable for me to feel resentment especially as DH knew exactly what house we wanted but were both pressured because of mils illness. Does terminal illness justify such conduct? I refuse to be manipulated again re my sons childcare. Again dh and i agreed that a nursery would be best. He even paid into work childcare vouchers whilst i was pregnant off his own accord. Thus demonstrating our joint parenting approach. Suddenly he has changed his mind.

Namsnanny Sat 03-Aug-19 02:42:36

Maternityleave…….Read your original post and the reply to Paddyann back to yourself.

I think you will find you have made your mind up and answered your own question.

I would have thought that the one time you would want to be close to your family was if or when you were dying.

That's not manipulation, its human need.

I wonder how you would feel in that situation?

Best of luck

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 03:01:41

Namsnany
Does closeness with your loved ones at time of death not include regular weekly visits? Days out initiated and organised by me to ensure mil, fil and dh have fond memories? That i can then share with my son when he is older? Does closeness mean forcing house purchase or child care arrangements? Causing son to be torn? I have not made my decision as to how far i will go to ensure my childcare preferences are respected.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 03:04:08

Namsnanny
Maybe i don't fully understand the “human need” aspect. Thank you for sharing your views.

agnurse Sat 03-Aug-19 04:13:00

It is not necessary to live on the same street to be able to share time together. We lived over 100 miles away from my GPs when GF was dying and we still saw them regularly.

If this is how the ILs behave, I wouldn't let my child alone with them for an hour, let alone an afternoon. They are trying to destroy their son's marriage by inserting themselves into it.

YANBU, OP. Sometimes people manage to grow up to be decent human beings in SPITE of what their parents did, rather than because of it.

stella1949 Sat 03-Aug-19 05:11:38

You say you moved there because of MIL having a terminal illness - but she is intending to look after your child ? So she has had a miraculous recovery .

crystaltipps Sat 03-Aug-19 05:18:59

Yes I wonder how she will manage daily childcare whilst being so ill?

BlueBelle Sat 03-Aug-19 06:53:00

* my respect for in laws has gone and my dislike grown* It certainly shows in your post You make you husband sound very weak, is he? Or is he trying to deal with a dying mum and a worried upset dad, is he trying to juggle balls to keep both families happy ?
How can a dying lady offer five afternoons childcare?
You gave in over the house and are a very angry lady because you did, you sound as if you are determined to never get railroaded into anything again
I think you have made your mind up and your baby will not be going to the parents afternoon care, I can understand this but do be prepared for big injuries to your marriage, as your husband tries to appease his parents. He is torn into two, although of course his loyalty should be with you and his son but the fact his mum has a limited time left has pulled him unless of course he’s a mummy’s boy who has always done what his parents expect and never really ‘left’ them only you know that
Stick to your guns but be kind not angry in how you do it

SueH49 Sat 03-Aug-19 07:06:00

IMO it is unreasonable of any parent/parent in law to think it is their right to have a grandchild in their care on their terms. It is the sole responsibility and decision of the parents to decide who looks after their child.

Grandparents had their time of raising a family and presumably raised capable adults who now have the right to dictate how their children are raised and cared for.

If OP's MIL is terminally ill then one has to ask if she is fit to have the charge of an 8 month old baby.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 08:10:11

Thank you for ur replies.
Just to make things clear:
Dh sis is at home. No job (has good financial investments), children, marriage etc. Therefore readily available to care / mother my little one. His other sis is around the corner with adult children. So again available. So mil being ill is not going to impact their care offer.
I just feel torn with saying no and doing what i want v mil being ill amd denying her access.
I think my concerns are because i really CANNOT deal with the challenges that will come with them looking after my child. Eg. Food preferences, naps, routine, going out (mil will take him to friends houses, i may not know friends etc) i will have signed up to a lifetime of these issues with a dh who cant say no. 😭😭. I just about cope and get by now. If push comes to shove i may leave work. Also what happens if we fall out with mil?

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 08:12:59

Also if i share this with dh he will find answers fir it all. If he insists too much, i will leave my job and return to work when our child goes to school. This will keep dh and i together without causing war.

Daisymae Sat 03-Aug-19 08:27:46

Well I guess that you have your own answer in the last post. Perhaps you need to sit down calmly with your husband and say just that. Your preference is nursery or you stay home with your child. Perhaps that would be for the best anyway. It does seem that you have been put into an impossible position.

BlueBelle Sat 03-Aug-19 08:30:47

How ill is this mother in law if she’s out visiting friends etc I was reading it as if she’s on her death bed ? Also you say i m signed up to a lifetime of these issues I thought she was terminally ill so wouldn’t be around all that much longer ?
Let’s get to the bottom of this you don’t like your mother in law, you don’t trust her, and you don’t want your son with her, that’s basically it, isn’t it?
If you and your husband can’t agree about the nursery then that is a big problem and perhaps you do need to be a stay at home mum until mother in law dies
Are they really that bad how come they raised a son you obviously love and at least two other daughters you clearly trust What is so bad about them?

Sad for them sad for your husband and obviously annoying for you are you sure it’s not your anger at the buying of the house that is eating away at you, were they decent in laws for the other 13 years ?

Daisymae Sat 03-Aug-19 09:00:09

It sounds to me that the op is angry at being manipulated by this family. They are in the same road, other daughter and family with the in-laws, another sister just around the corner. Sounds a bit much.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 09:05:17

Hi
I dont like his sisters. They are in the same league as his mother. Mil tried to stop our wedding until 3 days before the ceremony. Again her illness led this. Yet on wedding day she “adored” me. So not it has not been a pleasant 14 years.
Mil has not been on her deathbed. She has cancer and is in and out of treatment. I have a good job. A nice little local earner and it will sadden me to leave now cos of in laws and dh. ☹️😩

NanaandGrampy Sat 03-Aug-19 09:06:15

I don't think you want anyone else's opinion quite frankly. You've made your mind up and that's all there is to it.

I doubt you would change your mind .

March Sat 03-Aug-19 09:07:34

How can a terminally ill woman look after an 8 month old 3 days a week, have visitors, visit people and go out on day trips?confused

Your DH sounds like he can't say 'No' to her but doesn't have a problem saying it to you. Buying a house you didn't want but felt bullied into buying is massive.

Stick with the childcare at nursery. It will probably hit the fan but at some point she needs to hear the word no!

TwiceAsNice Sat 03-Aug-19 09:13:10

I think you seem to have been mostly ok with MIL until you felt manipulated into moving to a house you didn’t want. Anybody would be resentful of that and of course that has eroded trust. Before you were pregnant did MIL have a habit of manipulating you/ using emotional blackmail or is this new behaviour.

What is terminally ill? That can be living for a few weeks or a few years which is a big difference. I think you need to have a very frank chat with your husband and decide if you can compromise eg maybe allow 1 afternoon a week at MILs or whether you stay at home and care is not needed. If you can afford to do that it may be a better solution then you will not miss any baby milestones. They grow up very fast.

TwiceAsNice Sat 03-Aug-19 09:15:24

Sorry I hadn’t read previous post which says she has always been difficult . In that case don’t give an inch she sounds a nightmare

eazybee Sat 03-Aug-19 09:18:06

Your issue is with your husband, not with your in-laws. He seems to be making all the decisions, whereas those about work and childcare are between you and your employers. Are you able to change from three full days a week to working every afternoon, or have you not discussed it yet with your employers? Child care is very expensive, and you may have to use all your wages to cover it, but it seems that , to you, money is not the issue.

You certainly resent your in-laws, and I think if you are in the financial position to stay at home while your child is young you should do so, and bring him up yourself. This is a decision to be reached by you and your husband, who seems to want his parents overly involved in the upbringing of his child; you have to insist that it is what suits you and the child, not his family, which must come first.

dragonfly46 Sat 03-Aug-19 09:18:27

I blame your DH. He should put your needs first and stand up to his mother and sisters. I am sorry you bought a house in the same road. I was in a similar position when I was first married. MiL used to dominate all our weekends and as we were both working we had no time to ourselves. I was desperately unhappy. Fortunately we moved hundreds of miles away but I had 4 years of hell.
Demanding MiL’s are very difficult to deal with unless your DH takes a stand. Try to stand firm about the childcare. It is your decision. Talk to your DH, choose a moment when you are both in a good place, don’t make it an argument and explain exactly how you feel if you don’t your marriage will suffer.

PECS Sat 03-Aug-19 09:19:57

Compromise! Is that possible? On the grounds that if MiL is terminally ill it would be an added stress to have a daily commitment to child care. So a regular afternoon or two with grandparents/ auntie and the rest of the time at day care. Baby will get best of both.. social development & fun with other ch at nursey and family bonding & fun with extended family. Both needs are met. Your baby will always be closer to you than aunts/ grandparents as long as you can be a good enpugh parent and shelve your dislike. Do not be jealous of the love they have for your child..be pleased! Kids will be confused by tension between the people they care about so tread carefully. Be reasonable and clear but concede some ground. You will be behaving maturely and sensibly.

BlueBelle Sat 03-Aug-19 09:39:10

Husband is the problem I m afraid if you don’t like any of his family the move was a major mistake (pregnant or not)
I think you have completely made up your mind none of the in laws will be looking after the baby so it’s now between you and your husband, and to be honest this doesn’t bode well if you haven’t untangled him from his family in 14 years what chance now, I think you’re between a rock and a hard place you either learn to get on with them and make compromises or move away with or without your husband

NanaandGrampy Sat 03-Aug-19 10:18:34

I’m stunned to read that one of your issues is that your MiL might take your child to visit people you don’t know??

Did they do such a terrible job raising your DH that they’re untrustworthy? Are they likely to take your child somewhere detrimental ? Are you going to deny your child the opportunity for meeting new people and experiences because you don’t know the people ?

I’m sorry because I just cannot buy into this whole scenario of vilifying your in-laws. You agreed to live in your current house - you seem quite capable of standing up for yourself so why did you agree? You say it’s caused a wedge between you and your husband - is this really going to help matters ?

Maybe instead of coming here and looking for support from strangers , it’s time you sat down and discussed this with your husband .

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 10:43:35

Mil has had cancer for 7 years and three round of chemo. She is due for another round in the next few months. So i dont really know how long or little time she has.
NanaandGrampy- i agreed to the housemove as i was pregnant and didnt want to leave my marriage when my husband and i get along perfectly well when in laws do not interfere. I didnt want to deny our child of both parents for the sake of escaping in laws. We live in times where people divorce so quick. I think it takes courage to try and make it work. “Vilifying my in laws”? If i was doing that i would not say they are great grandparents. If i did not feel guilt or torn i would have put my foot down and said no. So how does that match with you questioning my intention for posting? I am guessing you probably behave like my mil hence ur comments. Yes a convo with husband will happen. With advice from here, i will be better informed and much more calmer with a better perspective on what to say and do. That was my intent when i posted.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 10:45:41

And yes i am concerned my mil will visit friends and relatives i do not know or trust. All kinds of abuse takes place in peoples homes. Why would i extend my trust to friends and family of mils/ and their visitors?

eazybee Sat 03-Aug-19 10:47:00

Apologies; I hadn't read all the posts properly before I posted.
I understand your feelings better now; you are being overwhelmed by your husband's family, and it is not just your mother-in-law, it is also sisters- in-law and probably their cousins and their sisters and their aunts as well. Your husband has manipulated you into moving as close back home as he can get, by using his mother's serious, not necessarily terminal illness, and now he intends his family to play a large part in the upbringing of your, not their, child.
A poor way to behave.

You do have to take a firm stand over this and be very clear about what you want to do. It may be wise to hold on to your job, because you enjoy it, and it will give you some financial independence and a life away from this slightly suffocating family. Consider the possible options with your work first and if you decide to return, make sure that you organise the childcare first, then tell your husband your decision, and do not allow yourself to be be browbeaten.
It is up to you how much you choose to see your in-laws, and it would be kind to see them regularly; you may also be grateful for some assistance with child care later. But again, on your terms.
It doesn't sound as though it will be easy, but if you allow them to dominate the care of your child, you will be even more unhappy.

Bibbity Sat 03-Aug-19 11:00:37

You need to check if your son can even be around her at all with some of the treatments.

YANBU. But you need to get mad at your husband. Tell him if he wants to co parent with his mum then he can crack on with the baby making. But you are your child’s mother and all decisions and discussions only involve you two.

Nonnie Sat 03-Aug-19 11:30:12

Sorry but I don't think some of this rings true. MiL is terminally ill and about to have another dose of chemo. She wouldn't even offer to have the child.

Forced to move into a house you didn't like or get divorced? Doesn't sound like a good marriage to me. If you did that why are you worried about a loving grandparent looking after a baby? What is wrong with taking a baby to meet people you don't know, MiL wouldn't leave him alone with them and it is good for children to meet different people and see different homes. Do you take him to your friends?

Don't like the rest of the family either? These terrible people brought up the man you love?

Hmm sounds like a control issue to me.

Presumably you've asked everyone on Mumsnet too?

stella1949 Sat 03-Aug-19 11:36:51

I've seen your post on Mumsnet as well. Instead of asking a multitude of strangers about this, why are you not talking to the one person who actually matters - your husband ?

M0nica Sat 03-Aug-19 11:55:09

Surely you realised before you married him that your DH was putty in his mother's hands and that she was a dominating woman.

So many of these family issues depend on the character traits of individuals that must have been clear during courtship, let alone, the early childfree years, so should surely have been assessed, discussed and decisions reached either jointly or individually then.

paddyann Sat 03-Aug-19 11:58:44

Quite honestly I think you need to seek help.its not normal to think your in laws will take your child visiting people who may abuse him.
What kind of world do you think it is? The vast majority of people are good and kind and will be a happy addition to your sons life .You wont be able to keep him away from everyone all his childhood ,he'll meet "strangers" every day .Are you going to strap him to your side?
IF as you say they are good GP's what is your issue ? I have looked after all 4 of my GC since they were small babies.one of them has lived with me for half of every week for 9 years and the new baby expected this month will join our happy wee gang ,Not once have either my SIL or DIL ever questioned my ability physically or mentally to care for their children.Thank goodness my sons not married to someone like you ! Families should be there and work together for the GC .Children gain so much from being with the older generation of a family .

Callistemon Sat 03-Aug-19 12:01:13

Ah, Mumsnet!
I'm sure they can advise you about your terminally ill, overbearing MIL.

Actually, if she is having chemo she may have been advised not to come into contact with a young baby both for the baby's sake and for her own in case the baby gave her an infection. A baby going to nursery may be in contact with viruses, infections that could be passed on to your vulnerable MIL.

Sorry but I don't think some of this rings true. MiL is terminally ill and about to have another dose of chemo. She wouldn't even offer to have the child.
I agree, Nonnie

Is this what someone referred to as wooden spooning?

NanaandGrampy Sat 03-Aug-19 12:02:12

You're guessing way off MaternityLeave !! Hence , Im not on here asking total strangers for advice you don't really want.

I totally agree Stella - the OP is asking ONLY for support for her point of view where the person who needs to agree with her is her husband.

Well said Nonnie !

Callistemon Sat 03-Aug-19 12:05:16

"Vilifying my in laws”? If i was doing that i would not say they are great grandparents

But not so good that they can be trusted to watch out for your child and will take him to visit possible abusers - and stand by while all this is going on?

This gets more and more fantastic.

Minniemoo Sat 03-Aug-19 12:07:21

Very strange. Your mother in law is having chemo? Then there is your excuse for you not to send your baby to her. As someone else has said it's not advisable for either her nor the baby. So just calmly say that due to the cancer treatment it's impossible to rely on her for care.

Callistemon Sat 03-Aug-19 12:10:09

I am guessing you probably behave like my mil hence ur comments
grin
This follows the usual pattern of an OP accusing posters who do not agree whole-heartedly and sympathise with her side of the story of being bad MIL, just like her own.

Boringly predictable.

Luckygirl Sat 03-Aug-19 12:18:55

It looks as though you are harbouring a deep resentment of PIL for manipulating your OH to buy a house nearby against your wishes; and I am sure this is colouring all your interactions with them.

It is a very emotive issue, as we all want our small children cared for by people with whom we have an instinctive connection and with whom we feel in harmony. You do not have to justify this feeling - it is what it is.

This connection is not there; nor with your sister-in-law and I can understand that this must be a very uncomfortable situation for you.

Personally I would forego the job, as you can afford to, and soak yourself in the joy of watching your DC develop at this critical time. I took 5 years off initially to be with my two oldest children until they started school - I have never regretted this and loved every (well nearly every!) moment.

This will get you over your dilemma and when the children are a bit older you might feel more inclined to tolerate influences that give you concern as they will have a firm grounding in your values.

BlueBelle Sat 03-Aug-19 13:03:52

You really are contradicting yourself after saying you don’t trust your parents in law or more to the point mother in law you say they are wonderful grandparents, well they can’t be both they can’t be untrustworthy and wonderful
When my parents or in laws looked after my child or children I never once questioned where they were taking them or if they were visiting anyone etc etc Do you really think they would let them be abused in a friends home ??? I think you have big issues around the control of your little one
I think you need to stop work and look after your little chap yourself 24/7
I fail to understand how you could be with someone 14 years and not realise they were very tied to their family until now

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 13:31:46

Nonnie; READ THE POSTS BEFORE QUESTIONING MY INTEGRITY.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 13:34:27

Bluebell- i dont think anyone “allows” their child / grandchild to be abused. Most abuse cases happen not with strangers but with family, extended family and friends. My dh was in a similar situation when he was 7/8 with a friend of MILs. It was not her fault as it could happen to anyone. But because of this i trust no one but those i know personally.

fizzers Sat 03-Aug-19 13:37:56

why the need to shout? MaternityLeave

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 13:39:03

Lucky girl i think you have hit the nail on the head.
I dont understand posters that say “why are you here, you should speak to your husband” or “i am looking for posters to agree” if that was the case i would posted solely on mumsnet. But i wanted critical but kind advise. My MILs perspective perhaps. Thank you to all for responding. Both support and criticism. It will be valuable in helping me reach a solution and my approach when i tackle this with DH.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 13:40:35

Fizzers: because its a difficult time and if one is going to pass harsh judgment and false accusations they should be bothered to read all posts first.

Doodle Sat 03-Aug-19 13:52:28

Why don’t you ask your DH what kind of family he comes from. Did his mother and father take him and his sisters to visit abusive family and friends when they were young? Is that why you have such distrust of his family now?
Don’t forget, you may be your child’s mother but your DH is the child’s father and presumably has as much say as you in your child’s upbringing so instead of asking us total strangers, why don’t you discuss this very personal issue with the only other person whose opinion counts - your child’s father.

Doodle Sat 03-Aug-19 13:53:55

I have read all the posts before replying. I think your problem is the relationship between you and your DH not between you and your in-laws.

crazyH Sat 03-Aug-19 14:05:51

Not many d.i.ls would move house just so that DH could be near his parents. I applaud Maternityleave for that.
I do not think the OP is unreasonable. She wants the best for child.....what's wrong with that? And realistically, her m.il. is too ill to be looking after a toddler, much as she would like to.
All the best Maternityleave

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 14:06:18

Oh Doodle there is no point talking to you as you must be on another planet. You did not read my posts. If you did you would know that i have two sils that will look after my son aswell as MIL.
My dh found himself in a situation where mils “friend” abused him. My MIL did not take him there to be abused. She went to visit a friend she mistakenly trusted. It can happen to anyone. So do not be flippant about abuse just to try and make me look like an idiot. My relationship with DH is fine. Our ONLY issue is interference from in laws.

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 14:08:56

I agree compromise is a good idea here. I did say mil can care for my son between 4.00-6.30 one to two days a week. I am not a monster restricting complete access. It saddens me that grandmas and mils have such strong view and no empathy. Are we to live by your rules just because you loved and raised your children?

MaternityLeave Sat 03-Aug-19 14:09:26

Thank you Crazy H.

GoodMama Sat 03-Aug-19 14:49:43

MaternityLeave, my heart goes out for you dealing with such an awful situation.

My only advice is to listen to your gut. You know what’s best for your LO. Your DH should as well, but sadly he seems more concerned with his mother and sisters feelings and wants.

Stand your ground. Perhaps explain to him how awful it would be to have to “fire” them or end all unsupervised visits should things go badly. That certainly would make Christmas dinner awkward.

That’s the beauty of professional childcare. It’s a professional relationship. If you don’t like the care they provide you remove you LO. No drama, no crying.

This is unpopular on this board, but family as regular childcare is a bad idea. It confuses roles. Just let her be grandma and his sisters be aunts. No need to blur the lines.

Hugs to you.

BlueBelle Sat 03-Aug-19 15:04:19

I think you may be getting harsh replies from some because you are coming across as pretty strong minded and not very open to advice On a forum like this you will get answers you don’t agree with or like to hear, you will probably get as many answers as there are people

Yes children do get abused in their own homes and the highest proportion of abuse is by known people so that’s is perfectly true, but are you saying your in laws are still friendly with the abusers of your husband ? That seems very strange if your mother in law was visiting the friend that abused him how on earth did the abuse happen while she was there ? Again that seems strange it doesn’t normally happen with the Carer there
Anyway that is all immaterial as if you mother in law is having chemo she won’t be out visiting much I m thinking

4 to 6.30 one or two days a week sounds very fair what has your husband said to that ?

I don’t agree with Goodmama most people can’t afford childcare and need to rely on family and there is nothing wrong with that 9 times out of 10

ElaineI Sat 03-Aug-19 15:15:08

How about one afternoon a week to help with the nursery costs? 4 to 6.30 is fine but not the best time for babies and toddlers as they get crotchety towards bedtime. Your baby is quite young so maybe not yet at that stage. Childminder brings us DGS 16 months at 5.30 two days a week and he is usually a bit cross and hungry and very difficult to prepare tea unless someone else does it - (DH) usually. Then its bath and pyjamas and home to bed. DD gets in about 6 or just after depending on bus so quite rushed. It is easier on the days where we have him all day and we can play in the garden park etc.

Namsnanny Sat 03-Aug-19 15:47:36

Bluebell....Thank you for having more patience than I, and stating kindly and clearly your/my point of view!
Clearly I have mil dil ‘fatigue’ grin

Nonnie Sat 03-Aug-19 16:16:54

Why did you need to shout at me? I did read all the posts which is what brought me to the conclusion that some of it didn't ring true.

You say that abuse happened when your DH was 7/8 so presumably he was left alone with someone your MiL trusted. However she would not leave a baby alone would she? That simply does not apply. Can you be sure that you won't ever leave your son with a trusted friend? Even a trusted nursery or school? Of course not, yet you blame your MiL for something that was not her fault.

If you come on a thread like this and expect everyone to pat you on the head and agree with you, you must be either very naive or have lived in a bubble. What would be the point of asking for advice if you didn't actually want various viewpoints.

A strong minded person like you would not have simply been talked into buying the wrong house so I wonder if there was a financial element to the purchase which made you feel you had less say in the matter? You must have agreed to it if it is in both names so should simply accept it and not bring it up as an argument against your PiLs.

I find your lack of empathy to a terminally ill person, who you say if a good grandparent, rather harsh. She doesn't have long to live so, for the sake of your husband, surely you can make her last few months pleasant? Do you really want to grow old knowing how you treated a sick person?

Doodle Sat 03-Aug-19 16:21:30

You have not mentioned abuse before on this thread so how are we supposed to know this happened. My advice stays the same. Talk to your DH. I am blessed with two lovely DILs for which I am very thankful. I have no idea why my post would lead you to mention your SILs or that you think I’m on another planet. In fact your reply to me makes no sense at all.

Doodle Sat 03-Aug-19 16:29:49

I would never tolerate a child being abused and certainly would not make light of it. Our children and grandchildren are the most precious things in the world. Your MIL must have been mortified when she found out.

agnurse Sat 03-Aug-19 17:12:44

There's no evidence to suggest that MIL is going to die within the next few months. There is evidence to suggest she is incredibly manipulative and uses her illness to get what she wants.

Is that someone you want around a child?

Callistemon Sat 03-Aug-19 17:26:26

Nonnie; READ THE POSTS BEFORE QUESTIONING MY INTEGRITY.
Well, I think she did!

Nonnie Sun 04-Aug-19 10:18:22

Thanks Callistemon. On another thread a GP has asked for advice and thanked everyone even though she thought some were harsh. That is an adult reaction which unfortunately does not seem to be the case on this thread.

When I discussed this with DH this morning, his first reaction was that the OP should be helping the terminally ill MiL rather than than complaining about her and the whole family. He has a point. I certainly put my terminally ill MiL above everything else despite having very different views on many things.

fizzers Sun 04-Aug-19 10:43:56

Agree with you Nonnie not one thought has been given to this terminally ill MiL

Callistemon Sun 04-Aug-19 11:42:50

It's all rather odd.

MissAdventure Sun 04-Aug-19 11:49:07

Strange to think that there should be 'evidence' that someone is going to die in the next couple of months.

I can assure you, it happens, agnurse.

notanan2 Sun 04-Aug-19 12:04:13

Agree that your problem is not with your ILs it is with your husband.

It wouldnt be a problem what they asked for if he wasnt agreeing in your absence.

You are not a team. He is raising his child with his parents rather than with their mother (you)

paddyann Sun 04-Aug-19 12:45:32

I dont agree notanan I think this man is trying to do whats best for everyone.His mother is terminally ill ,he wants his child to spend some time with her while its possible .HE'S the baby;s father.Dont we usually hear an outcry on here about men distancing themselves from their families because of their wives?

I think he's right .I think the OP is the controlling one who want total say over THEIR child .He has equal rights to how he's raised .

knickas63 Sun 04-Aug-19 12:48:19

Having read all your posts I think their are a few issues. You are clearly trying to ensure there is good and reasonable contact between your DS and his grandparents. They want more and are trying to force it on you. This has caused the anger you feel at their previous manipulation to bubble over. Stand your ground re childcare, but maybe reduce it by one day and let them have him. Kids are pretty resilient, and one afternoon of not following your rules to the letter won't hurt him.
The other issue is harder. You need DH on your side. However, he obviously loves his family and is worried about his mum. His mother's health will effect the way he sees things. You need to resolve the feelings around the house, and he needs to understand how threatened and manipulated you feel by his family. It's important you end up on the same page.
Thirdly, you need to chill. You come across, possibly wrongly, if so I am sorry, as very uptight and controlling. Try to relax a little. Children benefit from different influences. If you try and completely control your sons experiences you will do yourself and him no good. I am talking in general here.

notanan2 Sun 04-Aug-19 12:50:38

Being involved does not = making important decisions about where to live or childcare WITHOUT involving the other parent.

There are 101 ways he could support his ill mother without cutting the childs mother out of the equation and only filling her in as an after thought, pressuring her to "agree" to things that are allready decided and set in stone without consulting her.

Slowcookervegan Sun 04-Aug-19 12:52:35

Maternityleave . I totally agree with you. Stand your ground. If the inlaws are not well a baby is not going to help them. The baby is better off 8n childcare. Good luck.

notanan2 Sun 04-Aug-19 13:11:43

OP is offering lots of GRANDPARENT access/time/activities/visit but they want to co-PARENT her child with her DH. That is not okay. At all. She is being cut out of her own life!

quizqueen Sun 04-Aug-19 13:35:13

Compromise by allowing them to care for the baby one afternoon a week OR whenever the baby is ill and can't go to nursery- this will be a lot at first, believe me, I work in a nursery and they are always ill in the beginning until they pickup a resistance to catching whatever is going around.

Also, I thought the childcare vouchers scheme was coming to an end, I may be incorrect there, I will check it out.

Nonnie Sun 04-Aug-19 14:19:25

Is she dying or not? If she is then how on earth is this relevant? "I don't want them to influence my sons way of thinking or behaviour" he is a baby and can hardly be influenced in any detrimental way before she dies!

Imo you are trying to alienate your husband from his entire family. You don't like any of them! They could be a great support to you if you would only let them. If you are kind to them you can call on their support in an emergency or if you have another baby. Why does it have to be all your way, what is wrong with a bit of give and take? Nothing wrong with a bit of healthy compromise. Many on here have DiLs who are very grateful for the child care and emotionally secure enough not to be jealous.

notanan2 Sun 04-Aug-19 17:25:11

Imo you are trying to alienate your husband from his entire family.

HOW on earth is the OP doing this???
She just wants a say in her own and her childs life! The ILs see LOTS of the OPs family, she just doesnt want them controlling her life!

agnurse Sun 04-Aug-19 18:17:56

This woman has been treated for cancer several times and is undergoing further treatment with no prognosis as far as OP knows.

I rather doubt she is going to die any time soon.

Callistemon Sun 04-Aug-19 18:36:11

I rather doubt she is going to die any time soon.
What makes you so sure?

I think that if someone is receiving palliative care they will not really feel up to caring for a young baby anyway.
As I said, it all sounds rather odd.

BlueBelle Sun 04-Aug-19 18:46:37

Who said anything about palliative care though, she seems to be popping to visit (possible abusive) friends) and looking to do child (baby) care so cant be very unwwell even if she has a terminal diagnosis
It is all odd callistemon

Callistemon Sun 04-Aug-19 18:50:34

If the diagnosis is terminal there could be other treatments available, of course.

However, some kindness is always welcome too.

MissAdventure Sun 04-Aug-19 19:09:27

We rather doubted my daughter was going to die anytime soon, until she did.
How unkind and unfeeling, not to mention ignorant!

Hithere Sun 04-Aug-19 19:53:47

Maternityleave,

I agree with nonanan2 and agnurse.

You already see your ILs weekly, which is a lot. Do you even see your friends every week?

There is no need to "compromise" with MIL and daycare.
Why does she need time alone with your baby? Is she even capable of taking care of baby being terminal and receiving treatment?
The side effects of chemo are brutal and she may not be able to be around the baby whole receiving treatment.
She is a manipulator using her disease for own selfish agenda.

Hell, we are all terminal. We do not know when we are going to die. Your mil has been sick 7 years and counting, how much longer is she going to last?

Deal with your dh, he is the problem

Callistemon Sun 04-Aug-19 23:19:01

What a vile post Hithere

Although you are right, none of us can predict the future. However, if we are to believe this saga hmm, then the MIL's future has been predicted as limited.

Starlady Mon 05-Aug-19 00:08:47

I feel for you, MaternityLeave. I understand that you must feel pressured, manipulated, and put in "second place" (my words) by DH to your ILs. Hugs!

You say you would like some of the MIL perspective, if possible, and as an MIL, myself, I think I can see it, especially in this case. Given her illness, I imagine that MIL is feeling a little desperate, afraid she won't get "enough time" w/ her GS before she dies or gets to ill to enjoy him. FIL and your SILs may be worried for her, as well. IMO, you are being very generous w/ your time, but no time may seem like "enough" to them right now and no location "close enough" (that would explain the house issue). Or they may be a possessive family, anyhow, IDK.

But, IMO, even if their behavior is driven by MIL's illness, that doesn't mean you and DH have to let them take over your decisions. In fact, I think it means you need to be even more vigilant about seeing that doesn't happen. You both need to make sure that choices about your life and your child are still made by the two of you and only the two of you.
What bothers me the most is that DH seems to have discussed the childcare issue AFTER he had already made a decision w/ you and even enrolled in a childcare voucher program at work. It sounds as if he mentioned it to his parents or sisters, and they objected. Instead of saying, "sorry, this is between ML and me and the decision has already been made," he made the mistake of listening and letting himself be influenced by their (so-called) concerns.

IMO, you need to have a talk w/ DH and let him know that, in the future, parenting decision need to be made by the two of you, only, w/ no one else getting a vote. If he wants to seek his family's advice, he should, at least do it BEFORE he makes a decision w/ you, not agree to a plan of action and then change his position b/c he spoke to them. But, given their ulterior motives, IMO, it's better if you discuss these issues w/ each other only. And surely, once you and he make your parenting choice, it should be final.

I get that DH's sisters would be doing more of the care than MIL, so her illness wouldn't interfere w/ that. Therefore, yes, a compromise of 1 afternoon a week might be a good idea.
However, I think you need to mull that over carefully, if you feel you can't trust MIL not to take him to see people who might endanger him. That's a common fear in today's world, and, clearly, you have a specific reason to be worried.

No doubt, you're worried that fighting DH on this would widen that "crack" in your marriage. But letting the ILs make all your decisions will hurt your marriage, too, and eventually, perhaps, destroy it. Please fight for what you feel is best for your marriage and your child.

In the end, resolving the issue by staying home may be the best option. There are many years ahead in which you can work, and you may truly enjoy being there for all baby's "firsts," etc. I know I did. Please let us know what you decide.

Starlady Mon 05-Aug-19 00:15:26

As for the idea that you should be helping MIL, that would be very kind, but I don't know if you could do that w/ a glad heart, right now. Perhaps once the interference issue is settled? Plus, I'm sure you have your hands full w/ your baby. Besides, MIL has a husband, I take it, and 3 AC, is that correct? I don't think you should feel guilted into pitching in on top of everything else.

Namsnanny Mon 05-Aug-19 00:20:17

Callistamon….vile is just the right word.

MissAdventure…..So true.

Starlady Mon 05-Aug-19 00:38:22

MissAdventure, so deeply sorry for your loss. xx

BradfordLass72 Mon 05-Aug-19 00:59:59

I think we all have to accept that MaternityLeave has had 14 years of experience of this family.

Up to now, she's kept the peace, been a good daughter-in-law (even though they jeopardised her and DH wedding) and still wants to be, despite their shenanigans.
I think this is admirable actually.

Now, along comes a precious baby and they see another lever to add to the terminal illness.

Under no circumstances, even if she had expert nurses on hand, should a lady who is dying, have care of a small child.
She's not going to get any better and her carers will have their hands full with all the necessary (and perhaps unpleasant) tasks which terminal illness brings.

This little fellow is 8 months old and in the blink of an eye will be walking and getting about the place - in a non-childproof home. If the carer has no children, is she on the alert for an active child who may grab medication or be hurt by equipment?
Is this really the right environment for a growing, curious toddler?

His Daddy planned for childcare before his birth, his Mummy wants childcare and that is by far the best environment for him as he grows and seeks to learn about his world.

He needs to be with people who know, love and are alert and trained for little hands, and quick wits, and running toddler feet. He needs to be in an entirely SAFE environment.

So my view is this MaternityLeave: sit down with your husband tell him he was right in the first place to pay in to the voucher scheme.
Ask him to see the long view and that his mother's care really needs to be first on the list with the carers in that house.
Just as your son's welfare has to be a priority in yours.

Say you would like to present a united but loving front to his family (after all, you have proved you care about them, even if you don't much like them) for well over a decade.
You are prepared to take your son, well supervised for regular visits and outings with grandmama as long as she can manage it.

Don't let this turn into a battle which drives a wedge between you and your husband. Despite not liking your mil, you obviously want to be fair to her and your husband will value that. Now and much later.

I can see how DH will want his mother, on borrowed time, to see as much of her grandson as possible, but you are not preventing that, just doing what is clearly best for your little boy. It's a compromise all need to accept.

I hope it all works out.

MaternityLeave Mon 05-Aug-19 08:34:12

Hi everyone,
Thank you for your responses.
Bradford lass and Star lady, i think you have grasped the problem rather well. These family relationships are very difficult. Negative emotions are entrenched due to the difficulties i faced at the time of marriage and house purchase. This is probably affecting my judgement.
It saddens me deeply that posters like Callistamon question the honesty of my post and call me controlling. If this was the case i would not be here seeking advice. Instead i would tell my husband our son is going to childcare. I know he will not like this but if i put my foot down he will have to accept it. But i am seeking advice on if 2 visits a week between 4.00-6.30pm is reasonable access? But some posters seem not to answer that but attack me instead.
The other common concern here is how can my terminally ill mil look after a baby. As i said, i have two very able and available sils at hand. And my fil is very fit and healthy too. So the actual care giving is not an issue.
Also saving money is not a concern here.
Earlier i also said my concern was what happens if my in laws do something which i dont agree with like feeding my son something i don't want him to eat or allowing him to watch too much tv or not giving him enough naps etc. This is what they do when i visit but i try not to say much as i dont want to be that fussy mum. I know they will not take kindly to my preferences and i will feel stifled and angry causing further dislike and resentment. Also this childcare “support” in laws provide will make them feel like they have ownership. I have seen many threads on here which show grandparents feel they are taken advantage of n are free childcare but never get to do the fun stuff etc. I would rather do the days out with in laws. So please try to understand my reasonings before labelling me as controlling.
Finally i dont know how long my mil has to live. I hope she has a long life and is able to watch her grandson grow. Perhaps as one poster said, she is desperate and needy and possibly this makes her behave unreasonably. Maybe none of us realise the desperation one feels when death is clutching at their throats. And maybe my issues are petty. Its so difficult.
Thank you again everyone. One thing for sure is whether i give in to mil i will not be happy and if i do what i want i will be consumed with guilt. I feel this summarises my entire marriage. Dh prob feels the same.

MaternityLeave Mon 05-Aug-19 08:52:13

Also one final thing i will attempt to address is dh. I know dh can put an end to all these issues by putting his foot down and saying no. He has done this a few times on other issues such as how we spend Christmas, birthdays, Christenings etc. Going on holidays, car purchases, lifestyle choices, our sons food choices etc. Mil can be quite opinionated and he has voiced our views and stood his ground. I understand his difficult position. This is why i did not leave when he bought the house. This is why i cannot be forceful with this issue because i can see he is torn and he too is hurting. I think posters here forget the complexities of emotions here.
I was once told that when MIL is no longer here this pressure i feel will also go. But now i realise this pressure will increase as fil will become vulnerable and will rely on his grandson for his happiness. Dh will feel even more guilt and sils will be fiercely protective of fil and so the issues continue.

BlueBelle Mon 05-Aug-19 08:57:29

Of course if a poster sees the problem through your eyes only they will be supportive other posters are trying to see it through all eyes and give you more real advice
I think because of your concerns real or imaginary you have no choice but to look after your son yourself not your mother in law, not your father in law, not your sister in laws, but you and the nursery, Money is not a problem you say, so that’s the best thing all round
Continue your visits and your limited ‘leaving with them’ one or two hours in an afternoon and hopefully this will all blow over and everyone will live happily ever after but you will need to talk to your husband because really he is the pin to all this he is the one who should have been making the situation clear to his mum and dad he is the one who has blurred the lines more than once (house first) now childcare
I will just say my friend who has had cancer now in remission does a lot of childcare with her husband two young boys 5 and a few months ...not everyone is (ill) ill with cancer and terminal can be anything from weeks to years it means not able to cure some people are very ill and have a dreadful time others are just living with it

MaternityLeave Mon 05-Aug-19 09:09:50

Yes bluebell. I agree with what you say. I am not sure how cancer and chemo and remission work. It seems to vary. I know mil feels exhausted a week after chemo. Then she is well and “normal” for 3 weeks until she does the chemo again and the cycle continues. She has chemo for 6 months. And is then fine until cancer grows. Also in general mil is a strong minded and hard working lady. She will not allow the cancer to take over her routine.
With childcare i have two non confrontational solutions.
First- dont go back to work.
Second- send son to nursery near my work. In laws cant pick him up. This means they cant have access to him between 4.00/6.30pm which is what i thought was reasonable but they will still have a couple of hours a week in the weekends.

notanan2 Mon 05-Aug-19 11:44:01

Also one final thing i will attempt to address is dh. I know dh can put an end to all these issues by putting his foot down and saying no

It is not about saying "no"

It is about saying "I will discuss it with MaternityLeave and then WE will get back to you" rather than deciding on your life choices and childs upbringing without you then "working" you into compliance!

MaternityLeave Mon 05-Aug-19 12:01:35

In an ideal world notanan. I wish! But that will only rile his family up further!

notanan2 Mon 05-Aug-19 12:21:21

But it doesnt matter how "riled" they are they are not your childs parents!

notanan2 Mon 05-Aug-19 12:22:32

If your DH acknowledging you as the childs parent "riles" them then your concerns about them having your child unsupervised are justified!

Summerlove Mon 05-Aug-19 12:52:25

Your baby will always be closer to you than aunts/ grandparents as long as you can be a good enpugh parent and shelve your dislike. Do not be jealous of the love they have for your child..be pleased! Kids will be confused by tension between the people they care about so tread carefully.
A good parent is a happy parent. A happy parent isn’t one who is being assaulted with guilt for having the audacity to actually want to make parenting decisions without interference from external family members.

OP does far more than most to ensure her child knows his extended family, but she shouldn’t have to give over child care to people she doesn’t trust. Would you really handover your child to someone that you do not trust if they were at a daycare? Just because somebody’s family doesn’t make them trustworthy. Op has stated they would ignore routines and safety by taking the child to unknown houses.

Kids do pick up on tensions, and In cases like these, they end up learning that MUM isn’t a safe decision maker and is a doormat to send them places she doesn’t want. They learn that inlaws are the ultimate authority for rules. Surely this isn’t what you’d advise?

As far as all the comments of “they raised your husband”, yes, they raised him into a man who bows down to mummy and family at the expense of his wife and child. Those are not admirable qualities.

Re chemo, it’s actually quite unsafe for both your child AND mil to be around each other while she’s having treatment

MissAdventure Mon 05-Aug-19 12:59:12

Unsafe?
My daughter lived with her two children up until the end.
Nobody ever suggested it was unsafe.

notanan2 Mon 05-Aug-19 13:02:54

I think the point, MissAdventure, is that the MILs condition is serious when it is being used to cut her out of the house move decision, then shes fine when it comes to cutting her out of decisions about her childs childcare!

MissAdventure Mon 05-Aug-19 13:06:25

Yes, it does sound as if she is swaying things to suit her own ends, I'm just correcting some misconceptions.

I'm sure maternityleave will be able to sort out arrangements to keep everyone happy (ish!)

I don't envy her trying to negotiate it all though!

Summerlove Mon 05-Aug-19 13:07:28

Were they small babies bringing home constant germs?

I was an adult without kids and didn’t work with children and I was still not allowed to visit my grandmother during chemo in case I brought germs.

Different chemos are unsafe for babies to be around as well.

I’m sorry about your daughter. We all have different experiences and rules given by medical professionals

MissAdventure Mon 05-Aug-19 13:10:31

No, they were school age children, no doubt fetching home even more.

Probably as many germs as the people at the hospital where we were at least twice a week, in waiting rooms, the cafe, etc.