for Expats in the EU who voted remain, to be relly upset and angry at neighbours and 'friends' who have voted to leave?

I’m not involved in the Brexit threads, but I think being angry about something you can do nothing to change is a waste of emotional energy. It would be better to focus that energy on working out the best way to deal with the hurdles life might be about to throw at you.

Oh I see, it’s about expats voting to leave. Oh well.

I’m afraid I don’t really care what expats do.

Shouldn’t have joined in.....

Eglantine, this thread is not about people in the UK - but expats- who have voted for this, and have to share their communities in the EU with those who did NOT, but are severaly affected by the vote- not for 4 years, but forever...

That people in the UK did not consider how those who have moved to the EU would be affected, is fair enough. But for those who live in expat communities - then it is not. And if they now complain about being affected - I'd say it is fair for them to be told 'told you so- don't you dare complain now'.

SueD - yes I get that- but it is much easier said than done - when you lose health cover when you most need it, when your pension goes down the shute, when you are not sure from day to day if you will be able to remain or be forced to go back, when the exchange rate is falling again, when you have to retake your driving licence- and fail - and are over 60 and chose to live in rural areas- the list is endless.

And when people close to you, who also chose to live in the EU, have actually voted for it - not for 4 years, but forever.

Much of this does not apply to us, thank goodness- so I am talking about 10s of 1000s of expats in the EU- and also friends in the UK who had been planning to make a move for many many years, and now see that this will no longer be possible.

??Eglantine exactly.

Hasn’t affected my friends either, jura2, if the system changes, so will we! One of the PQAs in my last job was ‘embracing change’ - keeps you on your mettle!

Seriously, I understand your point, but I personally don’t know of any brits living in my town in Spain who voted leave. I’d say 90% of them would have voted remain - it’ll be the Brits in Britain who wanted voted leave and they didn’t care about problems any Brits who’d left might face.

The ex pats still had a say in what happens here in the UK, so no doubt voted with what they thought best interests in mind.
Considering they live in EU countries, voting to leave was actually a noble gesture.
Don’t try for another divisive and angry thread jura2 we are leaving next week and need to start mending fences and get on with it.

I agree that those expats living in the EU who voted out and are now complaining about it will indeed have to suck it up. I’d certainly say to them that they’ve now got what they wished for, so they should quit moaning. Although as someone said earlier, maybe they feel they were lied to.

Anger is still a negative emotion, though, and it’s not going to make anything better. I don’t know much about expat life in the EU but maybe people of all shades will need to combine in order to cope with what’s to come. Or maybe the remainers and leavers will decamp to separate communities and each make their own way.

Paddyanne, the parliament in Westminster is the UK parliament, unlike the Scots, and the Welsh, the English do not have a parliament of their own.

jura if you're pissed off with "friends" and neighbours who's had the audacity to vote differently to you, please, feel free to tell them how you feel; I'm sure they'll be receptive to your opinions and lectures on how fool hardy they've been. Have a word with them and let us know how you get on.

I really can't get exercised about how someone living in another country voted and whether the results of that vote will shoot them in the foot. It's a shame that you'll all have to suffer the inconveniences but... meh.... here in Britain we've got our own problems to sort out post Brexit.

Actually Jura there are many more UK people here that didn’t vote (although could have) under the 15 year rule but didn’t know how or couldn’t be bothered to find out. THOSE are the ones I find annoying, whinging on about Brexit and didn’t even vote honestly sometimes you couldn’t write it!

Eglantine, this thread is not about people in the UK - but expats- who have voted for this, and have to share their communities in the EU with those who did NOT, but are severaly affected by the vote- not for 4 years, but forever

All I can say is that IF I lived in an EU country, and had voted LEAVE than I do not see why I should be surprised by the consequences. Why should I lose any sleep over their pension, their health insurance or the price of property in their chosen tax haven?

If anybody has thoughts to spare for post-Brexit Britain, that’s another matter.
With all due respect, Jura I really don’t think this dead horse deserves further flogging.

Not asking YOU to care, or anyone in the UK - but if people have chosen to go and live in the EU- I would expect them to care for themselves and for those who share that choice.

Did you not see the very recent documentary about expats in Spain who voted to leave, but are now bitterly complaining about the effects and the uncertainty? - which triggered this thread?

There is one hore that is still worth flogging - and that is we should leave WITH A DEAL - and yet many of us feel that we will end up with NO deal at the last minute, engineered by Johnson and the ERG from the very beginning. Leaving with a Deal will make a massive difference to both expats and UK residents.

"With all due respect, Jura I really don’t think this dead horse deserves further flogging."
I agree M0nica.
@ Jura - what will you and your husband personally lose after Jan. 31 2020?

If people decide to move permanently to another country then they need to follow the rules set down by that country- end of.

jura There is one hore that is still worth flogging - and that is we should leave WITH A DEAL - and yet many of us feel that we will end up with NO deal at the last minute, engineered by Johnson and the ERG from the very beginning. Leaving with a Deal will make a massive difference to both expats and UK residents.
This has obviously escaped your notice.
www.parliament.uk/business/news/2019/december/withdrawal-agreement-bill/

This thread is not about me or us - but about the 100s of 1000s of Brits in the EU.

We are in a very different position, as we are in Switzerland, which has a reciprocal agreement with UK unlike EU. Because we are both dual nationals. We personally will be affected in only two ways, loss of income if Sterling devalues even further- and loss of Healthcare outside UK and Switzerland. retirees in the EU will all lose their healthcare cover now covered by Form S1. We will retain it, fortunately due to said agreement. But we will be only covered in UK and Switzerland- and nowhere else. If I go shopping in France very close to us, or when we drive to UK, or visit Italy- we will no longer be covered as EHIC will be cancelled. And we can't take yearly Holiday Insurance, for two reasons a) age and pre-exisiting conditions including 'c' and b) because it does not exist in Switzerland as people are automatically covered by their Swiss Health Insurance. No solution found despite weeks of searching.

You asked, so I replied. But this thread is NOT about us - but UK expats in EU in general- both those who voted 'leave' who we could say 'deserve' what they now get- and those who did not, because they researched the consequences very carefully- and are now struck by the same consequences. I understand why this would seriously strain relationships in those communities - don't you?

And www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-51244126

jane- they will find any excuse to by-pass this- if they don't get the deal they think we deserve and will say they have no choice due to EU's 'intransigeance' ... at the very last minute.

Chestnut 'Just suck it up and learn to adapt to change. '

we will be able to- and this thread is NOT about us.

Can you tell me who an elderly couple, settled in the EU for many years- adapt to losing healthcare cover? I am sure they would love your bright ideas on the subject.

Would that theoretical elderly couple be able to take citizenship of the country in which they live, Jura?

Why are you yourselves not covered by the Swiss Health Insurance? I don’t quite understand that.

But what are you looking for in this thread jura? Sympathy? You've got it. But there's nothing that can be done about it now unless you think it might be worth contacting your MEP and raising your continuing worries with them. There's precious little that we, who are based in the UK, can do about the voting predilections of Brits living in another country is there? Or do you think there is?

Sorry to come on and disagree with you Jura, but for those of us who are legally here or arrive before the end of 2020 the Withdrawal Agreement guarantees our rights for the rest of our lives, no matter what happens in the final trade agreement. Our rights to residence, health cover and pension uprating are fixed and backed by the ECHR and ECJ.
As far as driving licences are concerned, only the old paper licences could possibly still be valid. The credit card sized ones ones have to be renewed after ten years and any kind of licence has to be changed after an offence.
I am furious about Brexit, about the damage to the economy, to freedom of movement, to the fact that our grandchildren will no longer enjoy the rights that we have had and the (imo) narrow, nationalistic world view of the leavers. I simply cannot believe that anyone can seek to dismantle the trading arrangements of the last 47 years without any coherent plan for what happens next. It is an act of economic self-harm that I find completely incomprehensible.
The one small comfort I have is that with the passing of the Withdrawal Agreement we have a legally fixed security in our country of residence.

Thanks for setting the record straight Mamie.
I completely agree with your penultimate paragraph

Can you tell me who (sic) an elderly couple, settled in the EU for many years- adapt to losing healthcare cover? I am sure they would love your bright ideas on the subject.

Why is it up to any UK resident to offer advice on "adapting" on anything post Brexit, to someone who has chosen to live outside the UK? I'm not sure why you think it's a problem for us to resolve. If you feel so strongly, refer them onto the "friends and neighbours" that you know voted Brexit and tell them to do the explaining.