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Do we still set higher standards for women?

(164 Posts)
trisher Tue 03-Mar-20 10:49:28

The recent news of the Boris baby has been widely commented on. One question I heard asked was "Can you imagine a woman with 6 children by different men and numerous sexual partners ever being elected to parliament, never mind becoming PM?" So do we still expect our women to be more moral and more virtuous whereas men can do what they choose? And isn't that just out of date?

GagaJo Tue 03-Mar-20 11:05:11

1) YES it's massively out of date.

2) Yes, we still do. Men, particularly wealthy white men, get away with murder (literally murder at times - compared to women who commit the same crimes).

NotSpaghetti Tue 03-Mar-20 11:08:25

No, I can’t imagine that woman becoming PM.

And yes, we always expect more of women.

And yes, this is out of date.

Greymar Tue 03-Mar-20 11:29:33

Yes, God help them if they gain weight.

Anniebach Tue 03-Mar-20 11:48:33

Yes, and still women who expect women to be more virtuous
and moral

GagaJo Tue 03-Mar-20 12:08:21

Ooooo yes Greymar! OK for a bloke to be fat, wrinkly and bald. BUT if it were a woman...

Chewbacca Tue 03-Mar-20 12:14:07

And we all know how critical some of the recent comments were about Theresa May and Tracy Brabbin's dress sense were don't we? BJ looks like he's been dragged through a hedge backwards but that's ok isn't it. Women in the public eye are criticised mercilessly. hmm

sodapop Tue 03-Mar-20 12:16:29

So true Chewbacca

Anniebach Tue 03-Mar-20 12:19:21

Diane Abbott defended John Bercow when he was accused of
bullying but called for Priti Patel to resign following allegations of bullying. This is not political.

Davida1968 Tue 03-Mar-20 12:21:58

Yes, I'm sorry to say that we do set higher standards for women. I agree fully with Anniebach.

GrannyGravy13 Tue 03-Mar-20 12:30:07

I am sorry to say that women are far more critical of other women than they are of men.

Agree Anniebach John Bercow did not receive anywhere near the abuse that Priti Patel has.

If a man is strong and forceful he is in control of the situation

If a woman is strong and forceful she is frequently called a bully, bitchy or a stroppy madam

lovebeigecardigans1955 Tue 03-Mar-20 12:33:50

Yes, I think we women are still expected to be better than men - as though we are moral guardians of all and sundry. When I was at school (blimey - 50 years ago) a teacher said that it was up to women to put the brakes on. Does our 'bad behavior' give men the green light to do as they please because we're not setting an example? Is that right? Or just the way it is?

Greymar Tue 03-Mar-20 12:34:43

It's not OK for Sarah Lancashire to change her dress size apparently.

Witzend Tue 03-Mar-20 12:58:47

Who was it who said, ‘Whatever a woman does, she has to do it twice as well as a man, to be thought half as good. Luckily this is not difficult.’
(or words to that effect)

Grandad1943 Tue 03-Mar-20 13:29:51

The Equality Act 2010 enshrined under legislation that in the workplace both genders have to be treated in all matters equally. Under that Act, it is for women, both individually and in whole gender action to ensure that what is set out in that legislation is brought forward to the full for the benefit of women.

Sadly the above is often not carried out in Britains workplaces and in that women very often do not progress in career terms as high as their male counterparts.

However, how progress can be achieved was demonstrated only too well by a young woman in our office who joined us in an administration role but soon expressed a wish to be trained to join the operational side of the business. However, she became pregnant but while on maturity leave studied to gain IOSH Qualifications that have allowed her to be attached to the Assignment teams on returning to work, and in that gain a far higher salary, status, and interesting employment

To gain further training that would enable her to progress to the highest levels in an Industrial Safety career she will have to demonstrate that she is willing to travel extensively in the course of her employment. That is obviously difficult for a young women with a family, but hopefully, that will be brought about with the cooperation of her partner.

There is nothing we as her employer can do to assist her in that decision, as it is an area where both genders in their domestic lives have to decide what is paramount.

I state the above as feel it demonstrates there are, even in these times, large obstacles that prevent the progress of women in employment and the wider world. However, the opportunities are equally available, especially in employment, for women to progress in equality with the male counterparts, but it is wider social issues that often prevent women obtaining their highest personal attainment.

That situation in the main can only be sorted out by women.

vampirequeen Tue 03-Mar-20 13:30:19

There are still double standards. I met my first husband when I was 14 and didn't escape until I was 47. A year or so later I embarked on my Jezebel period. I met lots of men (including my DH) , formed some brilliant friendships and had a wonderful time. Only a few knew about it at the time because I would have been viewed as being a less than virtuous woman grin whereas a man would have been throwing off the shackles of a stagnant and suffocating marriage.

Hithere Tue 03-Mar-20 13:35:13

Totally. Women still have to throw through hoops to prove we are as capable as men

SueDonim Tue 03-Mar-20 13:37:54

Yep, women are expected to have higher standards and yes, it’s outdated.

Remember, too, the slurs against Theresa May because she isnt* a mother, when it came to the leadership race.

Women can’t do right for doing wrong.

Hithere Tue 03-Mar-20 13:41:52

If the woman is pregnant and looking for a job, 90% she won't be hired.

If her partner is looking for a job while she is pregnant, it doesn't need to be mentioned and won't impact his job situation whatsoever.

Talk about double standard

Chewbacca Tue 03-Mar-20 13:46:17

That's right SueDonim, Theresa May was criticised for having no children and therefore must have been incapable of empathy towards families but Nicola Horlick was criticised for having 6 children whilst working as a high flying financier and so her maternal responsibilities were questioned. No one has questioned whether JRM, who also has 6 children, is failing in his paternal responsibilities whilst he's an MP. Double standards indeed.

eazybee Tue 03-Mar-20 13:46:35

I can't imagine any woman with six children wanting to become Prime Minister, but actually, Helena Morrissey has nine children and until recently was head of Legal and General investments; Ursula von der leyen is President of the European Commission; if they wanted to I am sure they would.

Firecracker123 Tue 03-Mar-20 13:49:30

GagaJo why do you always bring colour (wealthy white men) into nearly every post.

vampirequeen Tue 03-Mar-20 14:20:47

I'd suggest GagaJo says it because wealthy white men rule the world.

SueDonim Tue 03-Mar-20 14:24:02

Eazybee Sarah Palin had a punt at being vice-president (with the possibility of being president) of America with five children. Some women do want to do these things. smile

yggdrasil Tue 03-Mar-20 16:24:30

Priti Patel has driven two of her staff to attempt suicide, and made the Head of the Civil Service Home Office resign through her arrogant and unfeeling actions.

John Bercow was never accused of anything as evil as that.