Noisy neighbor - that's me!

I feel it for you, people are just loving complaining snout neighbours. My neighbors get away with so much as they are clever and I can’t get proof. I hear noise from her daughter running upstairs but don’t complain. People seem to be more unreasonable these days. I’m suffering with my health because of it. Hope things improve for you, we need to see our grandchildren

grannypiper

We are talking about 3 hours a day, during lockdown, whilst this child’s nursery is shut!

Absolutely not the same as living there and noise 24/7. Her GS might just get really excited about seeing his Granny.

The family are supporting each other and I’m sorry to sound so harsh but downstairs neighbour must know the routine by now and will just have to tolerate it ! This little chap will be back at nursery soon enough.

To the person who stated this child would have to sit still at nursery, have you visited a nursery recently ? 3 year olds are not expected to sit still for 3 hours

If you live in a flat you have to accept you will hear noise from your immediate neighbours, you are all in the same boat and as you say we are living in very different times at the moment. I think your neighbour is perhaps very set in their ways and perhaps a little bit intolerant... hopefully the children will be back at school soon and dryer weather will allow you to be outside when they visit... we all have to vacuum and put the washing machine on and as long as you are doing it at a reasonable time, ie during the day.... she can’t really complain.

This is regarding the “sewing machine noise” in particular. I wonder if your neighbour is suffering from tinnitus; this varies from person to person but the main manifestation is hearing noises/sounds not caused by any external action or phenomenon. In my case I hear a whooshing or wind-like noise. Since I know what it is I’m not bothered by it, just mildly annoyed.

I look after a 3 year old grandson two days a week while his mum is at work so appreciate how lively children of this age can be. I have found taking him for a walk/run around the park in the morning means he will then settle to play with quieter toys - would your daughter be able to do this on the way to you at least some days? Also good advice to invest in a few books/toys - maybe ask on local social media sites if anyone is passing anything on. Charity shops are still closed and people near us looking for different ways to recycle.

Sadly this is problem living in a Flat these days. The way they are built they are not sound proof enough. I once lived in a flat and was in the middle flat where I had a noisy neighbour above me and one below me. Until then I would not know how bad noise can get to you...but it does. You cannot relax in your home nor rest properly. Some people can be really inconsiderate of the noise they make. Thankfully, I got out in the end and would never live in a flat again.

Could you ask her what time she naps, and maybe organise the GCs’ visits to avoid that time? As long as it’s reasonable, of course. I can’t function without an afternoon nap, but never for longer than an hour.

We had a similar noise problem living in our first semi detached house. Our first neighbours were lovely but the next family who moved in were the neighbours from hell!! The wife was lovely but the husband waited until evenings to start his d.i.y. with knocking and banging with no concern that we had a young baby. In the garden he was always SHOUTING!! the cildrens' names, purposely kicking balls into our garden and coming in without asking. Worse was to come - when coming downstairs on a weekend morning to find him peering through our windows, then bringing his poorly puppy into our garden to do it's business. I nearly had a nervous breakdown and vowed never to live in an attached dwelling again - I would rather live in a tent somewhere!! One reason I dread having to down size!!

Meeting outside is fine now that the weather's improving. I walk with my daughter

Bully for you Hetty. Perhaps you missed where sluttygran said she was unable to get out due to mobility issues? She has her daughter to visit daily, in accordance with the covid bubble regulations; no laws have been broken. She's perfectly at liberty to have her grandchildren to visit as often and for as long as she likes within covid rules.
I think you're trying to hide your jealousy and anger behind a faux outrage of alleged covid regulations breaches.

I once lived in a downstairs maisonette and my neighbours upstairs consisted of a divorced mother and three quarrlsome teenage children. There was also the mother’s boyfriend at weekends and they would have the most stupendous rows with doors slamming and running up and down the communal concrete stairs, then him revving the engine if his sports car before driving off in a temper, usually at about 2am.
I started to play my Led Zeppelin records to drown them out and the boyfriend came down and complained,!
I was young then so just put up with it, but wouldn’t do so now.

I think you should write her an apologetic letter - saying how sorry you are that she is disturbed by the noise - don't say more than that - no suggestion that the noise is excessive. Then explain all that you have said on here, as to why you daughter has to come to you and how she is also your carer. And also what you do to try and keep the noise down.
Keep a copy.
It might also be helpful to contact the Citizens Advice Bureau to talk to them about the problem and a see if they have any helpful suggestions.
I have every sympathy with you, but do also feel sorry for your neighbour. I know from experience that some sounds that aren't excessive can become an obsession. A neighbour used to leave her car engine running for about 5 minutes before getting in it and going to work. It wasn't that loud, but the noise and thought of the pollution set my teeth on edge every day.

I can understand both sides of the argument, you posted such a heartfelt argument, it's hard not to sympathise with your position. I think I'd write a word for word note to your neighbour, just what you've written here and accompany that with say flowers, chocolates or some sort of peace offering, Possibly reiterate the fact that right now the weather has been awful, but come an improvement with dryer and warmer conditions you will hopefully be out and and about more. I hope you find a resolution.

If your neighbour has complained about a sewing machine running a lot maybe I could shed some light on this.

I had upstairs neighbours who seemed to be running an industrial type sewing machine. It turned out to be computer or console games of car racing etc. It went on into the nights here and was very annoying,

There was a frequent little girl visitor aged about 3 or 4. The child would run around and it did sound much louder than the adults walking around.

If your DD and DGC are away from your house by 6 or 7 in the evenings that is well before any deadlines for silence. I think the suggestion for slippers all round and carpets is good. Hard floors are awful noisy and are not permitted in many flatted houses for good reason

Your neighbour could have tinnitus or maybe some other hearing problem. Can't solve the problem of a 3yr old, been there x2! I don't the police would do anything in the circumstances. I would just carry on, your family need you in these difficult times.

My late husband was very noise sensitive wherever we lived. He drove me mad with his complaining to me about the neighbours gadgets, mowers, strummers, dogs and music. The smallest noise would get him going as he was over-sensitive by then. I bought him noise cancelling headphones for when he was reading and told him to ‘get a life’ as learning to live with noise is part of living.

Yes I think compromise is called for
If you live in a flat and lots of elderly do
Then you may get her to meet the children
I find the children of people your friends with don’t seem as noisy

sluttygran

Thanks for all your suggestions - I think I will try the 'love-bombing' idea, as I can't do much about the other problems.
I already have thick rugs down, and the children wear slipper-socks indoors.
My daughter can't really limit her visits as she is my carer, too, and though I support her a great deal emotionally, she also looks after physical stuff that I can no longer manage.
DGS's nursery school was closed because of Coronavirus amongst the staff, and we couldn't send him to different one as he is epileptic and has his own key-workers who are au fait with his management
He'll be returning to nursery 3 days weekly from next week, so that will help, and of course improving weather will enable more trips outside.
I rarely visit my daughter's home, as I can't manage the stairs to her bathroom. I struggle with getting upstairs to my flat, but I only have to do that once a day if I venture out.
I think that the pandemic has been the major cause of everyone's distress - it magnifies little problems which might not have bothered us at other times, but it can't last forever.
I can't help feeling that my neighbour is a little unkind - she rarely has a good word for anyone. Whether it's her nature, or an infirmity I don't know, but I don't want to cause hostility.
I have decided to offer flowers and cake, and to explain that I will do my best to avoid disturbing her, but shall firmly point out that I have a right to enjoy my family's company in my own home.
I hope that this will bring about a peaceful resolution!

Sounds an absolutely excellent plan to me. So long as you really do firmly point out that you have a right to enjoy your family's company in your own home. Good luck! xx

We've been in a very similar situation. The sound engineers downstairs liked total quiet after work and objected to almost anything we did. We couldnt even walk across the floors without complaints via the house whatsApp Group. This was before the lockdown as well. We agree to soundproof, took up floors lagged underneath, dealt with potentially noisy floorboards, put down special acoustic flooring. They did contribute a small amount financially but it took months and huge disrupntion to our lives and free time. We even agreed to re-route our waste water as they could hear it moving through the pipes. Before we did this, we sat in their flat and listened while our son ran around shouting and to be honest it wasn't particularly noisy, no more so than we got from the flat upstairs. Nevertheless we went on trying to help because their ceilings, they said, were already too low to put in sound proofing themselves. However - BIG MISTAKE as they NEVER stopped complaining. Regardless of what we did they found another source of irritation in a different area of the flat, the slightest noise anywhere still triggered complaints. They moved eventually. My advice is to look at reasonable measures to mitigate, as you have done with rugs, slipper socks, no late noise etc etc but don't go overboard as it may well be 'their' issue not yours. These neighbours of mine eventually mentioned it had happened to them before, a family with a small child who kept running around on the floor and they said they complained until the family moved out. Must have been awful for that poor family! These complaints, if founded on a serious issue like banging floorboards, loud DIY and music after 11pm, may be something the council will take an interest in, but basic normal noise of family living is not a real noise issue. Tell them to put in suspended ceilings with sound-bars if it's an issue (assuming it's their own property), don't exacerbate things obviously but please don't go and make your life miserable by creeping around and having no guests or normal life. Why live in a flat if you are that sensitive to noise? I imagine, like us, you feel very uncomfortable upsetting people. I wish I'd never tried to help these complainers, it messed with my life for a couple of years.

harrigran

One of the joys of living in a flat.
My sister had a woman living above her who had the GS visit evry day, I swear he wore hob nailed boots and some of the time he must have played on a pogo stick. The noise was dreadful, apparently she didn't realise you are not supposed to have hard floor surfaces in flats. Our flat had a clause in the leasehold saying all areas must be carpeted, failure to comply would result in eviction.

Yes, that's true of many flats, but the OP did say that she had soft flooring and that they wore slippers. But as someone elese suggested perhaps your neighbour would let you go and listen when your GS is running around? That way you can judge whether she is being unreasonable or not.

sluttygran forget taking her gifts, flowers, cards or letters and certainly don't apologise to her; just carry on living your normal life. By all means try to be considerate; keep any noise as low as is reasonably possible; encourage your grandchildren not to shriek or scream when indoors. If she continues to complain, turn the tables and tell her that she's harrassing you and she must leave you alone or you will call the police. You have a right to live your life within the accepted societal norms. Other than that, carry on having your daughter and grandchildren as frequently as COVID bubble regulations allow and advise and pay no attention to the jealous ones who just want what you have.

Did your neighbour move in before or after you? Were there any previous problems with complaints? I’d just politely say that the child isn’t unduly noisy and it is just part of everyday life. When I was a child in the 50s we had a strange old lady for a neighbour who used to bang on the wall and shout abuse. On one occasion she reported to the police that we were making bombs for the IRA!

sluttygran - the first thing you should do even though it may seem a bind is to keep a daily record of your 'noise output' to include the times when you have your vacuum cleaner and washing machine on, and when your grandchildren are there. If you have a smart phone you should also record for odd 15 minute periods the noise levels the room where your grandchildren play.
The second thing is to ensure you have taken all reasonable steps to muffle the sound for your downstairs neighbour, and from you you say you've done this with carpets and slippers.
You should then speak with your neighbour or her daughter and let her know that you have this evidence and are happy for any authority to see/listen to it and if it emerges that you are producing noise above the regulated number of decibels you will seek advice from an acoustics engineer to try to reduce it to within recommended levels.
The onus is then on your neighbour to produce evidence (from her recordings) of your excess noise and the key here is that 'excess' relates to what is acceptable according to the statue. You say your neighbour is 'sensitive' and you tip toe around so as not to disturb her. This might be the issue, she has become so used to you treating her with kid gloves that she notices 'normal' sound levels. Additionally, the story of a sewing machine shows that she is becoming fixated with her own thoughts and imagination.
If by the way, your 3-year old is hurling bricks on an uncarpeted floor he needs to be told this isn't acceptable but I doubt that's the case. Good luck with it.

I have just read your OP again sluttygran. I can hear my upstairs neighbour hoovering and can hear their washing machine on full spin but because I know what they are and the noise will be of limited time I ignore it.
Hearing such things in an apartment is to be expected.
I still think it’s worth explaining why your family are round every day. I would have sympathy with your problems as would many others I think. Perhaps you neighbour thinks you don’t care or are doing it deliberately. Misunderstandings happen so easily. Maybe if you talk to each other you can explain your situation and she can tell you why she’s so upset. Perhaps you can reach some mutual ground.

The love bombing idea sounds good, but after that just ignore any complaints. Not much more you can do about sound transmission through the floor and walls, and we all have to live our lives.
Your neighbour sounds like she has become fixated on the perceived noise, and is listening out for it.
My mum lived in a flat and could hear her friend snoring upstairs, but she also heard the crash when she fell in the night, and was able to get help.
The new tenant put down laminate flooring and worked night shift. Hoovering and washing machine during night.
But mum didn't complain and just adapted to the situation by getting ear plugs.
Your neighbour could just be a sour old sort that is envious of your close family.

Your home is your home. You are giving your daughter support which she needs and she is supporting you as your carer.

You have done all you can to make things less noisy. Make sure that you only run your machines after 9 and before 8 pm and then let things run their course.

Maybe the land lord could do something when he is reviewing maintenance but sadly I think there is little that can be done. As someone said your neighbour could put some music on or watch TV or read quietly in her bedroom etc.