Should we be accepting these behaviours?

Wyllow3

"So do you think the parents are complaining because they have moved within an expensive catchment area? so he shouldn't be there?"

Quite believable, Jane

Oh, for goodness' sake.

So are you saying parents in more deprived areas wouldn't be concerned about their children's safety?

Unbelievable.

Of course not! Thats really offensive.

Just that some people are better at knowing how to kick up an effective fuss - like bring in the press?

Callistemon21 that is unbelievable.

Men have always loitered* by schools, even when I was at school. They normally blend in but that one doesn't and it's something to be grateful for that he alerted everyone to his presence just by being himself.

Some more dangerous types would just blend in, criminally, like Jimmy Saville. Indeed, anyone who was a true danger would most likely not be dressed (badly) as a school girl. Care in the Community is bad for everyone- bad for the patients who aren't getting the care and stimuli they need and bad for those who they cause distress to.

Wyllow3

*Of course not!* Thats really offensive.

Just that some people are better at knowing how to kick up an effective fuss - like bring in the press?

You obviously do not know our local newspaper.

They have no need for help, they could give the FBI etc. a lesson

Wyllow3

"So do you think the parents are complaining because they have moved within an expensive catchment area? so he shouldn't be there?"

Quite believable, Jane

It's what you said.

Or did you word it badly?

I assumed JaneJudge meant that in an "expensive catchment area" generally people like to keep it just like that and sometimes are good at keeping it so by who they know.

I find in less expensive areas people are more tolerant of difference, less able, people struggling, actually.

In both areas it would be best to in the short term ask him to move away from school, and try and get help for him.

Dickens

JaneJudge

it isn't just adults with mental health problems though being shipped out, look at children's homes and LD communities. It all needs to be looked at imo because modern societies and communities should include everyone

I actually find it really sad and have done for some time

It's basically a strand of 'social-cleansing' isn't it?

It creates an even more unequal and divided society.

Yes it does.

Wyllow3

I assumed JaneJudge meant that in an "expensive catchment area" generally people like to keep it just like that and sometimes are good at keeping it so by who they know.

I find in less expensive areas people are more tolerant of difference, less able, people struggling, actually.

In both areas it would be best to in the short term ask him to move away from school, and try and get help for him.

I wanted to open up discussion as I think there are a mixture of elements going on in general rhetoric, that reported by the press, local facebook etc. but a lot of things are to do with austerity and lack of funding and vulnerable people 'causing problems' and from my own lived experience people who also have lived experience of problems are less judgemental about them, whatever those problems are

I'm not meaning to upset anyone

Only just seen this thread and agree with Germanshepherdsmum. Though if it is true that the man has been taking photos of children on the bus that should of course be stopped.

No doubt by now the parents are ensuring that a couple of them are also on the bus, the school has arranged for a member of staff to be visibly on hand at the end of the afternoon and the children have been advised in assembly to ignore this man and on no account approach him.

The man's right to privacy rightly preclude details of his mental health and care being made public.

Well, if anything this should make schools more careful. Whatever happened to the Head Teacher being outside at home time???

They were lucky this time because he was not subtle and not able to blend in despite probably trying his best. Somebody dangerous would be able to blend in. It may be a lesson to us all to be more watchful and aware of the people who hang around schools, who may look much more normal, but be much more dangerous.

Police force are not fit for purpose a great deal of the time. There is much talk from them on a number of matters. When it comes to real action they are found wanting. After all the furore about women’s safety they are still largely uninterested in anything but the latest ‘woke’ agenda. This is another example. If we had a party in power like the Tories who historically were tough on crime, we might have some action. Oh wait….!

Just this ….. any person hanging around school gates who does not have children in that school poses a risk, sadly, statistically males are more likely to be a risk. The police need a big wake up call and honestly the world's gawn mad !!

Healthy happy children will be street wise to nut cases of all sorts, giggle, and move on to more interesting sights and sounds.

Caleo - have you worked with people/children whe weren’t ‘street wise’ enough to giggle and move on

I am not claiming children don't need to be protected. I claim they need to be well informed without frightening them.

What if it was Grayson Perry?

How does this person dress when elsewhere and why dress as a girl in school uniform and what has triggered the behaviour. There has to be a mental health issue. The police are probably correct in saying not a criminal offence and I would suggest probably know of the person and hopefully any relevant social services do too. If there are any approaches to a child, no matter how innocently intended, well, that's a differemt case.

Caleo

Healthy happy children will be street wise to nut cases of all sorts, giggle, and move on to more interesting sights and sounds.

That is a huge assumption that all children from 3 upwards (this was a nursery school too) are happy, healthy and streetwise.
Should they giggle? Some might, nervously, but others might pity him, yet others might be frightened especially if he was on the bus with them.

Onward and Upward wrote "They were lucky this time because he was not subtle and not able to blend in despite probably trying his best. Somebody dangerous would be able to blend in. It may be a lesson to us all to be more watchful and aware of the people who hang around schools, who may look much more normal, but be much more dangerous."

This is the real and ever present danger. It's good for a child or an adult to be tough minded, but criminals are often devious and that is a danger to all concerned.

I remember a few years ago an old chap used to dress as a cowboy, Native American, Andy Pandy etc and stand opposite a primary school at closing time. He only ever waved to the children and quite a few parents would stop and chat with him.
We assumed he was just a lonely harmless old man and he never did anyone any harm. I don’t live nearby now so don’t know if he’s still around. I felt sorry for him.

Kalu

Not a problem with him dressing up but the bottom line is, this is not normal behaviour. It would have been termed, hanging around with menace when I and DDs were at school. Men like this were hounded and reported to the police who took these matters seriously.

Combining all the freedoms men are being allowed under a banner, are we just to sit and wait until the usual mantra, ‘lessons have been learned’ once proof arrives this is a backward step in safeguarding females/children? Also, what message does this send out to other males who fancy the thrill of blatantly watching innocent schoolchildren?

I agree with you 100% on this.
Lessons never seem to be learned though. The police and others are repetitive in their lack of learning.

There was a well known tramp when I was a child. I heard my mother telling my much older brother that the tramp had been giving peppermints to me and other children. I heard my brother reassuring my mother " K-- J------'s all right".
Brother was right as a matter of fact, but my mother had the right attitude.

The real point here is not whether we are being brain-washed to accept wrong behaviour.

The point is that people are refusing to believe the police when they say this man constitues no danger. By which, I presume they mean that he has no criminal record and that nothing he said when interviewed made them feel he was "loitering with intent to commit a felony".

Presumably, they pointed out to him that hanging around the gates of a school, especially dressed in an approximation of a school uniform is a stupid thing to do, and will lead people to assume he is a pervert.

I really do not know what you expect the police can do in this case, or the school for that matter. Anyone may stand on a public pavement, dressed as they please, as long as their dress is not an offence against public decency.

Another point is that if people are circulating photos of this person and stating or hinting that he is a danger to children, or anyone else for that matter, they themselves are probably breaking one or two laws.

I am uncertain what English law states about circulating information and photos on the Internet . Here in Denmark you would assuredly be fined for defamation of character is you warned people against a person you could not prove was guilty of a crime.

The real point here is not whether we are being brain-washed to accept wrong behaviour.

Who determines what is wrong behaviour? If it is one of the elderly, this is likely to be judged as completely wrong behaviour. If it was a younger person without children, probably not so likely.

What has this man actually done wrong? He's worn clothes designated as a school uniform. That is not a criminal offence. He has stood outside a school. Once again that isn't a criminal offence. The fact that the police have deemed he is not a risk suggests that he has no criminal record for hurting children otherwise the police would have definitely acted to stop him. at the moment, I suspect they will be being rather more cautious than usual.

At Primary School most children are picked up by parents and carers so they would know their children are safe.

As a parent, I wouldn't particularly like it but I would certainly be remonstrating with my child for finding it funny, I would be explaining that there was nothing to be scared about but as usual, stay away from strangers. It is our responsibility to keep our children safe, note any vulnerabilities and act accordingly. It is not up to parents to take the law into their own hands or infringe on other's human rights because you don't like the way they look.
If this person's behaviours have escalated by taking photos of children, then I would expect the police to further investigate.