Ex son in law

Thank you everyone for your advice and thoughts. I agree my daughter was at fault booking a flight that although in her time involved the children missing two hours on the last day thinking that would be ok as he hadn’t initially objected. They have been apart for three years and now divorced and prior to this he came on the annual May half term week holiday and was more than happy for the children to miss a few days school to accommodate a cheaper flight. However now he has become extremely bitter and marriage broke due to his narcissistic personality. It is a difficult situation and going fwd she must never do anything outside the Court Order which is very specific on lots of things due to his personality!! She constantly tries to work with him for the sake of the children but it is his way or no way. It will be costly to change the flight and he knows this hoping she won’t be able to go. The childrens feelings never matter to him which is so sad. It is only two hours…. CO specifies that either parent does not need permission to go on holiday abroad for less than four weeks. She always gives him a detailed itinerary before booking but he is very secretive about what he is doing with them. This is just him controlling his rights as a father being difficult as it is his right!!! I will update on the outcome

If the court order says both parents must give permission for any time out of school does this cover trips off site, hospital appointments.? This causes extra work in school because some parents insist on being sent copies of every permission slip, separately, and then delay signing or write sarcastic letters demanding explanations as the educational value of the activities.
Your daughter needs to comply with the Court order to the letter, but keep an accurate account of every incidence of his disruptive behaviour, then seek to get the Order modified because of the disruption it is causing to the children, her and family life.
Also:
but this is two hours on an end-of-term Friday. I don't know how much has changed since I was at school but on that last day, no 'real' work was done after lunch.

Please. Not again.
School days are closely timetabled, and normal routines are not suspended just because it is half-term.

I hope you can sort it out.
The main thing is to be able to enjoy the holiday, without any of this hanging over you all.
Good luck!

eazybee

Please. Not again.
School days are closely timetabled, and normal routines are not suspended just because it is half-term.

I apologise for being irritating.

We also stuck to the normal timetable - but we didn't do any work that was 'demandingly academic' for want of a better way of putting it. That's what I was getting at.

It was a boarding-school in the middle of the countryside and there were pupils who had long journeys ahead of them - the local train station had timetables which meant that those pupils had to leave before the end of the day, and they were always given permission because the lessons were tailored to take account of it being the last day of term. Homework had been set already in advance of the last day.

I realise however that it might be completely different now.

The point isn't what the children would be missing - The point is that the mum has handed ammunition to dad.

Suck up the mistake and don't fall into the trap (as that is what it probably was) again!

I’m not disagreeing with you NotSpaghetti - but what a way to have to view this. Mum ‘handed ammunition to dad’. Only a totally unreasonable parent would do what this man did. He could have said to mum, don’t do this again or I’ll object. No he writes to school setting out the legal position, putting school in a very difficult position.
Best of luck to mum and children

Exactly - I totally agree Iam64 - I suppose (like you) I'm aware what lengths too many people (like him) do to keep on controlling...

Only a totally unreasonable parent would do what this man did - yes, totally agree. But once we know we are dealing with a totally unreasonable parent we can't behave as though they are an ordinary person.

I suppose I just feel that these people are so completely unreasonable that you need to be super careful all the time - and yes, it's exhausting and frustrating but if you know you are "perfect" according to your agreement (and keep a record of when they are not) you eventually will be in a safer, happier and more manageable place.

I too wish mum and children well.

Iam64

I’m not disagreeing with you NotSpaghetti - but what a way to have to view this. Mum ‘handed ammunition to dad’. Only a totally unreasonable parent would do what this man did. He could have said to mum, don’t do this again or I’ll object. No he writes to school setting out the legal position, putting school in a very difficult position.
Best of luck to mum and children

No he writes to school setting out the legal position, putting school in a very difficult position.

Quite.

Schools really don't need this to deal with do they... with all the other pressures they are under.

I agree Iam he has given his permission for the children to be taken out of the country for a holiday and almost at the last minute has deliberately thrown a spanner in the works to prevent that holiday from taking place.

A spiteful and unpleasant individual who appears to have no care for his own children.

I hope the holiday goes ahead as planned GrannyIvy. It would be good if you could let us know.

Thank you for the apology, Dickens.
My penultimate year of teaching the Friday afternoon class was Art; my final year it was French, with assistance from a French mother who helped unpaid.

Thanks for getting back to us GrannyIvy.

They have been apart for three years and now divorced and prior to this he came on the annual May half term week holiday and was more than happy for the children to miss a few days school to accommodate a cheaper flight

That gives a fairly clear indication that this is an act of spite.

I hope the holiday works out for the children, mum and you.

I think posters on here will heave a sigh of relief if we hear from you at the airport - or on the actual holiday! Good luck!

Just chiming to say I’m sure your right op he’s doing it just to be difficult but that doesn’t change the facts. Your daughter would be doing herself a huge disservice to violate the court order even when it’s clear he’s just being spiteful.

She still believes in him and tries to work with him but has to accept how he is which she finds hard. I keep well away from him never see him and never badmouth to the children as he is their Dad. The 10 year old gets frustrated with him though and said to me yesterday why is my daddy so difficult? It is hard. The headteacher at the school is supportive to my daughter as she has experienced problems with him. I will let everyone know the outcome. He will torment my daughter over the next week and probably then allow her to take the children as planned. He plays a game. He made difficulties last year for different reasons. Life isn’t easy and I’m sure many others in this situation. Going fwd tho she must keep in CO guidelines accept no negotiation is possible with him unless he benefits. Very sad.

I have a friend who was in the same situation. Even though she and her ex have both re married he continues to be a total bastard, but at least she's got wise to his nasty little games now, so they don't have the same affect.

His behaviour still affects their children though, despite her best efforts.

The 10 year old gets frustrated with him though and said to me yesterday why is my daddy so difficult? It is hard.

Children understand more than some parents think.
We had friends years ago who went through a very acrimonious divorce and the father was very difficult. The older two children refused to see him eventually and when he came to pick them up they refused to go.

Just to update. My ex SiL has decided my daughter can remove the children from school two hours early on Friday to catch their flight but she has had to pander to his emotional blackmail all week where she has had to allow him extra time with the children in her time. It is a game for him to exert his rights and be in control of all situations. It is sad he has to take to give anything. Going forward leopards don’t change their spots!! We are on holiday now and looking forward to them joining us on Friday. Thank you to all for your comments and advice.

Very glad everything has worked out for you. Enjoy the holiday!

Yes, a goid outcome- even if very frustrating!

She is well off out of this relationship.
Have a truly lovely break!

Thanks for the update GrannyIvy, enjoy your holiday

I'd phone up the school in the morning and say they're not well

ferry23, the school are aware of the background. The father emailed the head teacher setting out his objection to the children leaving early. The school know about the court order. Lies to school would be a bad idea in these circumstances

I understand this scenario Granny Ivy we lived with this spiteful behaviour from and ex son in law for years and you’re right to say “leopards don’t change their spots!

It’s exhausting though trying not give them ammunition as we found that everything, absolutely everything was ammunition to that type of personality. Revenge and spite is top of their list the children are the ones who in my option suffer the most.

I wish you and your family well.

Children do understand far more than you think, but it is tough for them to see their father behaving this way. If your daughter can avoid criticizing her ex-husband in the hearing of the children in any way, that helps.
My ex-husband was not vindictive in the way this man is, he was just increasingly indifferent, but I avoided criticism as much as possible and was pleased when as adults, both children said, we are grateful you never tried to make us take sides, and they saw him for what he was was. They both have very pleasant in-laws they value far more than their father, whom they rarely see now; his loss.
I hope all goes well for your holiday.

That's great news GrannyIvy .

A hard lesson for your D but I hope she's learned from it and that she'll be as pedantic with the 'rules' about the children with him, as he is with her.

Enjoy your holiday.

GrannyIvy

Just to update. My ex SiL has decided my daughter can remove the children from school two hours early on Friday to catch their flight but she has had to pander to his emotional blackmail all week where she has had to allow him extra time with the children in her time. It is a game for him to exert his rights and be in control of all situations. It is sad he has to take to give anything. Going forward leopards don’t change their spots!! We are on holiday now and looking forward to them joining us on Friday. Thank you to all for your comments and advice.

Have a lovely holiday and remind your daughter that 2 can play at that game.