Unmanagable behaviour in 3 yrs old grandson

If the area your daughter lives in still has Children's Centres, they may be able to help. They usually run courses that look at different strategies for behaviour management in children under 5 which may be useful. As a start it may be helpful to ask what strategies the preschool/nursery are using and see if a bit of consistency with them helps.

Children these days have a very busy life being dragged from one activity to another, there days are full of shopping and car journeys, they never get a chance to be still, also they never get a chance to run and use up their energy. how long does the poor soul spend in the car each day?

GD used to have epic tantrums when she was tiny, I believed it was because she got frustrated when she could not make herself understood. Naughtiness now seems to start when she gets hungry and seems to relate to low blood sugar. Her sibling does not have the same problem as she is a good eater and always asks for food when hungry. Have noticed that both go hyper when they have been to parties and had brightly coloured cake and sweets.
DS had some issues after eating certain foods so in the 70s I cut out sweets and drinks with added colouring, it was time consuming but I believe it worked.
I am all for ignoring attention seeking at the dinner table, a child not talked at usually gets on and eats something, if you reward bad behaviour by giving attention you will perpetuate it.

I agree with swanny - - I experienced the same with my grandson from 2 years onwards - full on bouncing off the walls and no concentration on anything for more than a nano second. He also had no empathyfor others and would go off at tangents both physically and mentally. He was finally, after a few long and exhausting years, assessed and found to be on the extreme of the autism scale - has now had help as have the family in how to cope with him and he is happily in mainstream school and progressing well. His sister had none of these problems so ' bad parenting' is NOT the cause.

Have a grandson who had this problem. I think it's about attention seeking behaviour and the more extreme the behaviour the greater the attention. Maybe problem lies with Mum and Dad who give in just for the sake of peace and quiet. Happily, grandson is much better, he is 16 now, but this type of behaviour continued until as recently as two yeas ago.

Florence123 thanks for the details, it sounds very wearing for all of you. Can I suggest a few things? (And apologies if you have already tried them). You say 'we' when you were dealing with his behaviour at table, could one person take responsibility for the discipline and the rest of you try to get on with your meal ignoring him completely? Not easy I know but at the moment your DGS is probably getting a feeling of power because he is the centre of attention. One small person being able to disrupt everyone's meal isn't good. Have you tried a rewards system instead of punishment? DGD -very strong willed responded well to stars which were collected and earned a special treat when she had so many. The sleep thing I can't help with- tried all sorts with mine, but a rota giving mum the occasional sleep in might help her.
I do think sometimes asking for good behaviour for short periods and giving a reward does help. Sometimes children get themselves in a cycle of rebellion and bad behaviour from which they are unable to escape. Just giving a small target and a small reward can help them through it. Good luck I really hope you find a solution.

Florence Can I suggest you get his mum to take him to the gp (go with her if she wants) and ask about an assessment for autism? The poor lad's behaviour is similar to that of my grandson, who was diagnosed at 3.5 years with being on the autism spectrum. His sleep pattern is also similar.

Of course it may not be the cause but a referral to a pediatrician would help. Good luck and try to keep calm at all times - easier said than done I know

Well thank you all for your words of wisdom. I am new to Gransnet and am amazed at the response to my cry for help.
I should explain a little more about the behaviour of my GS who is a delightful little boy at times. He is very bright and was counting to 20 when he was just two. He is very strong willed to the point of calling everyones's bluff what ever happens. He goes to nursery and enjoys his time there, however his key worker sees him as very determined to get his own way and has to stay with him at time out. He is a very bad sleeper and can be up 2 or 3 times a night and is up at 5.30 every morning. Consequently his mother is exhausted most of the time - she is not an inept parent foxie and I would describe my GS's behaviour as very unmanageable at the times of his meltdown. Yesterday, he behaved badly at the dinner table, picking up food with his fingers, jumping up and down on the chairs, throwing himself at his mother and more. We tried everything we could to make him sit even for a few minutes to eat his food but he refused so after 3 warnings we put his food in the garden room next to the kitchen, this is when he started to scream arch his back run around the garden just being a pain. This went on for about half an hour so we left him to work it out of himself which didn't work. Eventually his mother put him in the car and drove him round for 20 minutes hoping he would fall asleep, he didn't but came back more subdued after screaming for the whole 20 mins.
this may be a stage he's going through and we may not be perfect parents or grandparents but we are all feeling pretty helpless to know what to do. I have had three children and have never experienced this and my daughter is so exhausted I worry she is heading for a breakdown.

ChristineFrance mentioned the GP - perhaps not in terms of his behaviour but checking for any physical causes: children with hearing or sight loss can experience a great deal of frustration trying to make sense of the world around them. Rather a long shot, but worth considering - although I agree with all the other posts re: food additives and inconsistent parenting are more likely to be the cause.

I agree with those who say Check the food: sugar, preservatives all affect us, and especially children. My granddaughters both have the attention span of gnats and I (silently) blame the television, which they have on all the time (grrrrr).

My dgd has had behaviour issues, sometimes to the point of tears (mine!!!). The thing I find most useful is positive reinforcement. Make a HUGE deal of behaviour you want to see, more praise than feels comfortable to give! Behaviour chart (smilie face or stars, whatever works) is a great incentive. Pick just one challenging behaviour at a time to work on & when that's mastered move on to next thing. I also found 10 mins one to one child led play helpful. You're letting the child know you're fully listening & give undivided attention. This help reaffirm the attachment. Good luck ?

My GS was awful at that age giving my DD and I lots of worry about whether his behaviour was within the normal spectrum or not. However, when he went to nursery school he settled there but was a little monster (said affectionately) at home for his Mum. He was manageable for me but I felt that was because he was more sure of her than me. Now he is into his second year at school and they don't appear to have any worries about him. He is better at home but he gets his older sister into trouble all the time. I take a no nonsense, firm but loving approach and, so far, touch wood, it is working.
I suspect your GS is just doing what 3 years old do and if the older child was manageable, it is a shock to the system.

I've not experienced it myself but my young neighbour has same problem with her 3 yr old boy. The screaming sessions are awful all because she tells him no, or sit down and eat your dinner or put your shoes on. The sessions exculate into him hitting or biting her or throwing things across the room. The other day whilst she was unlocking the door he started kicking it really hard that it left foot prints. His father tells him off but nothing seems to bother him. He's at full time nursery they did have issues with him biting but he's much better behaved there now, but not at home. Parents try there best with his behaviour but nothing seems to change.

Like others, I have also noticed that both my grand children's behaviour becomes much more disruptive when they are hungry - and I agree that too much processed food, fizzy drink and sweets certainly don't help.

I also agree with radicalgran about the pressures put on our children from an early age.

I don't think it it is very nice to suggest that parents who face behavioural difficulties with their children are "lazy" or "inept". I expect we have all made mistakes.

Oh and avoid Fruit shoot drinks they have our lot climbing the wall.

I feel sorry for post modern children, subjected as they are to assaults from food, environmental chemicals, lack of free play opportunities and constantly bombarded by media of one sort or another.

I think melt downs are normal. Kids are over stimulated a lot now, tired because of it, unable to be healthily bored.

I would be reluctant to seek any sort of guidance unless he is exceptionally wicked, it will stay on his record forever and he will be at the whim of professionals with far too much time on their hands and money to make.

Tire him out if you can games, sports, long walks let him find himself in a world beset by non stop stimulation of the wrong kind.

There is no such thing as 'unmanageable behavior' in a young child only inept parenting who have forgotten or won't use that little word NO. Children need walls which gives then guidelines and confidence to know what is acceptable and what is not. If the parent are to lazy or misguided to establish walls at a very early age then they let problems escalate to the point where they become 'unmanageable' Grandparent can and often do provide an important role and they to have the knowledge and wisdom when to say NO and when to give that big loving hug.

Florence as you don't go into any detail here is what I try to do.
Most 2/3 yr olds test the boundaries. I find that a bored, hungry or tired child are always more difficult to handle.
Keeping them busy as they love to be involved and have items around which I change regularly to encourage independent play.
Regular meals, plenty of drinks and healthy snacks.

I agree with Faye regarding food. Small children can be affected by preservatives in a very marked way.

Sweets and squashes today don't just contain sugar, they have all sorts of chemicals in them. I have seen a my GD turn into a lunatic in less than 5 minutes after a treat, so now the family avoid things like that where possible.

My youngest DGS was monstrous at 3 - naughty, defiant and rude. The naughty step was a joke to him. At 8, he can still be a bit stubborn and 'opinionated' but in all that time, he has never been in trouble at nursery or school where he turns into the model child and has great respect for rules. An enigma!

The food issue is interesting I remember my DS had a friend when he was little whose diet was strictly restricted, if you asked him to tea you had to check with mum about what he was allowed to eat. Mum said when he ate certain things he 'climbed the walls'. Needless to say I didn't test this and stuck to the restrictions.

Can you give an example of the extreme behaviour, Flo?
Does the behaviour cause concern in all situations? If he only "misbehaves" at home then it could be a parenting issue.

My DGS was appalling at 3. Running away in public places and having mega melt-downs - 2 year old tantrums that started a bit late. There was a not of saying "no" going on and he was saying "no" back to everyone. What a surprised.
Small children have tantrums to try to get control. They are testing the limits and trying to manipulate the behaviour of those around them. The are testing the boundaries. I have seen him kick off because his mother was going somewhere with his sister and leaving him with his evil grandmother. The minute the car was out of site it was a big smile and "what shall we do now Nana?"

Bravely and very well said, eloethan.

Last year all of my six GC were visiting at the same time. One of them mentioned how naughty youngest GD then 3 was, (she was carrying on at the time). My answer was "yes, you were like that at that age and look how lovely you have all turned out. They smiled and agreed. ??????

Florence check what your GC is eating, my eldest GC's behaviour was affected by preservatives. She is also becomes the angriest child if she is over hungry, give her something to eat and she instantly changes back to her normal self. She really has grown into the kindest eleven year old. I have to admit I did wonder when she was two and three years old what she would turn out like. My GC who was easy and very sweet at three now at seven/eight can be quite destructive. He has gotten into lots of trouble because he deliberately breaks things.