Advice needed re-MIL

Dear Polly,

So sad everyone is assuming because you say your MIL is a difficult and unpleasant person this is the case. I hope when you need care there will be someone there for you.

My poor SIL and DD could have been in that position with his unpleasant cantankerous mother when her husband , who had been her carer , had to go into hospital himself for a heart op. They managed to get her into a care home, but as soon as her husband was somewhat better she insisted he had her home again. Incidentally he is 88 with a dodgy heart and the way she speaks to and about him is terrible. My SIL and DD have assured him that he will have their full support if he puts her in a home but at present he is strugling .

That's good to hear pollyparrot

An alert button is a good idea.

Thanks to everyone for such supportive posts. Just to repeat, she did not come home last night. We've visited her today and she was fairly sharp with DH. He went off to get some water for her and she started complaining about him to me. I just said to her that he was trying his best and was looking after her needs really well. I pointed out to her that if she wasn't nice to him he wouldn't want to help. That gave her something to think about!

Anyway, the wheels are in motion. Occupational therapists are involved, the Red Cross are to provide home aids, carers are being sorted and the district nurses are to visit daily. Two commodes have been ordered for her, although luckily she lives in a bungalow, so access to the toilet and her bedroom aren't too much of a problem.

DH has today fitted a key safe to the outside of her house, so that everyone can get access. I've spoken to her about having an alert button to wear in case of emergencies and she's thinking about it.

Thanks again everyone.

Sorry to have got involved in this thread a bit late. I won't go into the very painful details, but my advice is that if the hospital does not supply a 'safe discharge plan', tell them they CANNOT legally send the person home. Then go straight to PALS (Patient Advice and Liaison Service) and report to them. They will take it up for you immediately. They have an office in most hospitals and you can Google the one in your area. I didn't do it the first time, and it was disastrous for him and me. The second time, I only had to mention PALS and their ridiculous and woeful arrangements for a dying man were magically withdrawn. He died 17 days later in a much more suitable environment for end-of-life care

You need contact social services a sap, find out if she has a social worker. She may have tol occupational therapist and social services a pack of lies. Be very assertive, quietly tell them you and hubby are unable to care for her for health reasons, and don't go into details, just keep saying this ( broken record technique). Ask them what she has told them then give them a full picture, and say she must have carers in several times a day. Good luck

My mother was in hospital, had broken her hip and was in early stages of dementia. She told hospital social worker that she could be discharged as I was giving up my job as a teacher to look after her.They believed her without even checking that this was true. I had three teenage children one of whom had to carry an epi-pen due to life threatening allergies, I also had lung disease and rheumatoid arthritis. I refused to give her house keys to hospital until a meeting was held. You should have seen their faces when I turned up with splints on both hands and explained that I was struggling with health issues of my own. I asked how they expected me to lift and change her. They found her a place in a geriatric unit, where the care was exceptional, until a suitable nursing home could be found.

I hope your DH sticks to his guns Polly. Even if your MIL hadn't been the spiteful person you say she was, you have a right to a decent life especially after having cancer and looking after the elderly is difficult enough even when they have been lovely people. Even my saintly MIL lost a bit of her veneer as she got older and my own Mum, who sounds a bit like your MIL, gets worse as she gets older. At least if you have a care package in place you can get a bit of space when MIL gets too much. It doesn't sound as if you want to completely abandon her but you should only do what you want to do otherwise resentment will quickly set in. Good luck x

How awful for a family to have this problem when they dont care for the person in hospital. I can imagine the guilt you must be feeling and the strain it is putting you under. Lets hope the outcome is the right one for all concerned.

I would have loved the chance to look after my dear old mum but sadly it wasn't to be. I truly loved her with all my heart and i knew her biggest fear was being put into a home. Thankfully that never happened she passed away in hospital after being there for 6 days. It will be 7years this November and i miss her every single day she was my best friend as well as my mum. Thankfully i have a wonderful sister and we talk about mum all the time and have lots of shared memories of her to comfort us.

I once worked as a Red Cross nurse. We used to visit the local Old Folks Home to bathe the men and women in there. I remember one old man who used to talk to me about his wife and how he used to brush her golden hair for her. He was very angry with his DIL who he blamed for them being in the Home. His wife had died and he said he would never forgive DIL for putting her in the Home. So sad. I had to change the subject or he would have had me in tears as well. Another old boy who could hardly walk used to wink at me all the time...it was so funny. I made the mistake of asking him if he 'felt ok' to which he answered 'I would feel a lot better if I could get a hold of that lovely bum'! I was shocked but I could not help laughing. I said 'You would have to catch me first!' He was a bit put out when I handed him the flannel to wash his bits....he thought I was going to do that for him! The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak' as they say. One old lady hated being bathed by strangers so she was in and out of that bath as quickly as she could. We used to hold up a towel so that she had a bit of privacy, but we could see how embarrassed she was, she used to go all red and blotchy down her neck. They do not want to be in the Home, they are there because they are frail. I must say I enjoyed the time I spent looking after them. Of course it is harder to look after them when you are getting on yourself.

Jaycee5 is right when she says people can be the author of their own misfortune. My mother is a nightmare, vindictive,vitriolic and nasty,im her only child and she's never shown affection,she just throws money at at a problem instead. There is no way on earth I'd take her in she could spend her money on care for herself. I only visit her once a fortnight and that's just a duty call.My children and grandchildren will have nothing to do with her.She has missed out on having a caring loving family all because she has to be right all the time,never apologises and blames everyone else but herself for anything that goes wrong with her life. Most of her friends have deserted her as they too are sick of her controlling ways.So I completely understand pollyparrot. I just hope she dies in her sleep one day so we don't have the drama of her being ill as she's so demanding.? Well I feel much better getting that off my chest!!!!!

A care plan should be in place before discharge, and there should be notice given before discharge, for different services to be in place before she comes home, if things work as they should do your MIL will get all the care, and be given things she needs to have a good life at home, without you having to be "on call" Good luck, and enjoy your own life.

This happened to my mother when her husband who was a very large man was out of hospital and she was expected to be his nurse although she was elderly and frail herself. His children didn't visit. Eventually he agreed to go into a nursing home. She would take him home for a visit every so often although he was a very difficult man and hard for her to manage physically. Once he was at the home one of his daughters started to turn up every few months and when he died in his late 90s his children persuaded everyone that they had been doting children and my mother a grasping widow (even though she had paid for everything when they were alive despite him being very wealthy).

I think you have to contact the hospital and be very clear with them that you are not well enough to look after her or even to collect her from hospital. They will probably try to guilt you but tell them the hospital social worker will have to deal with it because you are simply unable to. It will take a bit of toughness and you will probably feel bad but so will taking on more than you will cope with and it is not fair on either you or your husband (who she won't stop bullying once you get her home).

People are sometimes the author of their own misfortune. I would not take my father in similar circumstances. He could not be nice to be when I was child so it's too late now. Luckily he is abroad and in supported accommodation.

I have no relatives in this country and that is a minor problem!

It seems to me that the care system is broken and no Government has the will to fix it. The relatives are left struggling to pick up the pieces.

My sister is a care worker. She tells me she knows of cases where the elderly person has been discharged from hospital with no care package in place, and has been dumped on their own doorstep to fend for themselves.

I am fairly appalled at the lengths hospitals will go to in order to get rid of elderly and infirm people who are unable to care for themselves.

Gone are the days it seems, when hospitals were places of care and concern for people's welfare.

You have a bit of breathing space now polly
There's been lots of good advice on here by those of us who have been through this.
My advice is to think ahead. When she comes home she may need things like a stairlift, a downstairs toilet etc.
Get a notebook and write and date absolutely everything, every phone call, the conversation with the ward sister and so on. You may be asked to provide dates for financial purposes. The agencies dealing with your mil will contact you frequently, be prepared about how much involvement you want and stick to it. Does your OH have power of attorney? The whole situation is a minefield, new problems arrive and take you by surprise every day. This really could affect your lives in a big way. I'm sorry to say all this, it's difficult enough even when you're fit and well and want to do it. All my best wishes.

Just wanted to point out that there are Old Folks Homes and Nursing Homes. There is a big difference. In a Nursing Home the frail person is looked after by nurses! In an Old Folks Home they are not, they have their own room with their own things around them.

My Aunt, who we all loved because she gave so much love herself, had to go in to a nursing home because she had dementia and was confused in old age. One day she walked out got on a bus and was found in the city centre and handed over to the police. It was no-one's fault. Someone had held the door open for her because she was such a nice old lady they did not realise that she was ill and thought they were being kind.

In the end she became quite stroppy if anyone touched her things. That is the hardest thing, their personality changes and you no longer recognise the person they were, and the same goes for them. You just become a person, not someone they used to love. It is very hard for everyone.

Hospital should not let her out without support in place speak to them. A care package can easily put in place and they can get someone in to assist.
Hospital Social worker can sort out any other issues.

My mil was a nasty lady , she had 5 lovely children and in laws and a lot of grandchildren , she would try and make trouble between all her children , I carnt count the times she said ' don't come to my house again ' she ended up in a nursing home after being discharged from hospital because nobody could cope with her . She missed so much , had such a lovely family and grandchildren she hardly new . It was always poor old her . You have my sympathy , make sure you think of yourselves first. My mum was a lovely lady , wouldn't upset or hurt anyone and was loved by all her children grandchildren and great grandchildren

I don't know if they have one where you live but in Staffordshire there is a scheme where an old or disabled person can have their own place with bathroom, sitting room and bedroom, with their own bits and pieces, but it is warden controlled and meals are provided either by the warden or meals on wheels. When visitors arrive to see the old/disabled person they first must book in at the wardens window. He/she will 'phone through to the old/disabled person to see if he is 'at home' for visitors or not. It works for a relative of mine, it might work for you. Look around and see if there is anything like that around where you are. Any medicines they need are given by the warden or a district nurse who calls regularly to make sure the patient is coping. Your role would then be to visit when you can, take things she needs like toothpaste or night dresses etc and generally be around if needed. If you want to go on holiday just give the warden prior warning that you will be away on certain dates.

As others have said she should be assessed for living on her own and some sort of support care put in place. Is a short term care home place a possibility until you sort out a long term solution?

Difficult though it is, your DH is his mums next of kin so sorting this out will be down to him. We got carers set up to go in a few times a day to my MIL as we were still working and my SD went into a brilliant care home on temporary basis until he was well enough to come home after hospital stay. Is either of these possible. If she owns her own house then maybe residential care is a possibility but obviously it will need to be sold to pay for it.

I echo what others are saying. Once you collect her you are lumbered! Not a nice word but it is a huge burden to take on when there is little love involved. Hospitals so often jump at the chance to offload bed blocking patients with no support involved. I was phoned at 8 in the evening to collect an aunt by marriage who I would help out with the garden and invite for Christmas Day because I was sorry for her being left alone in sad circumstances. She had called an ambulance and when I visited her in hospital next day said she was afraid to be at home. She asked me to look after her money and keys. Her son rarely visited and had moved 5 hours away.
I refused to collect her, not least because I had no bed for her and had enough problems at home already.
At 10pm they phoned me again to ask me to meet an ambulance at her house some 20 minutes away to see her in! Cold house, no food, 90 year old aunt on oxygen with no care package in place. I could hardly believe it and I refused point blank. In the morning I spoke to the hospital social worker who apologised and said the ward sister had been desperate for the bed and I fear that old aunt was too timid to object.
I twice had my mother to stay following hospital admissions. She had never made any secret of her feelings about me, her "only child who gave me problems" and it was torture as I was constantly told that she would be better off with any of my siblings, while the fact that I live 70 miles from her home made setting up a care package for her an arduous business with long car trips.
It's different if there is love there or if you are of a saintly disposition but very hard if not.

Oops [anya ] didn't see this post. Good no discharge today.

Step back (Pollyparrot) and think what's best for your MiL, you and your husband. How did your MiL walk before she went into hospital or has her mobility deteriorated while in hospital. If she's unable to walk now how will she get about her home? Now that your DH has gone to collect her he'll be expected to manage her mobility and all else. Best to phone the emergency Social worker on duty (today) and explain all. In my experience your DH should not have collected his mum before safer measures were in place. It happens though. Meanwhile you may have to pay for several visits by a carer (believe you me it'll be worth it) until the local authority has provided an assessment of needs which really should have been done before your DH agreed to pick her up. Please do not get sucked into all your MiL needs otherwise you too will become unfit - leave the nastiness out of things and look after yourself.