Adoption

A very good, and honest post muffinthemoo. Thank you.

Muffin, I’ve now had time to read your post And thank you for it. You speak from experience and from
The heart. I support all you have said

You can not base your view of adoptions solely on one case. There are a variety of reasons while a child may be available for adoption and several have been described here. It's not easy to find information - this is the best I could come up with quickly. It suggests most adoptions are not contested but describes how some parents fell pressurised into agreeing to adoption. citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.898.5052&rep=rep1&type=pdf

We are one of a very small number of countries allowing contested adoptions.

Adopted children given a good upbringing will know that their parents are likely to have had problems. If there has been letterbox contact then the parents will have some idea if those problems have persisted or not. If the parents have been over-protective and the child has no idea of the type of problems some people face then they may be shocked. It is up to the parents to raise resilient children, not to wrap them in cotton wool.

I can understand a refusal to send recent identifying photos, especially in a forced adoption. Photos could be taken of the child's back taking part in non-identifying activities, although I appreciate some people might be too worried of making mistakes. Refusing the biological parent the comfort of a letter would be cruel.

And denying a child the comfort of the security it needs in order to thrive is cruel.

Your strong feelings are understandable maddyone and I am not criticising your feelings. The adoptive parents and their child/ren aren't the only people facing challenges. Some parents give consent to adoption as a result of lengthy discussions with the sw/children's guardian involved. They may see it as something they can do to demonstrate their love for their child and their desire for the child to have a happy, secure, safe and loving family to grow up in.

I mentioned older brothers and sisters in an earlier post. I appreciate the difficulties around any form of contact but we shouldn't forget the feelings of hopelessness, anger, sadness and loss children feel when contact with their siblings is ended. Many adoptions involve older children, aged 4 and older. Many of those very young children have had their primary care needs met by an older brother or sister.

Adoption is complex. We're one of few countries that have state approved adoption with little or no contact post placement. In other countries, more open adoptions seem to work. The rate of adoption breakdowns in the UK is sadly fairly high and increases with the age of the child on placement. That's one of the reasons historically, children over about age 4 - 6 weren't considered for adoption and remained in long term foster care. Apologies, I'll stop now.

And whose needs are we worried about here, the parent or the child?

Sorry maddyone, is that a question for me. We have to support adoptive placements, that has to be priority if the cycle of neglect, abuse and deprivation has any hope of being broken. If that means no contact of any form with the family of origin, so be it.
That doesn't mean we can't recognise the needs of the birth family. Too little support was historically given to adoptive families. It's improved but it's still difficult for adoptive parents to easily access skilled support. The fact that birth parents have lost their children as a result of their own actions doesn't mean they aren't grieving. Older siblings who have loved and cared for their younger brothers and sisters in very difficult circumstances often recognise (with help) that those little ones need a new family. They always ask how they'll know their loved little one is ok. Surely we ought to try and find a way of reassuring them as time goes by.

Iam64, our grandchild has NO memory of any older siblings. None! How can that child suffer from not seeing a sibling that there is NO memory of. As I stated before, our grandchild was removed by Social Services due to extreme neglect. The sibling may suffer, but that is not the concern of the adoptive parents. They MUST put the needs of their child first. I’m sorry this upsets your notion of correct adoptive behaviour, but I ask, are you a Child Psychologist? If not, you do not know how our or why our grandchild reacted the way it did. To repeat, our grandchild was disturbed by annual visits to a person that was totally unknown despite the parents efforts to explain what/ why this was happening. If you are/were a social worker, you are merely repeating the acceptable dogma of the day. In the past adoptions were closed, that was thought to damaging to SOME adopted people, so policy was changed. However, as usual it’s the one size fits all approach. One size NEVER fits all! For older children who remember parents and siblings it’s obvious that continued contact is desirable. For babies and very young children it’s a different scenario though. My AC has made a responsible decision based on the response of our grandchild to these visits, which were causing a lack of stability in our grandchild’s life. The child became insecure, clinging to parents, unwilling to let parents out of sight, behaviour deteriorated, tears were more frequent, and a lot more. Why do I need to explain this to you,when it’s clear that you are unwilling to accept the legal right of adoptive parents to make a decision in their child’s best interests? And how can you say what is in my grandchild’s best interests. A poster up thread said that I was having to justify the decision taken by my AC and that is true. I’m not engaging any further, I know the child involved and you don’t, feel free to keep on wearing your one size fits all blinkers.

Maybe we shouldn't argue on line maddyone. I didn't believe I was arguing. I've repeatedly said that the needs of the adoptive child and their parents must come first. I have acknowledge that infants and babies with no memory of older siblings have different needs than those who having strong living memories of older siblings.
I am not wearing one size fits all blinkers and I do not believe my comments reflect that.
I don't believe you have to explain to me the need toaccept the legal right of adoptive parents. I know that. I have at no stage said your grandchild and his parents should be forced into any form of contact they do not believe to be in their child's best interest. I've always said the need of the adoptive child and family must be protected and supported.
Thats it, over and out.

Oh for an edit button. I hadn't realised we were 'arguing' maddyone, I thought we were discussing a complex and emotional subject.

maddyone Iam64 has been most courteous, and not at all confrontational, in her response to your OP and to your further comments. I don't believe she has said or implied that "one size fits all".

Sorry not OP but posts.

maddyone your post could be interpreted as a little disingenuous to Iam64 but I do not think this should be seen as a personal criticism of a fellow poster. I think (as an adoptee and a professional with years of Safeguarding experience) that it illustrates to us just what an emotional and devastating process this can be (for some) and a joy to others. Professionals and families do not always get things right. Legislation changes over time and retrospective and current research moves goalposts frequently. As with any other form of social engineering there are winners and losers.

This whole thread has been difficult and moving for me, as I am sure it has for others too. I re-read every post earlier and leave in an unsettled frame of mind as I post this.

I don’t think the OP is correct that the child will not have to write or phone, but will be given the opportunity to do so if they wish, they may well be encouraged to ( There in lays another debate) they certainly are not forced to.

SorryThat should read :have to , not not have to

My BiL is adopted and so are his 2 siblings but all from different parents. They all grew up being told they were adopted and that adoptive parents could not have biological children but had each adoptive child from a few months old. Each child was given a pack when 18 that contained everything that came with child that adoptive parents had been saving for them. Two of them wanted to find their biological parents when 18. The eldest met up with her biological Mum and found out she did not want to keep in contact with her but she did ask if she had received a good childhood and loved her adoptive parents and that was all she wanted to know. Some years later when she was pregnant she tried again to contact her biological mother but got a call from person from adoption agency asking her not to call her BM again. The second daughter wrote to adoption agency when she was 18 and there was a letter waiting for her there from her BM asking her please not to try to contact her as she had married with other children and she did not want her family to know she had illegitimate child at 16. She had given her away to give her a good start in life. My BiL was given his pack including name of adoption agency when he was 18 and he threw it in open fire and told his adoptive Mum, his adoptive Dad was dead by this time, he had a Mum and did not need another one and no other Dad could replace his own Dad who had died so he did not even want to try to find them. He has been happy and settled as an adult. His view is your Mum is the person who brings you up and loves you and who you trust. The second daughter got severe depression after what she sees as a second rejection from her BM. The oldest daughter has still not come to terms with her BM not wanting to keep in touch. My BiL's view he has told his sisters is Mum and your siblings still love you and always will so why worry about strangers all you share with them is a bit of DNA.

What a sensible man newnanny All credit to him and his"real" Mum.He has all he needs and wants.