Loving relationship with married adult DS?

The old saying goes:

If you have a daughter you have a daughter for life,
If you have son it’s only until your son takes a wife.

Words worth remembering sometimes.

So are you saying that I should not have any grudges or ill feelings towards her because she is innocent in all this and can be excused as the blame completely falls on DH?

Im Genuinely curious

No, she is absolutely making her own choices. 100%.

You would just feel less impact if he stood up to her.

Bridgeit I hate that expression. So Misogynistic. Always blaming women for stealing sons and hurting mothers

Building a good relationship is built like a wall Yummy, i.e from both sides. It has to have good foundations; both of you willing to work on it and both of you actually wanting it to be a good relationship. If one of you is carrying a grudge; suspicious that the other one isn't doing enough or not pulling their weight, it will fail.

The person you should speak to is you OH and then your MIL. If they're not willing to work and make this relationship improve, you're on a hiding to nothing. You need to have that conversation.

Yes good that it is an old saying , but for some people there may be an element of truth.
I posted it as an example.

I have two sons one lives not too far from me and messages me regularly, keeps telling I am welcome at his house anytime. When I say he has a young family and doesn’t need me getting in the way he told me that everything he is he owes to me so his home is my home too. My elder son lives a three hour drive away but sends me messages and clips of his son to keep up to date with my grandson’s progress.

I don’t see either of them as much as I would like but I work full time and am very aware that by the time I get to them after work it is coming up to bath and bedtime and I don’t want to get them excited. My younger son who lives quite near me wants me to move closer to him which is lovely. I am very lucky.

Even as an example though...it’s setting a potential daughter in law up to fail.
It’s pitting two women against each other: of course there will be tension if of person (mil in this case) views it as a dil stealing her son.
Or conversely, a DIL getting annoyed a MIL won’t just fade to the back ground like she’s supposed to.

See how badly it sets people up?

Thanks everyone there’s is a special kind of reassurance when validated by someone from motherly/MIL position,

Because I always wonder whether “I will only know when my son grows up and gets married ”. But truth is I know how much I love my son and I feel that statement is making me carry the blame for something I had no contribution in and blaming me for lacking empathy and being selfish.

I guess mothers of adult sons is the closest I have to someone who can empathize if I am remotely misunderstanding MILs behavior.

I just feel like I actually have more empathy than is to my benefit and I blame that to be the reason why I got severely mistreated. Because I always excused it as “it’s a phase until she learns to trust me that I’m not one of those girls that take her son away”. I was always defending myself as the good girl whenever she mistreated me because I felt that deep down she is just a mother who loves her son and needs time to figure it out as I’m the first serious commitment he had.

But I think there is a limit to human decency towards others and I felt the level she reached due to feeling desperately unable to cut the strings was quite malicious. I have never assumed she had that side to her.. maybe she had reasons why she was suspicious of me and didn’t trust me.. because I suddenly reduced my level of contact after discovering she had sent a message slandering me to DH. Maybe she thought if I was a good daughter in law I would’ve been able to see past that. The excuse I was given by her daughter was that she was upset at her son for not listening to her and going on a trip somewhere she didn’t like so as a way to humiliate him she decided to slander his wife ?!!. But I’m a human being I’m not a little tool in between to make points. The fact I’m expected to move past it is even more insulting to me.. no apology ever received and apparently she tried making it up to DH because it was between her and him.

Apparently when she makes digs at me it’s excusable because she is just frustrated at her son and wants him to try harder.. and that - in my husbands words- since I’m the nicer person who won’t make drama out of things, it’s easier to take things out on me.. again no appology, apparently her being a mother is the ultimate excuse.

I never got rude back. I just retreated into my own safe shell where I can’t be used as a way to score points at DH. But for that I got many sticks and ended up almost losing my marriage because I’m a bad daughter in law who is breaking up the family. I received tremendous abuse simply because I wouldn’t excuse rudeness. DH didn’t stick up for me after he got abused too.. but what he did is he understood that I’m my own person and can decide what works for me and I have no obligation to accept or excuse disrespect. And I told him until he figures out his mother and how to overcome their issue I won’t be the distraction in the middle.

I cannot comprehend it or understand it and it frightens me to have someone in my personal space who is that unstable and is ready to harm others just to make themselves feel better. I have no doubt that she knew that I did nothing to instigate this. But she also thought that I did not value my self respect and so she took advantage. She was right, I didn’t. But then I suffered a mental breakdown and when I got pregnant I realized I too am now a mother and need to decide what’s best for my family.. and that I cannot remain passive.

I mean I somehow hope that when DH figures out how to set up some boundaries that maybe I will be able to process what happened in a less threatened way.. and perhaps find my empathy.

Sometimes I wish it was salvageable but I want to be fair on myself too.

If MIL sees me as a tool to abuse her own son, because I’m the nice one and I’m not allowed to ever be upset about it... then I don’t know how can I trust to have someone like that in my personal space.

Sorry for the moan.

I’m not trying to sound like a victim. I’m just trying to understand whether there is hope. I don’t understand how something like that could be a “mistake” that needs forgiving. It’s more like an attitude that needs changing but I’m not sure I believe people change attitudes like that. Do they??

She is trying to prove to her son that she is better.. but what about me? I’m not collateral damage. I’m separate. She can have a good relationship with him but she can’t expect me to pretend nothing happened..

I just resent the fact she sees me as excusable collateral damage.. and as if I don’t have my own identity. And that my DH should be a man and “force” me to have the relationship with her that she pleases or give me an ultimatum.

To her I’m an object not a human. Even though I have been rather compassionate with her for years..

I also don’t like the saying and I dot think it applies in my case.

Might apply in some cases but it’s jit always the default.

I’m sure MIL knew I was keen to be part of their family and had no interest in stealing anyone

So we called MIL trying to make her feel involved. Showed her some clothes form my hospital bag. My DH with me on video call so she can see her grandchild too.

She didn’t want to tell us when she was coming but thankfully turned out she is coming 2 weeks after I deliver ( I gave her the wrong dates because she was wanting to “surprise us”). She is coming for a full month.

She asked my DH to take holiday leave before she comes so she can take over the baby care when here. I told DH I will compromise and let him take his holiday leave when she is here so he can spend time with her. She didn’t seem interested in that as she wanted him out of the way so she can find her way to baby sit and I really am not ready for that.

But I stayed polite and didn’t say anything.

But most importantly the conversation started with her asking me wat I will call the baby. When I said what I want to name the baby.. she told me I had bad taste, it was superficial, over used name and I’m copying everyone else. I tried politely explain why we like the name and she was adamant I’m superficial and have bad taste.

Then she goes saying how our choice of name for my son was bad as well.. and how she can’t believe we picked his name.

Thing is I remained very polite and gave her reasons and then changed the topic.

But I’m all honestly I think it doesn’t get to me because I’m able to keep my distance and not have her impose her views on me..

But seeing how she is adamant to force me to be close to her, I will have to deal with things like that and assert some boundaries.. I don’t know how to do anything other than being polite.

DH was also just saying how it’s a good name and we like it. But she defiantly believes in humiliating someone until they do things her way. I really don’t know how to handle things like that.

I'd just be saying to her, "MIL, this IS the baby's name. You can use it, or baby will be referring to you as Grandma Who We Don't See."

As far as baby-sitting, you need to be very clear with her that she won't be doing that. Again, just tell her that you don't need a sitter. She can't force help that you don't want.

Well, Yummysushi, it sound like you have a MIL similar to my mother. Many hours of counselling helped me make the decision that I would never leave my children with her again because she was always undermining me and my husband.
It sounds like your MIL is highly manipulative, feels that she can say anything she likes because she is his mother and has probably been like it all his life so has damaged your husband's self-esteem. It is a strange thing but the children of people like this know what their parent is like but still have that childish desire to try to make things right. He is telling himself that if he gets things right, including lending money to his siblings, somehow the relationship will come right. Of course, you and all of us know it won't. Until he can sort that out in his head, he won't be able to help himself.
The only thing you can do is stay calmly firm. You aren't denying access, you are just saying that it has to be at your house with you. If you have to explain, be honest. Tell her calmly that you will not allow her to undermine you or your husband with your children and that is your job to protect your children. She won't like it but she really doesn't have to. I'd be calmly telling my husband that if he lends money he doesn't have, he'll have to find a way to pick up the pieces. By raiding your savings you are enabling him to continue this behaviour.
My son would never allow me to bad mouth his wife in front of him and I respect the both of him not to. Your husband should stop his mother in her tracks if she bad mouths you. She can only divide you if he lets her. It's like that nasty triangle kids use to divide their parents. Once they stand firmly together, they lose that power. Maybe couples counselling would help him see that.

He phones, he comes to see us and he cooks for us and they both welcome us to theirs just as they know they are always welcome at our house.

But I know that his lovely wife and children are the most important people in his life.

OP,

You have to be kidding me!
Do you want your mil to come for a full month, take over your (excuse me, HER) child, demand your dh takes vacation while she is there, she is not happy with the name, etc?

If that is what you want, be my guest.

She is taking over your life, your postpartum period (which is no joke. Recovering from birth is not easy), your dh's vacation to be with he AND you remain silent aka polite?

Boundaries will not work with her. Why do you keep chasing her? Making her feel included? You give her an inch she takes 100 miles.
Her entitlement has no bounds.

Start by saying no, before the visit

For example, you want her to come, but only for 2 weeks
"No, mil, you are welcome to stay for weeks"

Seriously, your dh and you are doormat. Stop letting your MIL tell you what to do and take control of your lives.

A month is far too long! You and DH need time to work things out, to bond, to establish your family unit without her input!

Untie the apron strings by all means , but your mother is forever your mother whereas a wife quite often becomes an ex-wife and "--- is nothing to do with me now". The quotation marks are because my son said that to me.

I agree Alexa. They can't divorce us can they?

OP, I say this kindly, but stand up for yourself.

There is no need to be unkind, but you are allowed to decide who visits your house and for how long. Any reasonable person understands that. If your mother-in-law kicks off, but that says everything you need to know about her. If people choose to believe her and her tantrum, then that tells you what you need to know about them. You do not need people in your life who don’t respect you.
Your child does not need to grow up seeing his grandmother disrespect you.

Please stop being so passive. All that will do is Because the relationship to be irreparably harmed. And you will never be able to forgive her. Giving her boundaries is a kindness. Because it allows her to remain in your life

Giving her boundaries is a kindness. Because it allows her to remain in your life

Wow never saw it this way. I like that concept.

To clarify my DH has 2 weeks holiday to take. She was insisting he takes them before she comes.. because she doesn’t want him present when she baby sits. She wants unsupervised access to the child. Her excuse was that she thinks he needs to take it after his paternity leave to help me
Out. So I returned the favor and told DH I think he should take it when she is here to spend time with his mother.

The issue is if he isn’t present in the house she knows I’m a passive person and even though he is passive too but she likes to act in front of him that she loves me but when he isn’t here she ends up being quite rude behind his back and then making me look like I’m lying so DH doesn’t believe me. She ends up getting her way.

It is true the pp that mentioned it’s the same kind of triangulation little kids do to their parents. Very interesting I never saw it this way! Helps me empathize ! But I really do need to set some boundaries.

I am frustrated with myself because I don’t know how to set boundaries. DH like a pp Said is still figuring it out. He doesn’t wanna upset his mother. He wants to give it his all to try make it work. He has hope in this one big happy family dream and I can’t blame him and I need him to feel he tried his best.. but deep down some days I’m with him and other days I’m just not sure it will work unless he learns how to communicate boundaries.

I think I need to explain to him how it’s kind to put boundaries because it allows her to be more involved without the tension. But im a crap role model because I too have no clue how to put such boundaries because even though I do put boundaries she ends up really pushing and pushing until it becomes too awkward for me to keep repeating and I’m not at that stage where I can have any assertive tone with her or a negative consequence aside from keeping my distance because naturally I can’t take it anymore. But that doesn’t seem to be working.

I probably do need couples counseling. Need to register ASAP.

I am glad I asked on here. Even though you all confirmed that I need to stand up for myself, but the perspective on here paints her more as a human with issue and less as a cruel human being..

I struggle to understand manipulative behavior and to me it sounds extremely dark and haunting and scary to know im a little victim in someone’s big game. On Mumsnet the interpretation of MILs behavior and what I need to do to work on my relationship with DH is very overwhelming for me.. because it makes her out of this world which makes me completely lose control
Of the situation and confidence. And the only solution I’m offered is to LTB.

I wanted to hear from mothers of men, I want to try support myself and my husband do the right thing which is fair on everyone involved. Him, me and his mother. I don’t want to be absorbed with my own needs and feelings and forget everyone else.

I think gransnetters have the advantage of experience and time. In that even a negative experience might’ve had time pass by and let the emotions be processed until things can be seen from a logical angle as opposed from a reactive angle.

Thanks a lot for that. I wish I had my mother to turn to for this but she is a very weak human being and an abuse victim because of it and just doesn’t spot signs of manipulation and thinks as long as DH isn’t physically abusing me that he is a king, thinks im being dramatic and owe him my life because he isn’t as bad as what she went through.

So I prefer getting advice from anonymous ladies who will be honest about what it’s like to be a mother of older kids and what’s fair to be expected from a daughter in law.

I’m not at that stage where I can have any assertive tone with her or a negative consequence aside from keeping my distance because naturally I can’t take it anymore. But that doesn’t seem to be working.

If you don’t feel you are at a place where you can stand up for yourself and be assertive, you need to cancel her visit. Otherwise she will run roughshod over you and rule your roost.

Can you look up assertiveness training in your area? I had to do it once for work and it was brilliant.

Aw stella1949 that’s lovely your truly blessed.i have three sons and they are all different youngest one still at home others married. Would love what you’ve got. Youngest one is the closest and does show his love in various ways but I know it’s the way of things for the married ones.

My DS lives in the USA with his South Korean wife and her parents (back in S Korea) berate her for not looking after us enough! DS and DiL Skype every week and we are quite happy with that.

Summerlove

Will look that up. I would benefit from that. I found online but they seem expensive and can’t afford that right now so might look st free content. Been really trying to train myself in that aspect but I do think she needs someone who is an expert at assertiveness and dealing manipulation and hoping I get there soon.

I can’t cancel the visit at all. But I told my DH repeatedly that she isn’t to be welcomed to stay at our house. She has her own place which is quite far from us but I can sense she wants to be staying over at mine to offer help with the baby, but I won’t pander to it.

My DH has brushed it away for now but I know under pressure he will crack and take the easy way. I guess I don’t trust his assertiveness skills at all.

I really don’t want to be having those arguments with DH while 2 weeks postpartum. I don’t want to be thinking about how to protect myself and not feel vulnerable when I should be focused on the baby. With the previous baby they totally tried stealing my attention and I ended up giving in because I wanted to avoid conflict and just focus on my child. I gave in horrendously..

Put up a fight with my DH and resented him.. even though he was trying his best.

I really feel drained to go through that again.

I think I need to schedule couple counseling before they arrive so that I avoided letting all this affect me and my marriage

I am more than happy that my DS has a lovely partner. BUT I would love to see him on his OWN sometimes. That's what I miss. She's always there too..

HettyMaud

That’s totally understandable.