Over 70s

Judy54 it is not wrong and discriminatory
It is based on statistics, computer modelling, and it is in order to flatten the peak and not overwhelm the NHS.

It is for practical reasons rather than to protect us as individuals.

It's not the transmission of viruses in general which is unproven eglantine but any definitive science on treatment and containment of covid-19. There is no authorative consensus on approach, if there were governments all over the world would be applying it. Instead, we have a suck it and see mentality which may or may not work but in the meantime drastically affects people's lives.

I keep hearing the ‘flatten the peak’ reasoning. It makes sense but doesn’t mean that you won’t get the virus. Every time your delivery person-if you’ve been lucky enough to get one, (which I haven’t)- leaves shopping it could be contaminated. Evidently you can pick it up on your shoes-so walking outside to pick up your shopping could kill you.
For some family and friends it won’t be the virus that kills them it will be losing their jobs, their income and eventually their homes.
If grandparents are still on lockdown, they can’t do childcare, so the parents are in a cleft stick. Work and put their children into mixed boiling pots of child care or don’t work.
It’s a difficult decision, but people will have to make it.
Giving people more positive actions to take-taking more care, wear masks and gloves, still avoid being too close might be more helpful.
But people are all different. On my last weekly visit to the supermarket-masked and gloved, I watched a woman who I know pontificates in Gransnet about staying in, picking up and squeezing fruit, in spite of the notices above every box saying not to do that. Do I think she’ll care if her actions kill someone?

The death rate in Sweden is no more than ours in UK even though they do not have lockdown. I think they are aiming for the herd immunity which our government was keen on in the first few weeks before they realized that our hospitals could not cope. Then these Nightingale hospitals were rushed up but where is all the equipment and medical staff going to come from? So for now they lie empty or nearly so.
Perhaps we should do what has happened in the past and still does in some countries - let a family member, already exposed to the virus, sit by the patient and deal with basic personal care. Monitors could alert a trained person to spot signs of deterioration.

Not happy at the prospect at all. My hubby got "the letter" today (extremely vulnerable) and should not go out. The problem is that we live in a village where there is no bus service, no shops, no Church even! I am partially sighted and therefore cannot drive. I have arthritis in my feet and Type 2 Diabetes also. I have gone shopping alone before (taxi at £10 each way), but I cannot read "use by" dates, and will mix up similar items. There is no one in the village able to help, as most are similar ages (over 70) and many are equally vulnerable (there are only 10 houses in our street). Without my husband's help - I'm really going to struggle. He is more disabled than me - but this prescribed confinement is really going to harm his mental health. He feels bad that I have to do all the housework and cooking already and if he can't drive me around and help me to shop, I don't know what he will do. I don't think he would survive 12 to 18 months "lockdown". The summer months are bad for us, as he suffers from the heat. We have two tall fans, but he still sweats heavily in warm weather, and that makes his skin cancer worse. We had hoped to sell our house and move to the North of Scotland where it is almost always a few degrees cooler - but obviously we can no longer host viewings and people wouldn't come, in any event. I'm really worried for him now.

Sweden is interesting b cause from 1934 till 1976 they pursued a state programme of eugenics where anyone considered physically, genetically or mentally deficient was compulsorily sterilised often as an infant.

So the current Swedish population has mostly been bred from the genetically sound and healthy.

If m not advocating this in any way but it is a factor to take into consideration and may have influenced the government approach.

Are you actually f*cking joking eglantine????? That's the most shocking, disgusting post I've ever seen on any forum.

I don't think for one minute it influenced government decision making, patriciageegee , but it is true that Sweden practised eugenics for very many years.

I’m not 70 yet but husband is over 70. As we don’t get on well the thought of this going on is already affecting my mental health. The only thing that keeps me going is the prospect of seeing my children and grandchildren and new baby due in the summer.

No, it’s a fact of history.

If, scientifically, you know that the majority of your population is strong you may be prepared to take more risks.

Eglantine has said exactly my thoughts. Those of you who think it's fine to take your chances and refuse treatment - there is no knowing how many people you have infected before refusing treatment. My daughter in law is a nurse, one of her colleagues was the Doctor who passed away earlier this week. He had been on a ventilator for weeks. She and the rest of the staff are devastated. I will be doing whatever is necessary as will the rest of my family and friends.

Were you talking about Swedish Government policy on lockdown Eglantine
It is an interesting thought.
Horrendous, but interesting nonetheless.

How do we know that callistemon? And the fact that it was posted with the comment that it's a 'factor to be taken into consideration' whether or not she 'advocated' it is utterly repugnant and has no place in a tolerant, compassionate discussion such as this.

It is historical fact patriciageegee.

I'm surprised you were unaware of it.
And did it influence the Swedish decisions on their approach towards locking down?
Sweden has been held up as an example of not going into total lockdown but having fewer cases of COVID19 than other countries.
Why?

Also, if we are considering gender, ethnic origins and disability as risk factors we should also study cultures and outcomes where certain risk factors have been almost eliminated.

What kind if people are you? Maybe you're of Swedish descent? How can you find such a vile inhumane policy 'interesting' and relate it in ANY positive way to the current crisis? Beyond.....

I’m sorry you think it’s disgusting. It is a fact that they vigorously pursued this policy and apologised for it later.

Is it the policy you find disgusting? In which case I agree.

Swedish chief medical experts are saying they are aiming for 'herd immunity' within weeks.

That's an assumption on your part callistemon and just because it's an historical fact doesn't make it morally right to include it on this thread.

Do you find the studies on why the BAME community have been particularly hard hit disgusting?

I am of that community and it is of great interest to me.

Oh fgs patriciageegee your posts are quite uncalled for and offensive.

No-one is agreeing with the policies pursued by the Nazis and by Nordic countries, Sweden up until the mid 1970s.

I don’t understand why you would want to ignore what could be a significant factor in understanding the progress and outcomes of the virus.

I have not assumed anything patriciageegee.

Read my posts.

Eglantine I think a lot of research will take place in the future on why some ethnic groups, some blood types have responded differently towards the virus. Another factor is that men seem to succumb more than women.

There is a lot to research.