NEIGHBOUR WITH DEMENTIA?

I am always grateful to my mums neighbours who were so kind as dementia, a cruel disease, took over her life.

My neighbour has dementia and I saw it coming on years ago through personality characteristics such as an obsession with bins, conversations that went around (in the way described upthread) inability to understand or follow simple instructions and growing aggression. Her husband must have shielded her to a grerat extent but when he died a few years back she became a lot worse. She now wanders up and down in cold weather wearing only thin night clothes. Or sits outside in the pouring rain.

Her grown children live a few hours drive away. So at one point a busybody neighbour hatched a plot with her daughter that she (busybody) and I should be keyholders in case of a crisis. I quickly knocked that one on the head as I am disabled with arthritis and would be unable to do much anyway. I dont drive and would not be able to lift another person. Busybody neighbour was pretty miffed when my nephew went around and told her not to contact me again.

Now she lives with one of her adult children and they come back every 2/3 weeks to check on the house and collect the mail. I dont understand why she does not just sell up.

In your position I would be putting in a much higher fence between the houses to stop her coming onto your property, I would certainly approach the adult children with your concerns. Otherwise keep well clear.

CariadAgain

Well - I've tried to contact the DVLA. I was told "10 minute wait time" and 25 minutes later someone answered the phone finally. Obstacle course right at the outset - as they refuse to take any details by phone. They just kept on and on and on saying "Send us an email or a letter". I can't send an email - as they'll see my email address (so it won't be anonymous). I can't send a letter - as I'm realistic enough to know my handwriting is absolutely appalling and even I can't read it sometimes. I said to him "Well - I can live with myself because I've tried - but there doesn't seem to be a way to contact you anonymously - as I feel too concerned that, if I did it by email then you'd have my email address". So - if people knew whereabouts I live in the country and what the downside is like of living here they'd understand my concerns and I'm well aware that some of the "locals" stick together (even though I'm as British by birth as they are). So I tried - but I feel stuck....or as I said to the DVLA guy "Well - I can live with my conscience - because I did try....but your system won't let me do this the only way that I feel is safe for me...".

Cariadagain, could I suggest you get a new email from say, gmail, use it just for the purpose of contacting DVLA and possibly the Elderly Care Team at the local Council and then don't use it again. Think up a simple name, like John Smith you can always delete it.

Jaxjacky I think you may be right.

I don't even understand what "Also I've just googled "social services" for this area and came up against "Though she's such an elderly agegroup" That was something on the internet or did you speak to someone? If she was "someone" wouldn't they been even more keen to look after her?

Re DVLA I doubt it is anything to do with who she is, I reported my aunt and uncle who definitely shouldn't have been driving and nothing was done about it and none of us are "someone."

Also I've just googled "social services" for this area and came up against "Though she's such an elderly agegroup - I know in this area her deceased husband regarded himself as Someone and she got that secondhand just for being married to him". That is how things work in this area - ie not the normal way I'm used to. So someone might well take it on themselves to think "She's the person who used to be married to Someone who thought he was Someone locally" and not do their job properly/objectively (it happens frequently in this area). So stymied re DVLA, stymied re Social Services = it's gotta be her adult children then....

welbeck

sounds like a lot to get used to.
was there any particular reason why you moved to that area ?

I find the "respect" for older people just because they're older astonishing - though I can see I now count as "older person" and I get it too and I'm there thinking "I did stuff when younger that I feel merits respect - but nobody here knows about that and so it feels very odd to me".

Anyway.....it certainly means problem-solving for a lot of things that came way easier in my own area I'm from - that's for sure....

....and, back on topic, and I'm still keeping that eye out for adult children...

Good advice MOnica unfortunately I fear it may not be heard.

I was wondering that too. Seems the area doesn’t suit you cariad.

sounds like a lot to get used to.
was there any particular reason why you moved to that area ?

welbeck

i don't understand what you mean about the phone lines, and seeking a joint approach.
surely BT or whoever deals with each customer individually.
there are no party lines anymore, are there ?

Our phonelines are underground actually for our houses - not lines hanging in the air from poles. The Telecoms guy is looking for a way to do this underground too - but he can't...because I know I certainly won't let them dig up any of my garden for this. I allowed it years back in the first place (when I hadn't yet got it sorted out/spending a lot of money in the process) - but I have now spent that big bill and got it sorted and so won't let them dig it up obviously and they're going to have to think of some other way (eg hopefully these new type lines can also be hung from telephone poles).

Yep....there are still party lines in this area!!!!! That's what I found was the case between myself and next door house when I moved here and wondered what on earth the problem was with my phoneline. Also someone else nearby recently realised their house still had a partyline with a neighbour and has just had that put right.

This is a poor and remote area - and "they have their own way of doing things" sometimes - rather than doing them the normal way.

Anyway - I'll just have to "negotiate" things on my own with the telecoms people to get things done the normal way and with no disruption to my garden - as it doesn't seem to be possible to get things organised jointly.

Still keeping an eye out for those adult "children" and on protecting my garden from her vandalising it again.

I think people may be right that her children can't quite see how bad her mind is. I guess they don't want that to be the case - as she's their mother and this is a very "family-centred" type area and I was astonished to find that older people here tend to command "respect" just because they are older (something that never happens in my own area I moved here from - which is very different in a lot of ways).

CariadAgain It seems to me that you really do not understand the nature of dementia.

If someone has dementia, even in the early stages, the first thing to go is their capacity to reason. What you say to them and what they hear are entirely diffeent things. Anything you do tell them will have been forgotten as soon as you say it, or rather will not even make it into their mind at all. So talking to this lady about anything and expecting any rational response is, quite frankly, a waste of time.

The same applies to anything she says to you. her mind is in another world and she is living in a completely different reality. The thing is She cannot help it. Her brain is damaged, just as much as someone with a broken leg has a leg that is damaged and cannot walk.

The easiest way to deal with someone with dementia if they speak to you, is not to try to make sense of what they are saying or reason with them, it is just to listen, smile and make non-committal rmarks. Accept that everything she says is a reflection of how her damage brain is working and not rational thought. Do not think you can say anything to her that she will be capable of processing and understanding.

People with dementia often get angry because they are scared and frightened. They are dealing with a world they no longer understand, where things keep happening that they were not expecting and do not know what to do about. It is no different to our own reactions when we find ourself in a situation we do not understand - like for example your reaction to this lady with dementia. - You do not understand her, she is causing you problems and you cannot get a reasoned response from her - and this has clearly caused you a lot of distress and anger.

i don't understand what you mean about the phone lines, and seeking a joint approach.
surely BT or whoever deals with each customer individually.
there are no party lines anymore, are there ?

Please do phone DVLA as you are obviously aware of her hitting things whilst in her car so how would you feel if it was a person next time ? You have a responsibility to do that.
It sounds awful having this person as your neighbour as she must make life difficult for you and she sounds very unpredictable. Surely her family must notice her behaviour , do you think that they just haven’t quite joined all the dots yet or it’s easier to ignore it for now than to deal with it ?

I'm basically a pretty pragmatic type of person and I know it would be helpful to both of us to co-operate as to what we decide on that new type of phoneline they want to put on everyone. I knew she could be somewhat agressive - but had hoped she'd see logical practical sense of a joint plan for dealing with this. I hadn't realised she had dementia until that point. I knew she is a bad driver and has had several mini-mishaps to my knowledge. But it became very clear in the course of the conversation that she can't focus on what the conversation is about - but constantly off on irrelevant tangent and then same irrelevant tangent again and so on. Then she made the comment about hearing non-existent conversations in her own house and that was absolutely the clincher and I looked at her eyes as well and added everything up and the penny dropped and I realised. I hadnt realised before because I have as little as possible to do with her - as a self-protective measure. Now I do know - I shall be steering very well clear of her. We can all make mistakes and the one I made there was thinking she might at least have some element of thinking logically - and I guess that's because my thinking is first and foremost along the lines of what is logical and then I will take my emotions into account after I've made sure my mind has thought through an issue. Hence I guess I probably do expect other people generally to think with their brain/logic first and then see what their emotions are doing iyswim. Probably most of us assume other people think/act the same way we ourselves do.

I am wondering why you thought you had to go to her house. The telephone people would have contacted you, had it been necessary. Do not engage.

My mum had dementia and her personality changed drastically. She couldn’t help it any more than your neighbour can.
Please speak to her children and let them know their mum is vulnerable.

I think you sound very angry Cariad I hope you have other things in your life other than this hiccup.

So sorry to hear this - I think you are right to try to talk to one of the children.
Depending on the response, I also think that you could contact Adult Social Care, reporting someone vulnerable (which you can do anonymously). This lady is causing you grief, but she aso appears to be vulnerable herself (these two so often go together)

If you are lucky enough to have a PCSO locally, I would consider having a quiet word, they are usually very helpful (but I do appreciate what you are saying about the police)

So yep...previous owner of her house would have 101% told her (complained to her) that she wasn't being allowed to park in my garden now I'm the owner of my house - as she created a right ruckus all round when I told her permission was now revoked with my house being under new ownership.

Actually a (very) local Welsh friend of mine told me to be careful about who to trust - and proceeded to reel off to me how the local solicitors tell each other all sorts that is confidential to their clients when they are on the golf course together. I don't have a printer to print anything off. So I am just waiting and looking out for her "children" now and think that might be a way forward. If I told the local police - well I've had a couple of examples of them being biased before (and yep...they shouldnt be either....but "crimes etc" do sometimes get overlooked or minimised here because of who the offender is and I've seen a couple of shocking examples of this). I've not been used to this way of operating....but it does happen sometimes in this remote little area. Re the parking and she would definitely have been told re previous owner of my house let previous owner of her house park there - and she was being very presumptuous to assume that a new owner would do so too. In fact I'm absolutely certain the previous owner of her house would have told her how she continued to push for parking - even though I was told from the vendors direction of my house "We gave permission to next door to park there" and so I know no legal rights got acquired, as that permission obviously expired when the previous owner of my house died.

when she bought the house/ moved in she might have been told that parking was available on that spot, as you say previous owners allowed this.
people trying to sell/let a property often oversell its facilities.
could you print an anon letter and send it to DVLA.
is it really so risky to email them ?
do you think they would reveal your details ?

winterwhite

I agree, contact Social Care and her son asap. I don't think it up to you to contact the DVLA unless you have personal evidence of her unfitness to drive, and parking where she shouldn't doesn't really constitute that.

You sound rather hostile towards your neighbour, Cariad. She obviously needs help and care. Let's hope her son and daughter will now realise that.

Re my own feelings to the neighbour - literally the day she moved in she broke something in my garden that cost me a 4-figure amount of money to sort out and busily denied it was anything to do with her. So it's not exactly surprising that I don't cherish fond thoughts of her in the circumstances - even without taking into account anything else she has done since. I've never had an apology or paying that bill she owes from her. Re the "parking where she shouldnt" = and she has pushed and pushed to try to be able to park in my garden and been pretty nasty about it that I (obviously) won't let her (ie because it is my garden). It doesnt endear someone to a person if the "pusher" goes as far as setting the police onto me to see if they can manage to persuade me into letting her park in MY garden and I've had to produce evidence no-one else is entitled to (when it's very obvious it is my garden).

Anyway - I'm currently keeping an eye out hoping her son will be coming to visit her soon and I might get a chance to have a word with him - ie now I have realised she has got dementia.

My mum had early onset dementia, she went very rapidly from being a friendly and helpful individual to a person who could be really nasty to her neighbours and friends, indeed she accused a couple who lived next door of spying through her curtains and planting cameras in her flat. It was very sad. But she also heard voices in the night which she said were her neighbours creeping about. Sufferers can often become paranoid.

aggie

You are overthinking the situation and getting your brain in a fankle !
Get on the phone to the DVLA , the Social services and the Police , get it off your chest before you let her cause an accident

Exactly. Do it now