Why do some people refuse to go online?

I ran a computerised telecommunications system. Trained over 600 people to use it, Trained in overseas telegrams and also did some codes etc, so am perfectly able to use computers.
I am very aware of the many possibilities for scams etc. But what some people don't think through is how secure the safety protection of information is. Whilst I am aware of how useful it could be to doctors to have my information available in case of an emergency, but I will not do this as the fact that the NHS does not have the latest in security and therefore I will not be allowing it. We have seen enough just lately of scams and private information being taken. These sorts of problems mean that many times it does not feel sensible to use these things when we are not controlling the end result. I don't expect anyone to sort my problems, and am very independent.
So long as I am not expecting others to deal with my problems, why should I be forced into using things and not have a choice. By all means have the options. But when you assume that everyone can afford to have all the latest up to date things, and end up with a second class citizens situation, where if you don't have a phone you don't get a doctors appointment is very much big brother is watching you, and allowing such as the banks to give very poor or no service and expect you the customer to do all the work. I have made choices all my life and expect to live with the consequences. I do not see why ,if I don't ask for anything from you that I am not entitled to do as I please

I think you are but that isn't the scenario that has been put forward.

Renata1079

I have two friends in their 80's who are single women with no children. Both are really kind, and lovely ladies. They are also very intelligent women, and have worked hard all their lives. Incidentally they don't know each other, and live a long way apart.

They both have small pensions, very modest savings, and neither have been lucky enough to inherit any money. Neither of them had siblings, so they have no nieces or nephews, or great nieces or great nephews. Both have one or two elderly cousins who live a long way away. They cannot afford to pay for broadband, or buy and keep up to date with gadgets like laptops, smart phones and tablets etc., and no adult children or other young relatives to help them learn how to use them anyway.

Both ladies used to drive, but for either health or financial reasons, have had to give up their cars. So altogether they are feeling very cut off and isolated. They are having a terrible time with businesses, utilities and authorities, and also with their doctor's surgeries, as they are not able to gain access to these services and communicate with them on-line. More and more organisations are cruelly insisting on this.

There must be many, many more men and women like these who live alone - and who through no fault of their own, are not able to be on-line. How can we help them???

Quite sad for them. Can they access services through their Churches?

We've an elderly group once a week at our Church. Soup, bread, time to socalize, receive help from others (usually staff members) with phone calls, emails, detail of life. Some people bring others, staff bring a few.

Priest is round for Prayer, Confession, Eucharist.

Currently dealing with a death-I detest online forms. Give me paper and I’ll do anything.
Tech is great but it doesn’t always go smoothly. Sometimes it’s just another stresser.
As to social media it can be wonderful or devastating.
I’ve experienced both.
Though there is much that is wonderful- the location of list pets, local events, catching up with old friends…, the internet is now designed to sell, sell, sell.it’s not our friend. Family friendly solicitors replaced by huge companies chasing our money.
‘Democracy is not the same now MPs rarely do face to face.

Local libraries often have have volunteers who can help with Tech.

Lathyrus3

Well, all I was saying was that I can’t see any difference between not being IT competent and getting someone to do it for you, not driving and getting someone to do it for you or any other thing when you get someone else to do the thing that you can’t/don’t want to do.

Yet some of the people who poured scorn on the IT reluctant , and even refused to help them, were the same people who relied on on others to drive them about.

The fact that the driver does it cheerfully and willingly, doesn’t change the dependence factor. It only tells you that the friend who refused to help her husband wasn’t as obliging as the husbands who drive about.

And as a driver I do find that I an expected to share my car and give lifts, or drive to see friends rather than them using transport to come to me.

It’s not just friends that expect I will drive them about. I’m frequently expected to do pickups so that people in various groups I belong to can also attend ‘because they wouldn’t be able to if I didn’t pick them up”

Do I do it? Yes. I’m not that mean. It’s the expectation that grinds sometimes.

And all I am saying is that there is a huge difference (IMO) between someone refusing to do something and sneering at those who do, and someone who for whatever reason is unable to do a very different thing whose partner is happy to do it for them. It’s not about dependence- I rather resent that. I could (and often do) get a taxi or use public transport, but (a) it costs more, (b) there can be risks attached and (c) when he is available my husband doesn’t mind driving me, which is what you don’t seem to understand 😀.

Last night he drove me to a group thing in another part of town, to a place with limited parking. Several others got lifts too, as leaving cars there during the event would be problematic. Two people asked me if they could come home with me to save their lifts from coming out again. Of course I said yes and Husband was happy to drop them off on the way. It’s not ‘dependence’, it is what people do. Another time I might get a lift with one of the people who came home with me last night. It works out, as we are friends and happy to help one another- is that odd?.

I suppose a parallel might be that I’m happy to knit my husband jumpers. He could buy his own, or no doubt do it himself badly, but he prefers mine as they fit better, he gets exactly what he wants, and (crucially) I don’t mind doing it, as it’s him.

Doodledog

Lathyrus3

Well, all I was saying was that I can’t see any difference between not being IT competent and getting someone to do it for you, not driving and getting someone to do it for you or any other thing when you get someone else to do the thing that you can’t/don’t want to do.

Yet some of the people who poured scorn on the IT reluctant , and even refused to help them, were the same people who relied on on others to drive them about.

The fact that the driver does it cheerfully and willingly, doesn’t change the dependence factor. It only tells you that the friend who refused to help her husband wasn’t as obliging as the husbands who drive about.

And as a driver I do find that I an expected to share my car and give lifts, or drive to see friends rather than them using transport to come to me.

It’s not just friends that expect I will drive them about. I’m frequently expected to do pickups so that people in various groups I belong to can also attend ‘because they wouldn’t be able to if I didn’t pick them up”

Do I do it? Yes. I’m not that mean. It’s the expectation that grinds sometimes.

And all I am saying is that there is a huge difference (IMO) between someone refusing to do something and sneering at those who do, and someone who for whatever reason is unable to do a very different thing whose partner is happy to do it for them. It’s not about dependence- I rather resent that. I could (and often do) get a taxi or use public transport, but (a) it costs more, (b) there can be risks attached and (c) when he is available my husband doesn’t mind driving me, which is what you don’t seem to understand 😀.

Last night he drove me to a group thing in another part of town, to a place with limited parking. Several others got lifts too, as leaving cars there during the event would be problematic. Two people asked me if they could come home with me to save their lifts from coming out again. Of course I said yes and Husband was happy to drop them off on the way. It’s not ‘dependence’, it is what people do. Another time I might get a lift with one of the people who came home with me last night. It works out, as we are friends and happy to help one another- is that odd?.

I suppose a parallel might be that I’m happy to knit my husband jumpers. He could buy his own, or no doubt do it himself badly, but he prefers mine as they fit better, he gets exactly what he wants, and (crucially) I don’t mind doing it, as it’s him.

I agree. Goodness!

Doesn't personA do as much as they can to help their partner, whilst the partner does everything they can to help personA ?

My very able 82 year old husband is has a difficult time with his shoes. It's a mystery to me what the problem is but when he can't accomplish "socks and shoes on" I help, why wouldn't I? He makes the coffee, I can but his is better.

Kindness is love, spread kindness all round. ❤

I think there are differences between physically helping a partner and one of you being in a position where you would be unable to administer their own life without the other though.

My heart sinks when people say that they have no idea about how to pay their bills, what their financial situation is, or even how to access that information, and don’t know where passwords are kept, etc. . Sooner or later one of you will die, and it’s hard enough coping with that, being unable to operate independently online with your bills etc. adds a whole new level of stress that you don’t need.

Some older people no longer have minds as sharp as they used to be and simply cannot cope mentally with appliances - and a mobile phone or computer is an appliance - especialy when the the technology is entirely alien to them.

I am not talking about people with dementia but people with tired minds. DH suffers from heart failure and as he gradually goes downhill, I am taking over all sorts of organisation he did online - he has been using computers since the 1970s - simply because his mind is too tired to focus.

Similar issues must arise for many couples M0nica, it must be very difficult for those who have never used any technology because their OH did everything, to face. My parents are now well in their nineties, and we have had to take over their online bill paying etc. now, but my dad was managing it into his late eighties. My mum would not have been able to manage administering her life online alone.

M0nica

Some older people no longer have minds as sharp as they used to be and simply cannot cope mentally with appliances - and a mobile phone or computer is an appliance - especialy when the the technology is entirely alien to them.

I am not talking about people with dementia but people with tired minds. DH suffers from heart failure and as he gradually goes downhill, I am taking over all sorts of organisation he did online - he has been using computers since the 1970s - simply because his mind is too tired to focus.

I believe this is true. I use my laptop quite well. However a fiddly "smartphone" if I'm out, staring at the small screen, small keys? No thank you. I can and do look everything up at home where I can focus. No pressure to hurry.

Yes I agree with Casdon that I worry when only one partner is the only one who knows how to operate the Internet, or do the housework, or pay bills, whatever the issue is.
I may be operating at quite a high level of hypocrisy, having never mowed a lawn in my life.

But Galaxy you can pay someone to mow a lawn, you wouldn’t pay someone or even ask a neighbour to manage your household finances.
My husband was like Monica’s, a very competent computer user, but latterly he couldn’t concentrate for long. Fortunately our household bills came out of our joint account, which I managed.

What I can’t understand is your resentment or reluctance to phone her and tell her what the postcode is.

Grannytomany

What I can’t understand is your resentment or reluctance to phone her and tell her what the postcode is.

It is probably because every time someone else does a simple thing for her on the internet it reinforces her impression that it is too complicated and dangerous to do herself and that she can always get them to do everything. She may need guiding through looking things up at first, but the sense of achievement could encourage her to do more.

If you always carried your child everywhere and never put it down on the floor to move around on its own, it may never have learnt to walk - let alone run - or climb a tree.

Can someone sit next to her and talk her through doing it herself? That is often a lot easier than being told how to do something, as she can see for herself how easy it is to do, and can go over anything that doesn't 'click' straight away.

As she wrote a letter to ask for the postcode though, I assume she lives a long way off?

Yes, she does. I rarely see her. She sees her brother more often though he is not close by. If he hasn’t persuaded her, nobody will. I’m not resentful, just a bit frustrated. What would be a simple task is a bit more of a chore. I would gladly text the information but that’s not possible either.
But it is not just personal. It is a common scenario. Lots of reasons have been given in answer to my question as to why some people refuse to use the internet. Thank you.

Cabbie21

Yes, she does. I rarely see her. She sees her brother more often though he is not close by. If he hasn’t persuaded her, nobody will. I’m not resentful, just a bit frustrated. What would be a simple task is a bit more of a chore. I would gladly text the information but that’s not possible either.
But it is not just personal. It is a common scenario. Lots of reasons have been given in answer to my question as to why some people refuse to use the internet. Thank you.

I think saying they refuse seems to imply they have some obligation to do it. The truth is she chooses not to which is her right. You don't have to give her the details but if you want to see her it seems reasonable to do it.

Cyberphobia.

Online fraud in the UK annually

The annual loss to online fraud in the UK has been significant, with various reports indicating substantial amounts. Here are some key figures:

£2.3 billion reported loss in 2024, with a total reported fraud losses of £2,255,491,192 in 2024, a 6% increase from the previous year.

£11.4 billion lost to scams in the last 12 months, up £4 billion from last year.

£219 billion estimated cost of fraud in the UK, with private sector losses at £157.8 billion.

These figures highlight the ongoing challenges of online fraud in the UK and the need for continued vigilance and action against it.

Casdon

Allira

Kate1949

My sister gave up work before computers were part of office life.

I was a Civil Servant and was using computers before I retired.

Yes, they were in the workplace in the 1970s. I had a boyfriend who worked in a motorbike distributors, and their computer took up a whole room. I can also remember the typewriters which had a one line memory function, and the DOS operating system with the green screens when records were transferred from card filing, which was about 1980 I think - 45 years ago.

My first job after college had a Commodore computer that used DOS. I hated it - inputting took far longer than writing records, the whole thing would crash & wipe all the records about fortnightly, & my boss would spend half his working day pottering with it, which added to my workload.
A decade or so later we got a home PC - mainly for the children - they were so hard to set up & the internet with the phoneline modems was so slow. I used to hold my breath every time I did something new & the PC frequently got tirades of abuse from me but never behaved any better.
I admit they are a lot more user -friendly now,but PCs & smartphones can be the most infuriating machines ever.

Elegran

Grannytomany

What I can’t understand is your resentment or reluctance to phone her and tell her what the postcode is.

It is probably because every time someone else does a simple thing for her on the internet it reinforces her impression that it is too complicated and dangerous to do herself and that she can always get them to do everything. She may need guiding through looking things up at first, but the sense of achievement could encourage her to do more.

If you always carried your child everywhere and never put it down on the floor to move around on its own, it may never have learnt to walk - let alone run - or climb a tree.

I take a different view. I know that not all elderly people can cope with modern technology especially those who haven’t had to learn it as part of their working lives. It remains completely alien and mystifying to them. I know that I’m fortunate to have been computer literate for decades and wouldn’t like to have manage now without being online but I don’t expect everyone else to be the same. And I certainly don’t think it’s a very kind thing to do to refuse or be reluctant to help those who can’t.

My impression from the OP was that this lady’s request for information was infrequent rather than frequent.

When my children were small I knew it was my responsibility to further their development. I do not think it is my responsibility or indeed business to press or coerce family or relatives into spending money and incurring stress on learning all about online life.

One of my friends doesn’t even have a smart phone or any other computer type device and she wants to stay that way. Why should I not help her by providing information I’ve looked up on line for her? I’d help her in other ways if I could and I don’t see how the OP’s situation is any different.

Be kind for goodness sake. Or discontinue the relationship if you resent the request for information so much.

My late DH after retiring, still carried on some legal work. As I had secretarial experience in the distant past, he expected me to jump to and type legal documents, letters etc. But I was in the same boat as he was! Computers were completely new to me. He’d always had secretaries to deal with such things.

I did resentfully comply, but it was his attitude that it was nothing to do with him that was so annoying.
The assumption that others will do what you will not tackle yourself is what causes trouble.