Child Poverty

"How many of us waste hours waiting for buses and traveling by bus? "
Bus travel is a treat for me, with an OP bus pass. I much prefer it to car. But maybe not for longer distances.

I know plenty of families ( at my DGC’s school) who could never afford to travel into town by bus . It makes me sick ! And angry ! We are a seaside town and many children from the estate in which my DGC’s school is situated have never seen the sea ! How can we say this isn’t poverty ?

Bus travel is mega expensive for those without a free pass Fennel

Ok, how many more times are people going to ask me to justify my figures when I’ve said several times check out “entitledto” and “gov.uk”

Sweetie the child neglect disgrace is nothing to do with the poverty line, that is set an arbitrary 60% of median income, by that definition all single parent families on benefit are below that line and a lot of two parent families as well.
That amounts to around £1300 per month and if ALL families received what they were entitled to they have a basic but tough life. It's those that don't that are the problem, the parent has lost control and nobody is supporting her, in this area you see mums taking kids to school all reasonably dressed.
However I did have to visit a neighboring large town back in June, it was 8.30 am and shocking, children were very badly dressed and the mothers worse!, many had put a coat on over pyjamas and some had a dressing gown on, their plight was nothing to do with entitlement there were many other problems.

Here is the text of Philip Ashton's report to the UN. Read it and weep all those who are poverty deniers.

www.ohchr.org/Documents/Issues/Poverty/EOM_GB_16Nov2018.pdf

I much prefer it to car......I think the key word there is prefer.

Thank you for the link Granny23 I shall read it in the next few days although I suspect it won’t say anything much we don’t already know ourselves.

I would criticize that report because nobody is going to react to a report that says 50% of children are below the poverty line, most don't agree with a poverty line set at £16000 a year, so nothing will be done. It also highlights 1.5m destitute and there are a lot of families that are just that, something should be done about it because that is the root of a great many social problems, if activists concentrated on the worst deprivation and moved upwards it would change. But of course that means tacking the hardest problems first and that is not going to look good in the statistics.

David, ‘activists’ and experts are totally ignored by our government. That goes for any area of policy in our public services. That’s the major problem, not what may look good in statistics

Maybe our attitudes towards those on poverty need to change. I know people who think that those who go to foodbanks are ‘on the fiddle’!
I agree that there is a lot of poverty and we expect the government to fix it. We don’t want to pay any more taxes though do we? We don’t trust the various departments to to the job properly.
So what do we do then. Is it up to us?
Probably but until we are genuinely concerned about it we’ll all carry on as we are.
I am quite aware that many on here do a lot of charity work and donate to various groups as individuals but there has to be a huge change in attitude across the country before much will change.
Any good ideas on how to get the ball rolling?

I agree PamelaJ1 and sadly it’s often those with the least to give that seem to give the most . There are a huge amount of people who think “I’m alright Jack” .

People think that anyone can just walk into a food bank when in fact you have to be referred, so no one can be accused of scrounging . It’s just a shame they have to exist at all .

In order to make change you have to care and you have to have empathy.

Lots of people prefer to hide behind their walls and believe they are superior.

To walk in the shoes of a struggling single parent for a month, or a even a dual parent family on zero hours, would change the attitudes of those who assume they know the facts but who really know nothing

Marthjolly, well said.
I discovered that our local food bank were desperate for nappies and sanitary products. That is shameful in this day and age, that people have to go to foodbanks to ask for them.

Heating or food? Myself or the children? These are the " choices" people face.

I am curious about why some people are stuck with being poor and some are not. I’m not talking about people with chronic illness or disability, but just ordinary families. If I look at my own family history, a few generations ago on my mother’s side the children were working in the cotton mills from the age of ten or so. Then as time went on, the family rose higher up the social scale by means of education, and are now distinctly middle class, if not rich. Can people now not take the same route? Do some people just accept that being poor is their lot in life, and not try to change the situation? Is it really impossible for some people to ‘better themselves’?

These are genuine questions. I am not criticising anyone. I just wonder if there is something about society now that means people try less hard than they once did.

As I have said before, I was brought up in a very poor home, mainly due to my father's chronic ill health.
This is certainly not a poor me story, it's to illustrate why I am passionate about education and supporting those living in poverty. My childhood has made me a very resilient person.
I was determined to make a better life for myself . I got a Saturday job at 14, was paid 12/6 for the day. I got home, my mother took EVERY penny off me, I got nothing, I worked over the summer holidays, my mother took all my wages, gave me back my bus fairs.
When I was 17, I was accepted for university, my mother's words were not words of joy, instead she said: Put that stupid idea out of your head, people like us, don't go to university.
I decided I was going regardless. I got a very small grant, as my father was on invalidity benefit, so the state was already "supporting" us. My mother took most of that, said it was to pay for my keep.
I got a job in a working man's club as a barmaid, worked every weekend and often during the week. It was a hard time, trying to study and work at the same time.
When I was at university, I should have spent a year abroad as part of my degree, I didn't go, as there was no money to support a year abroad. I was too ashamed to tell anyone this, just changed subjects.
I eventually got my degree, met my husband and got married, without any help from my parents.
Despite bouts of chronic illness, I did a teaching post grad, followed by another degree and became a teacher.
I was always telling my pupils that education is the way out of poverty. It's not easy, can take years, but it will be worth it.
I wonder if nowadays, some people are so beaten by living in poverty that they have given up hope.

That’s very interesting, Marydoll. Thank you. Determination can get you a long way.

Marydoll thanks for your post about your life and it does reveal the answer to much of what Grandma70s asked. Why there is now so little movement and some are stuck in poverty.
A Saturday job at 14 is rare occurrence these days. Even at 16 children from poor homes are competing with their better off associates for such jobs They may not be as well dressed, will not have the polished, printed CV, or references from the well-connected. They have probably attended a school where staff and resources were stretched and will not have such good qualifications.
If they do have great qualifications they may not go to university because of the debt they will incur. If they don't go they are probably stuck in the trap of low paid jobs in the service sector. No manufacturing jobs now.
They will not, as their parents and grandarents did, qualify for social housing, because there isn't any. They will be reliant on private housing and rising rents.
Education may be the way out of povery but it is now a way blocked and obstructed on every inch and very few manage to find their way through.

Grandma70s - a few people have hinted that the introduction of the welfare state, care from cradle to grave, has reduced people's motivation to strive. I'm not saying I agree, but it's a valid point.
Another result has been the reduction of voluntary charity organisations - I think they've lost govt. support in recent years in things like grants and tax allowances. We've become more dependent on the govt. for help.

ps and this govt. doesn't want to help.

We don’t want to pay any more taxes though do we?
I think we should.

If we want decent services we have to pay for them.

Can people now not take the same route? Do some people just accept that being poor is their lot in life, and not try to change the situation? Is it really impossible for some people to ‘better themselves’?
I'm not sure that it is as simple as that, Grandma70s

Yes, some people do have the intelligence, the ambition and determination to make a better life for themselves, see the opportunities and seize them.
However, not everyone has these attributes, sometimes they may have one without the other.
There is also lack of opportunity and the fact that education may be patchy - some pupils are so disruptive that those who want to learn may find it difficult unfortunately.
trisher has already said what I was going to post about further education, higher education etc.

Added to which, perhaps parents are ground down with managing day-to-day, their expectations are low and they may have passed this attitude on to their children. It takes a child with a strong personality and determination to break out of their norm - some do and achieve well, many do not.

trisher the biggest obstacle to social change is the way we have made having a degree the only way into almost every profession, including nursing.

50 years ago when I started work, you could get into every profession including law and finance, without a degree. Your training would be longer, there would be more exams to pass. But you could get there.

I had a friend who dropped out of school after O levels. and at 20 decided to become a solicitor. She signed and apprenticeship (or articles, as it was called then) for 5 years and was paid through out her training. She studied through day release and short courses and at 25 became a solicitor. She had a very successful career and retired as a judge,

Nowadays she would have to go back to college,probably full time, to get three good A levels, go to university for three years then do three years work experience. She would have been unable to work for three years, and have £50,000 of debt. She would also be 27 before she qualified.

I think we should fray the skirts of the professions, have more ways into them that do not require degrees. Make it easier for children from disadvantaged homes, who are determined and hard working, to know that these professions are open to them at a price they can afford - low wages for a few years, but no debt.