Child Poverty

trisher the biggest obstacle to social change is the way we have made having a degree the only way into almost every profession, including nursing.

That's a good point M0nica, especially for professions like nursing where some may need a degree or more, but others may make excellent nurses but cannot afford, or do not want, to go through the university entry. The only alternative seems to be healthcare assistant, whereas years ago SEN was a good route in.

There are apprenticeships into the professions these days but they are few and far between - one of my family is doing one but only 2 out of 400 applicants were taken on that year by the firm.

Grandma70s I did go to a good primary school (I was Dux) and went on to a superb Secondary, a selective Academy. There I was often 'top of the year' but no one (except my female French Teacher) raised an eyebrow when I left at 15 to go to work, just a month before the O level exams. I left because, simultaneously, my DM stopped work due to ill health and my DF, who was a shift worker was relocated to a new power station which could not be reached via public transport and too far away for him to cycle.. Hence he had to have a car. It may seem ludicrous that, in effect I left school to earn £5.00 a week so that my father could buy an old car but that was necessary for the family finances.
from my big Sister until we mastered my GM's old singer sewing machine and made our own.

I went to night school to catch up on my lost qualifications, was rapidly promoted at work and when I left to have my 1st baby I was earning the same as my DH. No maternity leave, no pension rights, our income was halved at a stroke.

Not so my 1.5yr older sister who was allowed to stay at school to sit her highers, went straight into a 'career' in the Civil Service, had maternity leave with pay and rose through the ranks, eventually retiring at 55 with a large index linked pension. She is indisputably Middle Class whereas I and my DH, having both worked 2 jobs for most of our working lives survive on a less than full state pension and miniscule self funded private pensions.

It is 'circumstances' that determine our progress (or downward slide) through life. Some get an easy ride, some work hard to stand still and anyone can be hit by an accident, illness, disability, redundancy, or caring responsibilities which destroys their aspirations/expectations

oldbatty, of course you do need to care and have compassion but it’s more than that.
If I donate to the food bank, or donate toys at Christmas I’m helping with their immediate problem but not really helping them to get on in life.
I couldn’t offer some childcare to help them go to work because of all the red tape, or find a few hours a week cleaning or gardening without impacting on their benefits .
I can’t really see how anything that I may be able to offer would be viable.
Maybe you have some ideas?

Actually you can now progress from healthcare assistant qualified nurse www.rcn.org.uk/professional-development/your-career/hca/career-paths-for-hcas
You can also do on the job training for teaching through the teaching assistant route.
I believe the legal system has legal associates and para-legals who can go on to have more qualifications.
So there are routes and possibly more than there ever were. The problem is middle class children take them up.

I completely agree with PamelaJ1, attitudes to poverty do need to change. I started working at our local food bank earlier this year and am appalled at the level of poverty in the town. It’s not a comfortable subject and too often overlooked by those not affected. One of the food bank staff was invited to give a talk at the local Rotary Club and one of the Rotarian’s (if that’s the right word) wives said: “ Are you telling me there are people in our town who cannot afford to feed their children ? I don’t believe you”.

At the food bank, I have met people who no fault of their own, maybe illness, job loss, greedy landlords increasing the rent, bereavement for example, have to resort to the food bank. They don’t want to be there, but have no option and they are all struggling to improve their situations, but it’s not helped by pretending poverty doesn’t exist.

Granny 23, what an interesting account you give. I understand the context too , having spent time in Scotland as a child.

Pamela, you make excellent points.....and sadly I have no answers. Maybe something like Homestart may suit you? It does appear as though common sense has left the building though. It would be nice to offer practical help. Some places have a skill swap scheme?

What is home start oldbatty?

Sorry, not being rude Pamela but have a google. It might be something worth a look.

Sorry oldbatty, it often irritates me when people ask ‘ where can I get that?’ I always think why don’t they njust google it??
Anyway I have done now and got the details so I’ll give them a ring in the New Year and have a chat. I do go away or visit my DD in Aus for quite a long stretch every year but they may be able to accommodate that.

Great news.

I agree with those who say that circumstances have gotten in their way and prevented them from climbing “the ladder of success”.

I was s high school girl, passed my 11+ (hard to believe I know) . At school I was like a fish out of water coming from rough council estate as I did . I left school with 6 decent o levels and took the first job offered to me ( there would have been no question of college unlike my sister years later who got to do what she wanted) which was in a large office of s supermarket chain. Pregnant at 18, a single parent, working full time, robbing Peter to pay Paul and very, very lonely pretty much summed things up for me for many years to follow . There would have been no question of me getting back into education as “ I had made my bed and had better lie in it” . I would have dearly loved to go into a caring profession, nursing or maybe social work but sadly it wasn’t to be . In later years I became a young widow with 2 small children . It was as though every step on the ladder was heavily greased to prevent me from moving up, even by one rung .

What is the term child poverty actually mean. Surely the parents must be living innooverty too . If parents, single or otherwise are living ok with plenty to eat etc and their children are starving or poorly dressed then it would be called child neglect. I'm puzzled. I do know though that when people get benefits the do spend it on lots of food as they get their money in their hand, it gives people the impression that they have loads to spend but the huge full shopping trolley might have to last a month or so. I used to think that they did well. My work has taught me otherwise.

Almost always (except in certain tragic circumstances ) the parents are living in poverty too ethelbags . Most decent parents would give anything to their child before themselves. It upsets me that people think we have all had the same chances in life and that somehow it is “someone’s” fault that they haven’t risen, like a phoenix from the ashes.

I have read all seven pages of posts and am heartened by the understanding and compassion shown by most posters.

I have been a social worker, a teacher, a chaplain and am currently leading a homelessness project, so my experience of the subject is extensive both personally and professionally. I liaise closely with our local food bank and with other charitable organisations and I often attend multi-agency meetings; we share a collective view, evidenced by our own experience, that for many people there is extensive, under-reported, grinding poverty. I visited our local food bank on Friday and it is currently supporting 53 people - every one of whom has to be referred by someone in a position of authority (council/GP/jobcentre) and who has knowledge of the client's financial circumstances. I know, to the penny, how much each of my own clients receive in either wages or benefits and can state categorically that most of them cannot afford to live on their income without additional help.

Could you honestly live on £73.10 a week? Many of my clients have to. So no TV (or licence), no washing machine, no cooker (just two electric rings). Water rates, gas, electricity, council tax top-up, clothing, phone, bus fares (monthly to the jobcentre and the GP surgery) and food all has to be covered by that £73.10. If furniture needs to be replaced it comes from a charity, but still needs to be paid for. A phone is a necessity as text message is the medium used by the jobcentre and DWP to contact clients.

I could talk about the bedroom tax, 'sanctions' for not meeting targets or missing appointments, the pressures of having a zero hours contract, the debt accrued in moving from ESA to UC, the difficulties of being computer illiterate when the only way of accessing UC is through the use of technology, but there are also many other reasons why people struggle to put food on the table and survive. Many people find it hard to believe or understand, but it is the 'working poor' who are often those most in need of foodbank help. And that is a national disgrace.

One of our extended family members is dodging eviction because of arrears built up as he couldn't afford the bedroom tax. He's lived in his flat for almost 30 years, still has his now adult children to stay regularly. He moved from the £73.10 a week to slightly less income because the pressure to apply for work, he'd no chance of being offered, was making him ill. He's now self employed, as are so many other people who help 'reduce' the unemployment figures.
It is as others have said, a national disgrace.

But there are plenty of people who don't agree and think we are all doing very nicely thank you and "they" are scroungers.

Grannyactivist, can I ask please how do you prevent yourself from becoming overwhelmed?

It is those who are in work who are the poorest and who have to survive adhering to a budget. Those on benefits have full housing allowance so don't have the worry of rent or council tax just their heating and water as bills go. While workers have to pay housing costs be it a mortgage or rent so it's tough out there for those who have families to upkeep.
Also can't those on benefits get loans ? I know also that certain items of furniture are provided-----beds/cupboard/wardrobe ? Even televisions in some cases.
Ironically it's indirectly the workers who contribute toward this through taxes.

I was thinking about progress through education and the real limits that are placed on this by poor nutrition in early childhood. My niece who lives in the states had 2 babies with problems who were provided with food supplements until they were quite old. They were routinely weighed and measured beause the medics feared that undernourishment would affect their brain development. I wonder how many children in poverty would prove under nourished and if providing supplements should be introduced here?

No items of furniture are provided, as far as I'm aware, and loans need to be paid back, albeit at a small amount.
A small amount of an already small budget..

And those on benefits do have to pay towards rent and council tax.
The interest on mortgages is paid, but only after 3 months.

It obviously depends on which area you live and the council who also oversees it MissAdventure.

That isn't actually a lot - when rent can and does cost around £900 per month! My newly single daughter earns about £700, gets £230 from her ex plus universal credit - which is always wrong - ofen stopped and then she has to pay it back through no fault of her own as she gives them absolutely every bit of information they ask for. Her rent is £890 p/m, plus council tax, plus heating, plus childcare, plus transport to work and parking when she gets there. She frequently has an empty cupboard and worries about affording petrol for work.

Sweetie - you may well look up 'entitled to' on the Gov site - but I can assure you that what it says and what you get are vastly different!

I don't believe it does vary depending on the council, sweetie, but I may be wrong.

Rent and Council tax used to be paid in toto until a few years ago, when the rules were changed and now most people must pay part of it www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/help-if-on-a-low-income/help-with-your-council-tax-council-tax-reduction/council-tax-reduction-what-you-need-to-know/. gives all the details.

Some furniture is sometimes provided, if a family has no furniture at all, or very little. It will be sourced through a charity and will almost certainly be second hand and will be sufficient to meet basic needs for a bed and chair per person and a table, plus a few armchairs.

Why are so many posters determined to prove, one way or another that all those on low incomes are really not as poor as they claim and are just milking the system and have got a cushy number?