Leavers referendum

Would remainers be content with another vote if leave won...again or would the margin be contested and shouts of 'foul' turn the air blue?
We aren't going to be goaded on this. We had a vote. Leave won no matter the margin. Now bite the bullet.

Nandalot

There is no solution to please everyone, simply because there is no will to meet halfway.
Neither North nor South will give ground. The pot is forever simmering.
Peace?
Nonsense.

GG54. This remainer would be content IF there was a prescribed 60/40% margin. There should have been one last time, but DC failed to run it professionally.

Anyone else think it's strange that "16-year-olds should have the vote as they're quite old enough to know what it's all about", whereas Shamima Begum, who was nearly 16 when she decided to leave and join ISIS, was "only a child"

Yes notgoneyet I do think it’s strange, but not surprising.
People use the age thing to reinforce their own point of view.
It was used quite cynically in Scotland, so that 16 year olds could vote ( or not as it turned out) to try and swing it for Scottish independence.

Indeed, not at all surprising lemongrove - I have to admit to being a tad sarcastic lol

notgoneyet there is only a conflict there if you think that an election will not be properly regulated and the methods used by some campaigners might be similar to those used to groom and recruit children, be it for sexual exploitation, terrorist activities, or political support. If there are rules that are not only applied but rigorously enforced then there is no reason why a 16 year old shouldn't be able to come to a reasonable decision.
Of course if you think that one or more parties in the Brexit campaign might, or have, used illegal and unacceptable methods to persuade voters then undoubtedly 16 year olds should not be allowed to vote, as they are probably more susceptible that some sections of the public. But if that is the case should the result be accepted anyway?

If we Remain, I cannot see that the EU will let us do that without joining the Euro.
I wonder how many people insisting we stay have thought through the implication of that and if they have watched the way the ECB works (which makes J.P. Morgan look like a model of financial propriety).
People keep saying 'we know so much more though' but if you ask these questions, you get no answers so I doubt that many people do know much more, especially about the other side's views.

If we unilaterally revoke Article 50 before leaving we remain members of the EU on the same advantageous terms we now enjoy, which includes not being in Schengen or the EUro and having a rebate .

Jaycee5 I believe you are wrong; as varian says, revoking Article 50 would simply mean we revert to the previous status quo.

There is no mechanism in the Treaty of Rome (as amended) for any existing Member State to be compelled to join the Euro.

humptydumpty We cannot unilaterally revoke Article 50 and then consider ourselves back in the EU. They have made that clear.

muffinthemoo Of course they cannot compel us, but we are asking to Remain as a member and they have to agree to that. There will be terms and it is likely that that will be one of them.

varian That is not what EU spokespeople have said. We started the process. We cannot unilaterally just decide we are going back. They have to agree and there will be terms.

People keep saying that we should have a referendum because 'we know more know'.

If people think that Remaining is a unilateral decision and we can just walk back in, then clearly that is not true.

Check the facts Jaycee.

Lord Kerr, Author of Article 50 has clearly stated that we can revoke it at any time as long as we have not left. This was confirmed by the ECJ.

European Court of Justice rules UK can unilaterally revoke Article 50 and halt Brexit

news.sky.com/story/european-court-of-justice-rules-uk-can-unilaterally-revoke-article-50-and-halt-brexit-11576865

On 4 December 2018, the ECJ’s Advocate General gave his opinion that Article 50 is revocable and consequently that the UK could change its mind before any Exit Day. The ECJ agreed with the Advocate General in its ruling, interpreting Article 50 in accordance with the wider EU treaties and their purpose, the origin of Article 50, settled case law, and by analogy to the principles of public international law. It held that revocation, like notification, is an act of state sovereignty and must be possible because no member state can be ejected from the EU against its will.

The ECJ noted that the conditions on any revocation would be the same as those stated in Article 50 for the original notification. First, the decision must be taken in accordance with the member state’s constitutional requirements. Secondly, the decision must be notified to the Council in writing thereafter.

ukandeu.ac.uk/revoking-article-50-after-the-ecjs-ruling/

There seems to be some confusion. There is no scope whatsoever to renegotiate our Treaty obligations of Article 50 is revoked.

There is no mechanism whatsoever to change the terms of our existing EU membership if we do not exit the EU.

There is no way to "impose terms" on us. Nothing would change. There is no mechanism for anything to change.

Brexit latest news: Michel Barnier tells Theresa May she must choose between long and short extension but warns there is no guarantee

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/03/19/brexit-latest-news-theresa-may-could-defy-john-bercows-ruling/

We cannot unilaterally extend Article 50. Any extension beyond 29 March would require permission of all other 27 EU member countries and would have to be justified. They might, for instance, allow an extension for a People's Vote or a General Election, but not just because our government doesn't know what it's doing.

On the other hand we can unilaterally Revoke Article 50 at any time before we leave and we would remain EU members on our current terms.

varian It is not that clear. This fact checks the Independent's claim.

fullfact.org/europe/can-uk-change-mind-leaving-eu-brexit/

Why assume that other people haven't done research.

The referendum was a binary choice - Leave or Remain. The country voted Leave and the politicians told us they respected the decision and both major Parties put Brexit in their manifestos, and agreed that Article 50, to trigger leaving, should be signed, and 29.3.19 was taken as the official Leaving day. So that ship has sailed. Given all that agreement any future Referendum or People’s Vote cannot logically have Remain on the ballot, it can now only be “how” do we leave, not “if”.

Remain must be an option on a second referendum as otherwise there would be no point. The last one wasn’t clear on what leaving meant, the margin was not statistically significant. There are a sizeable % of the population who don’t want to be dragged into this mess and who have no confidence in our politicians. People go on about about respecting the referendum as if that meant something. I don’t respect lies and the bullying. Laws can change, that’s what parliaments do.

Out of date opinions are not facts, Jaycee, as you would know if you had done proper research.

The fullfact link you have posted dates from August 2016 when the question of our unilaterally revoking Article 50 was still unclear. All that changed when the ECJ made its ruling in December 2018.

ukandeu.ac.uk/revoking-article-50-after-the-ecjs-ruling/

There is a Peoples Vote March taking place this Saturday 23rd starting at 12pm assemble in Park Lane prior to marching to Parliament start is just north of Hilton Hotel.

For those interested.
Mick

The former prime minister Tony Blair has renewed his call for another referendum - if there is no parliamentary majority for any one Brexit outcome. ... However, the prime minister has ruled out the prospect of another public vote. Mrs May has repeatedly told MPs that the 2016 referendum result "should be respected"

Democracy did not stop in 2016

Exactly Hollycat ??

Nigel's pathetic march is an apt analogy for the whole brexit fiasco. James O'Brien feels sorry for these poor exploited marchers.

www.indy100.com/article/brexit-nigel-farage-leave-march-james-obrien-8830216