Robbie Williams and surrogacy

Yes maddy the pain of infertility is heartbreaking, the hope
the IVF will work this time, it doesn’t, the joy when it is successful followed by the pain of miscarriages, the acceptance
there will never be a much longed for child.

That’s the point of an abortion. There is no baby

As I’ve said. Newborns being removed from their mother have been shown to exhibit trauma similar to that of an adopted child.
It’s selfish. Pure selfishness.
Nobody is entitled to children. Just because you can doesn’t mean you should.

And ‘reasonable expenses’ can hit £15K. How many here had a pregnancy that cost that much?
And that it’s they’re in the UK. In other countries like America it’s just seen as a financial transaction.

Some countries have banned the practice outright and I would very much support the UK following that.

So adoption is damaging for the child ?

Of course it bloody is!
Anyone who goes through adoption is drilled, educated and flooded with information about how damaging adoption is for children. But it’s a necessity. There is no other reasonable option.

I have a son who adopted a child and as I know the circumstances, no one is going to tell me that our grandchild would have been better off with his natural mother.
I also have a daughter who has three children via IVF. She also had failed IVF rounds. We could afford to pay, not everyone can. The pain of infertility is real, and I’m not sure those who have not experienced it, or watched a beloved child go through it, I’m not sure they can understand.

Babbity, no one would pretend that adoption is the ideal, but it is far less damaging than being left with a parent who cannot stop damaging the child. Once adopted the healing can begin.

My younger daughter had 12 rounds of IVF, 3 miscarriages . H

If adoption is so damaging to a child I should be relieved she didn’t adopt , I am not ,i so wish she had

Excuse me, but in the original case, there was no infertility and no adoption. I don't believe anybody is minimising the heart ache or complexity of these situations. I object to wealthy, influential people buying babies.

It's simply the natural result of a capitalist society. No different to a woman selling sex or drug companies charging a fortune for drugs. Everything has a price. And just as rich people can pay to have their houses cleaned and their children schooled, they can pay for babies. No doubt as with everything else there will be incredibly successful surrogacy and absolute failures and most will be somewhere in between.

Yes of course, the OP was about surrogacy, and in fact, Robbie Williams and his wife already had two children. Were the surrogate children theirs genetically? Does that make a difference?

But they did deal with infertility? That’s why they’ve used a surrogate.

Maddy, from what I’ve read the children born by surrogate are the couples biological children

Exactly. I never said they should be left in the situations they were originally in. That’s why I said there was no other option. But that doesn’t make the effects any less damaging.

Did we buy babies because we (and the other grandparents) paid for our children’s IVF? It wasn’t available to them on the NHS unless they had three miscarriages which is difficult if you’re not getting pregnant.

Thanks Summerlove, does that make a difference at all? I think it does to me because the babies are theirs.

Annie, twelve rounds of IVF equals unbearable pain for the couple and their parents. Plus three miscarriages. What awful pain you must have all suffered. So sorry.

Ayda was unable to have any more children after her second.

I understand that the two babies were carried by the same surrogate, using Robbies sperm and Aydas eggs.

Surrogacy has been around for years, I hope they will be a very happy family unit.

maddy funding IVF is not buying babies at all. Using another woman’s uterus to grow your own is imo and it commodifies women ( and the babies). I’ve got s vague idea that surrogacy is growing using poorer vulnerable women - I’ll see if I can find a link.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/health-47826356

Reading this should give people food for thought

I still don't understand why you think adoption is traumatic Bibbity

They seem like a lovely family to me, and it's their business what they do. The surrogate would not have been forced into it, and was no doubt well rewarded.
I was adopted, and have adopted grandchildren. It often works out well.

You can’t equate surrogacy with adoption and I wouldn’t want RW with his infantile filthy ‘humour’ near any children I know. We have no idea what sort of family they are except that they are very rich

maddy yes it was heartbreaking, but I think the hardest was
after an IVF success, and twins, she telephoned me one morning , said ‘I’m bleeding, raced to the clinic, scans etc, one
baby still there, ten days later she lost that baby two.

For those who speak of wanting a child as ‘entitlement’ ,
my younger daughter did one pregnancy test it was Mothering
Sunday, test positive . She miscarried again. She said ‘I was
a mother that Mothering Sunday .

To all , stop judging women who long for a child, it isn’t an
entitlement to them,

Thank you for that link suziewoozie
Definitely food for thought.
IMO surrogacy is morally wrong but then I have never had the pain
of infertility so it does kind of skew my judgement

Stealing a loaf of bread is morally wrong, sod morals if your
starving.