Hurtful comments to childless people

My older son doesn’t have children. He married a lady who was divorced and had already had children. She had been sterilised after her second was born. He’s very happy without children. He loves his niece and nephews. My second son has one child, adopted. My daughter has twins and then another. She had IVF in order to have her family. So we don’t follow the norm as a family do we? We also have the advantage of having my daughter in law’s daughter and husband and their child as part of our extended family. Everyone is loved, that’s what matters.

I'm an inveterate knitter maddyone! Lace, fair isle, you name it. No baby clothes, though!

Well I’m impressed volver. I can just about manage knit one, pearl one. I did help my seven year old granddaughter to knit a little scarf for her Mima (Jemima Puddleduck, which we gave to her the day she was born.) She did some of it on her own and I just about managed to pick the various stitches she dropped. She completed it whilst the family were living with us for a couple of months before they went to New Zealand for two years.

Vintagejazz I was just telling my experience - not being unfair to anyone with a different experience. In fact, I did comment that looking after toddlers and elderly relatives are BOTH exhausting. How much fairer can I be?

I totally accept that elegran.

I just realised, from talking to my sister, the depth of sorrow and real grief that people who are involuntarily childless feel.
It seems to be a bereavement that's overlooked in our society and I think people should recognise and respect it.

maddyone

My older son doesn’t have children. He married a lady who was divorced and had already had children. She had been sterilised after her second was born. He’s very happy without children. He loves his niece and nephews. My second son has one child, adopted. My daughter has twins and then another. She had IVF in order to have her family. So we don’t follow the norm as a family do we? We also have the advantage of having my daughter in law’s daughter and husband and their child as part of our extended family. Everyone is loved, that’s what matters.

It's not what matters to someone who is desperate to have their own child and has to put up with thoughtless comments from people we have not been through that heartbreaking experienced.

Neither Mr C or I wanted children and all our lives we have faced the following comments: -

Teens - You'll want children when the right man comes
along.
20s - When are you going to have children? It's selfish not
to have them you know.
30s - Don't leave it too late now.
40s - Don't your parents mind not having grandchildren?
Who will look after you when you get old?
50s - Do you regret not having children?

I can only imagine how much all those comments would hurt someone who was desperate for children but unable to have them.

M0nica

Lots of people, probably all of us, have at sometime unintentionally made a hurtful remark to someone.

Yes, this remark was thoughtless, but there are plenty more thoughtless remarks made to people that are far more hurtful than this.

How do you know how hurtful it was?

Vintagejazz
You seem rather sanctimonious to me, and you evidently didn’t read my post, or understand the situation underneath it. One of my sons adopted his child. He didn’t have one naturally. My daughter had several rounds of IVF in order to create her family. She also had several miscarriages. One was on Christmas Day, only a week after she had joyfully told us she was expecting her first child, our first grandchild. I was the one mopping up her tears on Christmas Day that year. She never conceived naturally again. We went through the rounds of IVF with her, taking care of her when she was in agonising pain following over stimulation. We were there when she lost her twins to miscarriage. What do you know that you feel you can correct me. If you’d read my post you would have understood.
Lastly my other son has no children. And so we as grandparents didn’t have a single grandchild via the normal route. But we have four beautiful and much loved grandchildren who came via other routes. You question other people without knowing what pain and heartache they may have witnessed or experienced.

maddyone I see nothing 'sanctimonious' in Vintagejazz's comments. Her response to your post at 18.24 refers I think to the sentence
Everyone is loved, that's what matters.
You clearly have a wide experience within your family of the heartbreak of infertility.
We are going through something similar with one of my adult children and it is utterly heartbreaking. She is absolutely loved, but that matters not one jot in the context of the grief she is experiencing that her life can't be the way she had wanted it to be. It is so easy to say the wrong thing even when I'm trying very hard not to. People don't always engage their brain before they make comments like those the OP is referring to.

I don’t have children and I can’t knit.
Dammit!

Coastpath

Neither Mr C or I wanted children and all our lives we have faced the following comments: -

Teens - You'll want children when the right man comes
along.
20s - When are you going to have children? It's selfish not
to have them you know.
30s - Don't leave it too late now.
40s - Don't your parents mind not having grandchildren?
Who will look after you when you get old?
50s - Do you regret not having children?

I can only imagine how much all those comments would hurt someone who was desperate for children but unable to have them.

I can certainly relate to those comments having received similar - also the really unpleasant ones of "whose fault is it?" and "you must be a disappointment to your parents"

Well said, elegran

People need to stop being so touchy with all these assumptions that offence is meant. We need to be able to speak freely. Most of what is complained about is just blether, light-hearted blether, taking part in conversation.

As some other GNera say, Let it go!

I don't think my colleague thought any offence was meant. It didn't make her feel less hurt though.

I agree that offense can be taken very easily in society nowadays, but I also think there are lots of Situations where we have to be sensitive to someone's circumstances.

I think most people are sensitive to other people's problem, but none of us is perfect and all of us will sometimes say something hurtful without meaning it. I have done it and I have been on the receiving end of remarks that could have been hurtful if meant deliberately, but I can see were said without thinking.

OP you have probably been guilty as charged sometime in your life, even though the other person said nothing and you did not realise it.

JaneJudge

I think it is harder to look after an elderly parent with health issues than a toddler to be honest.

I do agree, especially if dementia is involved.
You can pick up a bolshie toddler and put it in the bath - a bit difficult to do the same with a mother in her 80s who habitually refuses a shower and hair wash, even though she’s started to smell.

You can also send a toddler to nursery/pre school

Oopsadaisy1

I’m afraid we are all guilty of making a remark that will upset someone, if we know the person well then we won’t make the remark.
However, we can’t feel bad about making a remark if we don’t know everyone’s circumstances.

We complain about children and are unaware that someone can’t have children.
We complain about messy husbands, not realising that someone has lost their husband.
It isn’t intentional I’m sure.

Absolutely agree Oopsadaisy1, making 'small talk' with acquaintances is a minefield.

It was the 'oh that's nothing' part of the OP comment that jarred, rather than a 'me too' comment with empathy.

Tiredness warps all sense of judgement, and carers of all ages need support.

JaneJudge

I think it is harder to look after an elderly parent with health issues than a toddler to be honest.

Having done both, I agree.

When you care for an ageing parent you are not infrequently getting on in years with a few health problems of your own - and certainly less of the energy that made it possible to care for a toddler.

Both are exhausting. But you recuperate more quickly when you are young.

And the important distinction here is that a toddler grows up and out of that exasperating, needy, period, so you know it's a temporary situation. An ageing relative usually declines and you have no idea of what may lie ahead - or for how long it might continue.

A relative went to a wedding where she was asked why she didn't have children! She had just suffered a miscarriage and left the wedding in tears.

Profound Thought

The major difference between coping with non sleeping babies/toddlers and looking after elderly parents/spouses is your own age at the time.

Dickens, I also think watching your own parents decline is also emotionally upsetting and difficult. Watching your children grow is a gift.

I agree. Toddlers bring joy as well as frustration and exhaustion. Watching a parent decline and suffer pain and knowing there's only one way its going to end is heartbreaking as well as stressful and exhausting.

Anyhow, if someone remarks that they're tired because of something going on in their lives it's rude to try and trump them rather than sympathising or saying a kind word.

I dont have children. I never wanted any and planned it that way. I made that decision when I was in my teens.

If anyone has the affrontery to tell me I am "selfish" I just remind them of the extent to which childfree people subsidise families through the taxes they pay.

Single households spend a far higher % of their income on basics but there are very few subs and handouts for us.

We get 25% off council tax. Big deal. All too often the childfree single person is paying 3/4 of what the family of 4 next door pays but using one person's share of the local facilities.