Following on from the 'posh' thread......

oops should have wrote travelled.

Following on from education, when my son graduated, at that time internships , often unpaid, were a way of gaining entry into certain industries. The assumption that somehow that would be sustainable for everyone irrespective of background seemed to exemplify a totally out of touch attitude.

Some years before that his half brother when doing his LLB at the College of Law would often joke "I'm the only one in my year group who went to a comprehensive and doesn't have a trust fund"

I think we still have a class system. sometimes it is not real but in people's imagination. A relation always says my Dh and I went to"'posh schools", we went to Grammar schools and on to further education. They perceive we are better than them. They are never meant to feel it and be talked to and made welcome as everyone else.
We were brought up to know our place in the order and unless you say I am as good as everyone else, we will perpetuate the class system. , old boys network, whatever you want to call it s

Of course we have a class system and that is why the Labour party is trying to bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator, can you not see that?

Feudalism

Nowadays class distinctions are more subtle but there is a definite code which people do understand. Speech can be a giveaway, not so much accent but the every day use of certain words. The area in which people live, the car they drive, their children’s names, breed of dogs owned, cultural activities, and so it goes on and on.
Money is no indicator either, because the nouveau riche can easily be sniffed out by the “upper classes”.
Education can help to bridge the gap, but the British educational system is heavily weighted against children from modest backgrounds.

Oh I thought my relative was posh being a Sir and going shooting at Sandringham every year but I stand corrected. Obviously you have much posher standards.

My husbands birth father and mother were from very poor backgrounds, he worked hard, had a lucky break and made a serious amount of money.
Their closest friends were aristocratic, his titled friend taught him how to “behave in society” he introduced him to his tailor, wine merchant etc, his children all had a public school education.
He was well accepted and we are told was a gentleman.

Their home however was a bastion of bad taste!
Everything was new, expensive and matched too well!

My husbands adoptive parents were from wealthy backgrounds , they paid for a public school education but only just, their friends were not aristocratic but certainly gentry.
They didn’t need lessons, they knew what was expected.
They oozed confidence and class.

Their home was timeless and classic.

I think there will always be for at least a couple of generations a few tell tale signs as to your beginnings.

LadyHonoriaDedlock

Well, if you take two babies born today, one in Middlesbrough and one in Virginia Water, with nothing to distinguish them but accident of birth, the one born in Middlesbrough is much less likely to become a senior medical consultant, a High Court judge or senior barrister, a general or an admiral, editor of a national newspaper, prime minister, a top civil servant, a senior bishop of the Church of England, Director General of the BBC, an ambassador to another country or the CEO of an FT 100 company.

I also suggest that the one born in Virginia Water is unlikely to be encouraged to take up an engineering apprenticeship on leaving school.

I'll leave you to consider your answer to kittylester's question in that context.

No one is born in Virginia Water unless it’s a home birth or unplanned, as there’s no hospital there. Two of my GC lived there until recently. The older one wants to be a builder when he grows up. Some of their neighbours work for the council, some are paid carers, others are beauticians. Newly moved-in neighbours run a restaurant, someone else has a B&B (dogs welcome).

I imagine Middlesborough has a similar range of residents.

Well said merylstreep.👍

usuallyright

Of course we have a class system and that is why the Labour party is trying to bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator, can you not see that?

Wow!

usuallyright

Of course we have a class system and that is why the Labour party is trying to bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator, can you not see that?

What, in particular, makes you think that?

I'm not a Labour party supporter so am not arguing with you from that basis - but it is not my impression. From what I can see, they want a more equitable, fairer society which, in principle, I wouldn't disagree with. That could of course mean that those with the broadest shoulders, economically speaking, bear the greater burden - though I don't believe they intend to divest them of their wealth or status.

I'm genuinely curious.

We have had a lot of builders and other workmen in our house over the last couple of years because we have been building an extension. We have found that quite a number of them have children who have gone to university.

Equally, all of them are well trained in their craft and as a result easily earn as much money as many a university graduate.

I get so bored with this constant negative sterotyping of people who work with their hands. It doesn't follow that they are as thick as two short planks and so are their children because their stupid parents do not encourage them to study and think school is a waste of time and all attend poor schools.

In many parts of the country, solicitors, flooring layers and teachers live side by side. I use that particulae mix because I have spent the afternoon with a friend and those are the occupations of her neighbours. In fact 20 years ago another friend lived in another just such a mixed street, and it would also describe the road my DD lives in.

15 years ago, emptying a relatives house, the guy at the tip stopped me when I was throwing some very old and out of date economics textbooks, because his son was reading economics at Cambridge and he wondered whether any the books would be useful to him. I had to say no, they were only fit for recycling.

Virginia Water is a very small area, with not many houses, much, much smaller than Middlesborough, whoever chose these two would stand on firmer ground were they to choose more comparable communities.

Grantanow

It's not as rigid as it was and perceptions of class vary (clothing has become less of an indicator, for example). Education has provided opportunities for mobility but many can't or don't use it. Aristocrats play down their difference by using family and given names rather than titles but land ownership is a very significant divide between the wealthy and the rest. The immense privileges of the Royals can never be achieved through hard work and ability (unless you marry into them of course). Overall, I think class is alive and well but the Tories and their friends work hard to obscure it.

This, precisely!

I stand corrected then that my relative is not posh at all, even though he goes shooting at Sandringham every year. ☹️

I stand corrected then that my relative is not posh at all, even though he goes shooting at Sandringham every year. ☹️

I think people who go shooting at Sandringham could be posh.

Sirs? No. Not posh at all.

Middlesbrough if I remember rightly is in the top 5 deprived areas in England. I cant remember the life expectancy figures but below average. In general life chances in Middlesborough will not compare favourably to many places.

volver

I think people who go shooting at Sandringham could be posh.

Sirs? No. Not posh at all.

Not posh to shoot at Sandringham either in fact, you can pay to do it. I’m guessing that wouldn’t be with the royals though.

kittylester, the 'class system' is alive and kicking, as ever. It used to be judged by family 'pedigree', occupation of father, where you lived - and lifestyle. Now, I don't think level of education or wealth has much to do with it - although some have an inbuilt family advantage. 'Posh' is still a middle class thing, though - not wanted or needed by others.

In all my working life no one ever asked me who my father was or what he did, or in any detail where I lived

I started work in 1964, most jobs were advertised in newspapers and magazines,or internally and all potential employers were interested in was my education, what exams I had passed, my degree, my experience, my school was a run of the mill grammar school.

I worked with people at all levels from all kinds of backgrounds.In the company I worked in the longest, a large company with 10s of thousands of employees, many of managers had started in the company as apprentices and worked their way up and at one point the Managing Director was someone who had joined the company as a lab assistant as a 16 year old school leaver.

I do not understand this obsession with class. All that matters is income. I am middle income. I am not middle class.

usuallyright

Of course we have a class system and that is why the Labour party is trying to bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator, can you not see that?

'Lowest common denominator' - wow!
For most of my working life, I spoke to people from all walks of life, from lords and ladies to the very poorest members of society. I can honestly say that those at either extreme of the spectrum were generally very nice and friendly, while it was the ones who had come into money by one means or another and subsequently saw themselves as now being 'better' than others who were the least pleasant to deal with.

M0nica In all my working life no one ever asked me who my father was or what he did, or in any detail where I lived

Of course not, it doesn't matter, does it? You accomplished what you desired in your life. Apart from chit chat, none of your list (above) matters.