Is the High Street ever going to recover?

Commercial rates were high, shops closed, council's needed income so raised rates etc. In a way, the bigger stores colluded with the move to online shopping by having a much more limited selection available in store than online which pushed people towards online shopping

I agree with this argument. Greedy landlords with high rents and greedy councils with high business rates have driven all but the charity shops and coffee shops from the city centers. I can recall being in the USA in the 1990s and finding that there were almost no shops in the center of Providence RI and everyone went to huge shopping malls on the outskirts. There was also an efficient bus service to get you there.

The large malls are popular because they contain everything for a complete day out - not only shops but restaurants, cinemas and in some cases gyms and facilities to shower. In the US you can rent a pushchair or leave your kids and or shopping in a playcenter while you browse in peace. Whats not to like?

Whereas in the high street you have to trek from one shop to another and then wait for a bus out in the cold and wet. Or pay high parking charges, again imposed by greedy councils and rapatious parking wardens.

Strangely, I prefer High Streets to shopping centres. I hate shopping centres, all enclosed, air condtioned and over-lit. Give me a real High street anytime. I like real weather, hot and sticky in the summer cold and wet in winter. It makes me part of the real world and reminds me that purchases are the spending of real oney, that I either have or do not have.

I am not a Stepford Wife and I do not want to shop in a Stepford Shopping Centre.

I dislike them too. They seem to be temples of consumerism, and I prefer city centres where people live and work as well as shop.

I'd still rather shop online though, other than on holiday or out for the day, when a poosk through little shops can be enjoyable.

Joseanne

J52

Forsythia

Our local town has seasalt, John Lewis, Jigsaw, Oliver Bonas, Waterstones, FatFace, White Stuff, Boots, various opticians, several jewellers, various other independents. It was bustling when we went there yesterday and the shops were packed.

Sounds like my local town. Is it MH?

And mine. Anywhere with a Molton Brown and L'Occitane en Provence will have me shopping there.

Me too. I love L'occitane which fortunately we have down here on the South Coast. How I wish they'd bring back Amber perfume

We still have a couple of independent shops locally and I try to buy stuff there, but like most people have to catch the bus into the nearby town in between times. However, things often do have a habit of changing (for the better - I like thinking optimistically), and I've seen placards already announcing a new smallish shopping hall (not a mall) opening within walking distance, so am looking forward to supporting this newbie in the New Year. Happy New Year, btw to all you super Gransnet friends!

There was an opportunity from the council some while ago to suggest what shops would we like in our town. I - alongside others - suggest a haberdashery / wool shop and clothes shops which did exist at one point but closed down. Nothing has happened except for an enormous number of flats being built and we're left with cafes, charity shops galore, and many food outlets - and a very nice library. BUT electric scooters are nightmares - no police around and signs painted on the pathways are ignored so now I do my clothes shopping on line along with other bits and pieces. However there is a gleam of light. There is a little Coop shop near my daughter's which is well stocked and has a friendly feel so I go there if necessary.

We live in an urban area and do have shops, including a medium sized Morrisons so we are very lucky. We even have a middle-eastern grocery store which sells very good fruit and vegetables.
I'm going to have a New Year resolution to make more effort to shop locally and only buy heavy things from online supermarkets.
I'm sure that all of us buy more than we need from time to time, particulary pre-packed fruit and vegetables, and that just buying what we need daily is the way to go to preserve our local shops. Perhaps the reduced wastage will actually compensate for the slightly higher cost.
We're also lucky that a new sub post office has opened again locally and though all our banks have closed we do have a cash machine in Morrisons. However a large development company have got hold of the Morrisons site and none of us are sure whether the stock in the promised new supermarket will be too limited to be of any use.

I don't like the huge shopping malls either, though I have one that I can reach by bus. It's such a vast place on many floors, with a long walk if you want to go to John Lewis but enter through the wrong end. I've learnt that I can get a slower bus which actually takes me to the right end of the development so usually go this way.
There don't seem to be any independent shops there and I do find it very difficult to buy clothes now.

biglouis

*Commercial rates were high, shops closed, council's needed income so raised rates etc. In a way, the bigger stores colluded with the move to online shopping by having a much more limited selection available in store than online which pushed people towards online shopping*

I agree with this argument. Greedy landlords with high rents and greedy councils with high business rates have driven all but the charity shops and coffee shops from the city centers. I can recall being in the USA in the 1990s and finding that there were almost no shops in the center of Providence RI and everyone went to huge shopping malls on the outskirts. There was also an efficient bus service to get you there.

The large malls are popular because they contain everything for a complete day out - not only shops but restaurants, cinemas and in some cases gyms and facilities to shower. In the US you can rent a pushchair or leave your kids and or shopping in a playcenter while you browse in peace. Whats not to like?

Whereas in the high street you have to trek from one shop to another and then wait for a bus out in the cold and wet. Or pay high parking charges, again imposed by greedy councils and rapatious parking wardens.

Until recently we lived in a city in the south west and over the past 15 years all the independent shops seem to have closed. This is partly due to competition from chains - we lost our lovely kitchen equipment shop after Lakeland opened - and partly because many of the properties are owned by the council who set very high rents and business rates. Also parking was scarce and expensive.
I'm glad to be living somewhere where it is possible for new businesses to be developed and independent shops can exist.

The thing that matters for me is where the parking is. With mobility problems and even with a blue badge I cannot walk long distances and so prefer to shop locally if I can park close to the shops. I would not try mostof the big shopping malls as there is too much walking from the actual car park or they have no disability scooters which would enable me to get round easily. There is one on the outskirts of York which is well organised and do have scooters and occasionally I do go there but usually shop locally and with farm shops etc can do quite well here . Whilst there is enough variety of shops including the basic bakers and green grocers etc I think that towns could still do well and also these strikes and rail problems have made people realize that if you shop locally you will be guaranteed to get the goods and not be left waiting for a delivery who knows when. High parking charges and having the car parks too far from the shops has harmed the towns for shopping. where they have a disc system or cheap parking for a short time will encourage more people to shop there . Now most of the shopping malls have the same shops in every place there is no incentive to shop there , nothing special about visiting them as it used to be to go to the interesting individual stores .

It gets more and more depressing to visit our Town Centre. Mostly filled with charity shops now, but even Oxfam decamped before Covid.
The rot started about 15 years ago when Marks moved to a shopping site on the edge of town and Woolworth went bankrupt. But now even that site has lost shops. It's hard to believe that there is no longer a Monsoon shop in the whole of South Wales, Cardiff included.
I do not like to shop online for clothes, I like to feel the texture of the material and sizes do vary enormously. It is too much of a faff to have to return them if they are not suitable.
I don't think there is an answer, buying clothes online doesn't seem to bother the younger generation.

The town I live in has a very sad looking building - it used to be Debenhams, and another sad building that used to be the Post Office. We have loads of coffee shops, mainly expensive and restaurants, again mainly expensive. There is talk of turning Debenhams into flats, but don't think it would be viable keeping the building as it is just now. A very sad time,

The only thing that will save the high street is more disposable income.

People can't afford to browse any more. They turn to the Internet for needs more than wants.

I do miss old fashioned department stores. I suspect they're gone forever except as tourist destinations like Harrods.

Apparently more people shopped in shops than online this Christmas due to concern about deliveries being made on time, so that does suggest that online for many is simply more convenient.

We're fortunate that our old Debenham's going to become a cinema Gwenisgreat which will prevent it from turning into an eyesore.

Our Debenhams is going to be converted into apartments.

I had a text from DD2 to say Liberty and Fenwicks in London were heaving this morning. Selfridges was quieter.

Rail strikes would hardly affect sales trips in my youth, we'd get the bus! As we were only going into town(Manchester) from outer Manchester or from Glossop in teens, it was not a big trip. Why does everyone appear to think they're living the dream going off to London for sales? Or to USA? Even worse! These big trips used to be for the rich and famous not us mere hard working types. I reckon we need to press a reset button and take ourselves down a peg or so from the footballers wives levels of voracious greed on earnings of the average worker, ditch the credit/buy now never pay -and -end -up -in -a -mess-for the sake of yet another "leisure wear" outfit or trashy looking designer bag? Our youngsters have been hijacked into meaningless permanent debt by the tiktok/love island/instagrunt companies who see them as fodder for their obscene profits and they all look like inflatable dolls and "Ken" plastic lookalikes. It's a crying shame. They'll find out too late that all that rubbish means nowt against a happy family in a little cosy home with cuddly little ones getting excited about a new doll/truck/teddy/ toolkit to bash mums walls with! Fake everything is just that- Fake. The lost generation of online addicts , I wonder what their old age will look like if they ever get there?

Joseanne

I had a text from DD2 to say Liberty and Fenwicks in London were heaving this morning. Selfridges was quieter.

Sorry, I had the wrong shop in my mind's eye. She said Not other stories which is over the road from Liberty

Lathyrus

Where there does seem to have been an upturn is in the localised smaller shopping centres. Market towns and those edge of the big city roads with small businesses. Places people can walk to or catch a local bus.

Personally I wouldn’t be sad to see the demise of the Shopping malls and their like with the same stuff wherever you go and a return to more individual shopping.

You have buses? Ours are disappearing very quickly. However, I do agree that it is the smaller towns that are benefiting. Sadly, some of these small towns are seeing more chains move in. If that increases footfall for the independent businesses that will be good, but it could put rents up and make it too difficult for them.

The lost generation of online addicts , I wonder what their old age will look like if they ever get there?
Is that where Shop til you drop comes from?!

Well if you shop online you will be able to spend much more time with your family so I am guessing they will be fine.

This was Selfridge’s in Oxford Street yesterday at the Boxing Day Sales. Yikes! Imagine being in that hoard. The member of staff is just waiting for ‘the nod’ to unlock the doors!

I did Selfridges, Oxford Street, one year on Boxing Day Urmstongran. The mad rush went straight for the handbags, and the counters were decimated by lunchtime!

I also hate "The Shopping Mall" as opposed to the high street, I remember being in the States and wanting to have a sustained big shop at such places in order to bag a bargain and after a short period just waning to get the hell out of there, nowadays my worst nightmare would be a day out at say "Westfields" for me that would be akin to descending into Hades

Where I live now, a good sized market town, the high street seems to be alive and kicking and it does have some independents. Sadly I think, unlike mainland Europe, we have emulated the US too much in that our high streets are full of the same nationals and multi nationals, it's rare to find individual butchers/greengrocers these days although delicatessens and cheese shops can still be found in certain towns. Starbucks and the like I avoid like the plague, I like to try out independents when I can

The cost of car parking is extortionate although if I use Sainsburys or John Lewis/Waitrose car parking is free for a couple of hours when spending a tenner so I tend to do that.

Pubs and restaurants have taken a bashing firstly with Covid and now with the ever rising cost of fuel, the closure of those and loss of jobs is a tragedy and I'd hate to think if of any more closures we get hit hard once again with the variant that is presently causing havoc in China!